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Joined: 16 Oct 2009
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06 Dec 2012, 4:20 pm

Sometimes these events in the past have left legacies that continue to affect populations today.

Canada embarked on a program of Residential Schools for First Nations children. Children were forcibly removed from their communities, educated in boarding schools where they were forbidden to maintain their language, and kept from contact with their parents. And when they returned to their communities, they had no concept of how to be a parent, so that when they had children of their own, they had no example to follow. We have created generations of dysfunctional communities because of a misguided policy.

And that doesn't even take into account the myriad cases of abuse, and sexual interference that took place in these schools.

Even before that, we forced First Nations' people into artificial communities by erecting churches, and stores. And many continue to languish in these communities to this day, deprived of any benefit of the vast wealth that exists within (and under) their traditional territories.

To suggest that people aren't affected by events that occurred in the time of their ancestors is, I suggest, to take a very blinkered view of history and its consequences.

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TallyMan
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06 Dec 2012, 5:50 pm

Everyone: Knock off the unpleasantness please. Switch back to the topic of this thread or leave it alone.

The bickering posts have been removed.

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slave
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06 Dec 2012, 5:59 pm

Evinceo wrote:

100 years is nothing, Christians have been hung up on stuff that happened to this one guy for like 2000 years!

NAKnight
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06 Dec 2012, 6:06 pm

slave wrote:

Evinceo wrote:

100 years is nothing, Christians have been hung up on stuff that happened to this one guy for like 2000 years!

Parting the red sea, turning water into wine and walking on water was some pretty wild stuff back then.

Best Regards.

Jake

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Keniichi
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06 Dec 2012, 9:38 pm

hyperlexian wrote:

Keniichi wrote:

Why do some people hang on to the past? Even like events in the past that were over 100 years ago?

For example:
The friend I was referring to in the other post of mine here kept going on and on about blacks and slavery. This friend is also black.

*sigh* slavery ended over 100 years ago, and I know that blacks have fought for their rights, (just like many other non-black people do) but seriously why do so many people(not just my black friend, there are other friends/people that I know in real-life) hang on to a past that they themselves werent involved in, and arent affected by?
(I know some are affected by the past, but not all of the people that Im referring to are, in fact most of the ones Im referring to have a very good life.)

Im not racist either.

because african americans are still treated very badly as a group by default in the western world, and it will take a long time to reverse that. on an individual level they might have a great life, but overall the levels of discrimination against them are very bad. simply stopping slavery doesn't make all that go away.

i think that maybe your friends would be well served by you, if you were to learn a little bit about their current situation. it's pretty nasty for you to dismiss what happened to their own ancestors (something that probably still affects their ethnic group in myriad ways) just because YOU think it is ancient history. maybe listen to what they have to say and try to understand a few things from their perspective.

here is an interesting survey to help you understand just how much privilege you carry around compared to them on a daily basis:

http://www.nymbp.org/reference/WhitePrivilege.pdf

I have sympathy for my friends, I have sympathy for hurting people in general. However I TALKED to my friends and they said that they knew when I first said those things, that I wasnt being offensive, and told me that they just felt like saying that stuff.
Also Im dark skinned so, Im not really white/caucasian. My relatives in the past were Indians, Africans, French, German, Dutch, Mexican,Irish etc.

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06 Dec 2012, 9:52 pm

Black people were slaves owned by other black people long before they were ever slaves owned by white people.

Keniichi
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06 Dec 2012, 9:56 pm

Jitro wrote:

Black people were slaves owned by other black people long before they were ever slaves owned by white people.

Thats true as well.

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Evinceo
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07 Dec 2012, 1:20 am

hyperlexian wrote:

http://www.nymbp.org/reference/WhitePrivilege.pdf

Oh wow, that reminds me, someone must have done a version of that for "NT privilege" right? They must have! That'd be an amusing read.

visagrunt
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07 Dec 2012, 12:55 pm

NAKnight wrote:

Parting the red sea, turning water into wine and walking on water was some pretty wild stuff back then.

Best Regards.

Jake

He only did two of those.

Just because that Charlton Heston movie always comes on TV at Easter doesn't mean that he's playing Jesus.

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07 Dec 2012, 1:00 pm

visagrunt wrote:

NAKnight wrote:

Parting the red sea, turning water into wine and walking on water was some pretty wild stuff back then.

Best Regards.

Jake

He only did two of those.

Just because that Charlton Heston movie always comes on TV at Easter doesn't mean that he's playing Jesus.

All religions are full of such mythology.

Anyway, the claimed "miracles" are no big deal anyway ... I can walk on grapes and turn them into red wine. I can then turn the red wine into water.

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NAKnight
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07 Dec 2012, 4:28 pm

TallyMan wrote:

All religions are full of such mythology.

Anyway, the claimed "miracles" are no big deal anyway ... I can walk on grapes and turn them into red wine. I can then turn the red wine into water.

Were talking 2000+ years ago.
It must've been a pretty big deal because people still talk about it today.

Best Regards,

Jake

NAKnight
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07 Dec 2012, 4:30 pm

visagrunt wrote:

NAKnight wrote:

Parting the red sea, turning water into wine and walking on water was some pretty wild stuff back then.

Best Regards.

Jake

He only did two of those.

Just because that Charlton Heston movie always comes on TV at Easter doesn't mean that he's playing Jesus.

Your right. Moses parted the red sea, with assistance from "God". LET MY PEOPLE GO!
Thanks for the correction.

Best Regards,

Jake

TallyMan
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07 Dec 2012, 4:32 pm

NAKnight wrote:

TallyMan wrote:

All religions are full of such mythology.

Anyway, the claimed "miracles" are no big deal anyway ... I can walk on grapes and turn them into red wine. I can then turn the red wine into water.

Were talking 2000+ years ago.
It must've been a pretty big deal because people still talk about it today.

Best Regards,

Jake

Indian mythology is full of such "pretty big miracles" too, dating further back than 2000 years; similarly with the ancient Greeks. Some of these myths will live on for many thousands of years yet to come. They become part of the folklore of those cultures.

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NAKnight
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07 Dec 2012, 4:42 pm

True, true.

I feel Jesus has more "Street credibility" than Muhammad or Vishnu in my opinion.

Jesus is God with a face, not the fill-in-the-blank variety we conform to our own tastes.
He can't be twisted, distorted, and stuffed in our back pocket.

Many religions have good moral teachings, but any religion that gives temporal benefits without ultimately leading us to the true God is treating the symptom and not the disease.

That's my take on it.

Best Regards,

Jake

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07 Dec 2012, 5:01 pm

NAKnight wrote:

I feel Jesus has more "Street credibility" than Muhammad or Vishnu in my opinion.

None of the so called miracles by any of them has any "street credibility" as far as I can see. Whatever "miracles" happened or didn't happened in the past have left no proof to support the claims of the miracles. All that exists now are unverifiable anecdotal records. If they are anything like the newspaper reports or anecdotal evidence of various believers of various religions today then I put no credence in them. "It's a miracle... boy lives on water only. No food for 6 years"... :lol:

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TallyMan
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07 Dec 2012, 5:19 pm

NAKnight wrote:

Many religions have good moral teachings, but any religion that gives temporal benefits without ultimately leading us to the true God is treating the symptom and not the disease.

All religions are based on beliefs rather than facts, all of them claim theirs is the true belief system and theirs is the true god. They all claim they know in their heart theirs is the true religion. :wink:

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