Atheists face a year in prison for disbelief in U.S state

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BraveMurderDay
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07 Dec 2012, 12:37 pm

Jacoby wrote:
I wish people would read more the thread title and a couple lines of the first post.


Why do you want me to go to prison for not believing in God, you despotic theocrat?



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07 Dec 2012, 1:04 pm

Jacoby wrote:
I wish people would read more the thread title and a couple lines of the first post.


Are you referring to me and my "unenforced law" assessment?

It seems it would be unenforced because it is utterly unenforceable.


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07 Dec 2012, 1:08 pm

Did a bit of digging:

1. http://www.lrc.ky.gov/krs/039a00/285.pdf

"The safety and security of the Commonwealth cannot be achieved apart from reliance upon Almighty God as set forth in the public speeches and proclamations of American Presidents, including Abraham Lincoln's historic March 30, 1863, Presidential Proclamation urging Americans to pray and fast during one of the most dangerous hours in American history, and the text of President John F. Kennedy's November 22, 1963, national security speech which concluded: "For as was written long ago: 'Except the Lord keep the city, the watchman waketh but in vain."

2. http://www.lrc.ky.gov/krs/039g00/010.pdf

"(1) The Kentucky Office of Homeland Security shall be attached to the Office of the Governor and shall be headed by an executive director appointed by the Governor.
(2) The executive director shall:
(a) Publicize the findings of the General Assembly stressing the dependence on Almighty God as being vital to the security of the Commonwealth by including the provisions of KRS 39A.285(3) in its agency training and educational materials. The executive director shall also be responsible for prominently displaying a permanent plaque at the entrance to the state's Emergency Operations Center stating the text of KRS 39A.285(3);"

3. http://www.lrc.ky.gov/krs/039a00/990.PDF

"Any person violating any provision of this chapter or any administrative regulation or order promulgated pursuant to this chapter for which another penalty is not specified shall be guilty of a Class A misdemeanor."

4. http://www.lrc.ky.gov/KRS/532-00/090.PDF

"For a Class A misdemeanor, the term shall not exceed twelve (12) months"

The 1st one is a bit of a *so what?*. It is difficult to prosecute anyone of violating it, because how *does* one violate it?

The 2nd one seems to be in direct violation of article VI in the US constitution, however, as it makes a religious belief mandatory for assuming the office of executive director of The Kentucky Office of Homeland Security.

The 3rd one attaches a sentence equivalent to a class A misdemeanor (and the 4th one defines the maximum sentence) for violating a provision of chapter 39a, but not 39g, so my initial assessment is that it would be quite difficult to convict anyone of violating these provisions.

In other words, more than a "no biggie", but less than a worst case scenario involving the combined powers of all the horsemen of the Scourge.

Would still like to see the 2nd one getting torn apart by the Supreme Court, though.



Last edited by GGPViper on 07 Dec 2012, 1:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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07 Dec 2012, 1:19 pm

PM wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
I wish people would read more the thread title and a couple lines of the first post.


Are you referring to me and my "unenforced law" assessment?

It seems it would be unenforced because it is utterly unenforceable.


The law only applies to executive director of the DHS office in Kentucky, it requires the there to be a plaque outside the building.

It's a ridiculous law but the original post badly misrepresents it



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07 Dec 2012, 1:48 pm

GGPViper wrote:
In other words, more than a "no biggie", but less than a worst case scenario involving the combined powers of all the horsemen of the Scourge.


After reading up on it, that's pretty much my conclusion too.

Sorry for getting it wrong, by the way.



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07 Dec 2012, 1:49 pm

So, this doesn't really have anything to do with a direct attack on Atheism at all. :roll:


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07 Dec 2012, 1:50 pm

MrXxx wrote:
So, this doesn't really have anything to do with a direct attack on Atheism at all. :roll:


It's still a dickish thing to have as a law, though.



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07 Dec 2012, 1:59 pm

MrXxx wrote:
So, this doesn't really have anything to do with a direct attack on Atheism at all. :roll:


Well, that depends.

Do you want to be the executive director of The Kentucky Office of Homeland Security?



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07 Dec 2012, 2:00 pm

Yes it is.


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07 Dec 2012, 2:00 pm

GGPViper wrote:
Do you want to be the executive director of The Kentucky Office of Homeland Security?


I don't know about that. I'm sure you can work in Kentucky Fried Chicken, though?



