Ye olde South Afrikan flag: Racist or Not?

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I agree, but that wasn't my point.

The Nazi flag doesn't have anything racist on it in itself. A black Hakenkreuz in a white circle in a red field. What's racist about that?

You agree with me. If the NSDAP hadn't happened, it would just have been another flag.

If the NSDAP hadn't happened, it would'nt have existed.

It was designed by Hitler personally.

The swastika is actually used as a religious symbol by Hindus, Jains and a number of other eastern faiths. It actually never symbolized racism or racial hatred before Hitler came along.

The old South African flag is normally seen to symbolize the racism of Apartheid. In any case, I think I like the new one better:

Yes, but it did.

If Jesus hadn't been crucified, the cross would not be a Christian symbol. If the Russian Revolution had not been happened, the hammer and sickle would not be a communist symbol (same with the red star). Here, in Quebec, we have the red square for the student movement, which would only be a red square without any meaning, but it has meaning which the students have given it.

The meaning of a symbol can change, of course. Beyond the bouddhist meaning, the svastika is a relatively basic geometric pattern which I have seen on Archaic Greek pottery. However, at the moment, it recalls nazism.

In most of the West it does, yes.

But it also has many other meanings, those of which have been held for millennia. So, whilst it is associated (mainly in the West) solely with Nazism, for Hindus, Buddhists and Jains it means something completely different and its use in these religions has gone on for far, far longer than that used by Nazi Germany. I can understand these religions being very upset when people call their holy symbols racist because of a vile political ideology that they had no association with.

Let's just hope that hideous little mustache that Hitler wore doesn't come back in style.Ewww.

The swastika is used on Buddhist temples in Japan and China where it has no racial connotations whatsoever. It was also used as a decorative design on ancient greet pottery.

There was a swastika on the Lutheran church in my mom's hometown

This video may be enlightening:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BFWEtdZ5TWA[/youtube]

Dear Tequila,
What a sad video,at first I thought boys on a camping trip but it turned into a brainwashing bootcamp.When I see things like this I lose faith that humankind will ever learn to celebrate the beauty of diversity.


In my dream of Nazis
A little man with perfect
Black hair jumped off
An old horse to take away
Everything I cared about
And handed me a flag.

Scott Cairns

I really hope those Boers are given an ultimatum by the South African government: Leave, disarm, or be destroyed.


These imbeciles have a sense of entitlement to land they stole from others. The have a homeland, it's called the Netherlands.

My personal favorite among African flags(which for the most part are MUCH prettier than European flags):

[img][800:599]http://unimaps.com/flags-africa/angola-flag.gif[/img]

Bigoted, unthinking tripe. You sound like a member of the BNP.

You do know that the Afrikaners aren't all Dutch? Their descendants are a mixture of people from Western Europe - Dutch, Germans, French, Scots, English and so on. Very few Afrikaners seem to share a bond with the modern-day Netherlands - this is something you wilfully seem not to understand. A lot of white Afrikaners go to Britain or Australia. White South Africans deeply love their country and homeland, and want to coexist peacefully with blacks, but feel threatened by the high crime rate and lack of protection that they had under apartheid. They're still seen as "the evil white man with all the power/money", even though they've lost their status in ZA.

And if you're a white American or have lots of white ancestry, you should go back to England or Germany. Even if you and your ancestors have lived in the U.S. for centuries, don't have family in Europe, don't speak German or French or whatever language. In fact, the U.S. should be handed back to the American Indians and let it be a complete barren landscape. So should Australia as well. And the entire white community, and their intermarried settlers in South America that have been there centuries upsticks and go back. Give Ireland back to "the Irish", ignoring the large amount of intermarriage that has happened during the centuries and the fact that many people in Ulster have switched sides over the centuries. Ulster unionists (note: I didn't say Protestants) should have no say over the future of where they live.

I can understand the worries of the Afrikaners. TBH, I probably would be looking to get out if it's not safe for them to be there. The ANC clearly hate white people and seem to treat the "rainbow nation" barely as window dressing so if I were them I'd take my money and get out of Dodge.

Good point. Their homeland is actually the EUROPEAN UNION.


I must say though, had I been born in South Africa, I'd have left the country long ago out of fear for my own life and strongly urged other white people to do so. That country is a mess and I'm glad I don't live there. That being said, I think that the EU has an OBLIGATION to allow white South Africans asylum since they legitimately are in serious danger.

I feel very sad when I think of what the Native Americans went through and I know for a fact some of my relatives participated,One fought against the Narraganset Indians in King Phillips War.I'm sorry,and ironically I do have some native blood in me.My first ancestor a Buckminster came over as an indentured servant.It must have been very bad to have to leave your home.Most people came here because they were badly treated in their homeland and they came to America and passed the buck.If we could just all be decent and respect each other. I'm a mix of Scot- Irish(ulster Irish),German.French,English,native.But I can't undo the past but I can make damm sure it's not repeated.

It is not their fault, but here, it is still a racist symbol.

As I mentionned it, the svastika (as a shape) can be found on Greek pottery as well. It's just a shape, and a relatively basic one at that. No one has an absolute claim to it. For Hindus, it may mean something, but here, it means something else. Antiquity of tradition does not come into it at all. The shape has both meanings, and all the others it may hold, at the same time, in different contexts.