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07 Dec 2012, 2:03 pm

GGPViper wrote:
MrXxx wrote:
So, this doesn't really have anything to do with a direct attack on Atheism at all. :roll:


Well, that depends.

Do you want to be the executive director of The Kentucky Office of Homeland Security?


Not really relevant to the topic. Is the executive director an atheist? The topic was calling attention to an article claiming the law is an attack on atheists. Apparently that it simply not true at all.

It's a stupid law. No argument here on that. What makes it really stupid is that it would never hold up in court if they tried to enforce it.


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07 Dec 2012, 2:51 pm

GGPViper wrote:
Did a bit of digging:

1. http://www.lrc.ky.gov/krs/039a00/285.pdf

"The safety and security of the Commonwealth cannot be achieved apart from reliance upon Almighty God as set forth in the public speeches and proclamations of American Presidents, including Abraham Lincoln's historic March 30, 1863, Presidential Proclamation urging Americans to pray and fast during one of the most dangerous hours in American history, and the text of President John F. Kennedy's November 22, 1963, national security speech which concluded: "For as was written long ago: 'Except the Lord keep the city, the watchman waketh but in vain."

2. http://www.lrc.ky.gov/krs/039g00/010.pdf

"(1) The Kentucky Office of Homeland Security shall be attached to the Office of the Governor and shall be headed by an executive director appointed by the Governor.
(2) The executive director shall:
(a) Publicize the findings of the General Assembly stressing the dependence on Almighty God as being vital to the security of the Commonwealth by including the provisions of KRS 39A.285(3) in its agency training and educational materials. The executive director shall also be responsible for prominently displaying a permanent plaque at the entrance to the state's Emergency Operations Center stating the text of KRS 39A.285(3);"

3. http://www.lrc.ky.gov/krs/039a00/990.PDF

"Any person violating any provision of this chapter or any administrative regulation or order promulgated pursuant to this chapter for which another penalty is not specified shall be guilty of a Class A misdemeanor."

4. http://www.lrc.ky.gov/KRS/532-00/090.PDF

"For a Class A misdemeanor, the term shall not exceed twelve (12) months"

The 1st one is a bit of a *so what?*. It is difficult to prosecute anyone of violating it, because how *does* one violate it?

The 2nd one seems to be in direct violation of article VI in the US constitution, however, as it makes a religious belief mandatory for assuming the office of executive director of The Kentucky Office of Homeland Security.

The 3rd one attaches a sentence equivalent to a class A misdemeanor (and the 4th one defines the maximum sentence) for violating a provision of chapter 39a, but not 39g, so my initial assessment is that it would be quite difficult to convict anyone of violating these provisions.

In other words, more than a "no biggie", but less than a worst case scenario involving the combined powers of all the horsemen of the Scourge.

Would still like to see the 2nd one getting torn apart by the Supreme Court, though.


Ridiculous law. Where, when and how has anyone been arrested or indicted or convicted under this law.

Please provide specifics from a reliable archival or public source.

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08 Dec 2012, 6:07 am

Only God can protect Kentuckey is true.

At least it only applies to one person, and one office, and is useful, for all of those County Sheriffs who will want tanks.

At least they did not do anything really stupid, like putting "In God we trust", on the money. The meaning there is about faith based paper.

God willing, and if the creek don't rise, nothing will come of this.



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08 Dec 2012, 6:45 am

That is simply unconstitutional and unenforceable.

The Tennessee constitution prohibits atheists and ministers from serving in public office, but it, too, in unenforceable.

Quote:
Article IX

Sec. 1. Whereas Ministers of the Gospel are by their profession, dedicated to God and the care of souls, and ought not to be diverted from the great duties of their functions; therefore, no Minister of the Gospel, or priest of any denomination whatever, shall be eligible to a seat in either House of the Legislature.

Sec. 2. No person who denies the being of God, or a future state of rewards and punishments, shall hold any office in the civil department of this State.


While Article I, Section 4 states,

Quote:
That no political or religious test, other than an oath to support the Constitution of the United States and of this State, shall ever be required as a qualification to any office or public trust under this State.



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08 Dec 2012, 6:47 am

since the law is not enforceable, what is your problem with it. It simply is a waste of space.

ruveyn



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08 Dec 2012, 1:15 pm

Another story about, quotes the judges who presided over determining if the law was constitutional.....

http://www.kentucky.com/2011/10/29/1938 ... iring.html


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