The Reason for the Season
Declension wrote:
Prud wrote:
These festivals all revovled around the worship of the sun or a sun god, little wonder why the concept of the son of god was invented
Are you really saying what I think you're saying? That's just dumb.
Why would Jews speaking Hebrew/Greek/Aramaic have invented a story because "son" rhymes with "sun" in a language that didn't even exist at the time?
Not exactly, but when stories are told, the original meaning can be lost and all you need to do is look at spoken words for what we know as "sun" and "son" we prounounce them exactly the same so you only know what I mean if I write it down, what if you speak a different language?
Sol in greek means sun, in Norse Sol means son, Middle English sone, from Old English sunu; akin to Old High German sun son, Greek for son is Huios, sun is Helios, Latin for son is Filios. Translators could have easily got the meaning back to front, a Latin monk translating from Greek texts to uphold their myth could have easily wrote Filios in place of Helios. Ancient text is littered with the use of different letters being used when translating into a different language, F in place of S, H in place of S, L in place of F & S, the list goes on.
Latin word for god is Deus, very similar to the Greek Zeus when spoken.
So the god of the Hebrews is stolen from the greek Zeus and their Jesus is Cronus.
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AngelRho
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Prud wrote:
Declension wrote:
Prud wrote:
These festivals all revovled around the worship of the sun or a sun god, little wonder why the concept of the son of god was invented
Are you really saying what I think you're saying? That's just dumb.
Why would Jews speaking Hebrew/Greek/Aramaic have invented a story because "son" rhymes with "sun" in a language that didn't even exist at the time?
Not exactly, but when stories are told, the original meaning can be lost and all you need to do is look at spoken words for what we know as "sun" and "son" we prounounce them exactly the same so you only know what I mean if I write it down, what if you speak a different language?
Sol in greek means sun, in Norse Sol means son, Middle English sone, from Old English sunu; akin to Old High German sun son, Greek for son is Huios, sun is Helios, Latin for son is Filios. Translators could have easily got the meaning back to front, a Latin monk translating from Greek texts to uphold their myth could have easily wrote Filios in place of Helios. Ancient text is littered with the use of different letters being used when translating into a different language, F in place of S, H in place of S, L in place of F & S, the list goes on.
Latin word for god is Deus, very similar to the Greek Zeus when spoken.
So the god of the Hebrews is stolen from the greek Zeus and their Jesus is Cronus.
More conspiracy theorist rhetoric. This looks to me something like the old cum hoc ergo propter hoc trick, or somewhere between that and the association fallacy. If you care to get serious about exploring religion, I'd suggest putting away those Dan Brown books and dig into something more substantial.
The words "Deus" and "Zeus" are distinctly different. Iuppiter is the Roman equivalent for the Greek Zeus, and the words don't even remotely resemble each other. Now, the actual Greek word for God is much closer, and that is Theos (remember, the "Th" in Greek is a single letter). And they do sound a lot more alike spoken than Deus/Zeus. Now, the MODERN Greek renders it "Dias," but again the problem is this is a name distinctly different from "Theos."
Also, no Hebrew word for God is "God." The word "god" is a generic word of European origin (I believe) that refers to any god regardless of religion/mythology, and our word "God" (big G) is specific to THE God. In Hebrew scripture generic forms are often used to avoid misusing the Name, which is YHWH or, as some of us say, Yahweh. And the Hebraic substitutions like El, Elohim, El Elohim, Adonai, and so forth also can be used as titles of royalty. But the plain fact is that the usage of the Name and other various names in Hebrew scripture is unmistakable. And the copying accuracy of the OT throughout the millennia has retained the highest standard of any ancient text. Which, again, if God-loaning is going on, it more likely was some primitive form of ancient semitic monotheism that other religions borrowed from.
DevilInPgh
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abacacus wrote:
AngelRho wrote:
According to Biblical scripture, monotheism was the first religion and give rise to polytheism after mankind abandoned Yahweh worship.
Well there's your problem.
The bible is wrong here. No debate required. It's plain and simple wrong. The Egyptian religion came before Christianity for one. As far as I know, nearly all of the ancient Middle Eastern religions were polytheistic, though I could be wrong there.
Do some research. Not in the bible, I mean real research, looking at facts instead of children's stories.
I think you are misunderstanding what he said. When Adam and Even were kicked out of the Garden and Eden, they acknowledged the existence of one G-d. According to the Midrashic tradition, their children would eventually respect the creations of G-d, such as the sun and moon, but then start praying to THEM as if they were separate deities (with the lone exception being Noah and his family (and here, BTW, is where you cue Bill Cosby)). The process eventually repeated itself with Noah's descendants after the Tower of Babel incident, with the exception of his son Shem, grandson Eber, and, independently, his descendant Abram/Abraham. This, I'm sure, is to what AngelRho was referring.
DevilInPgh
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Prud wrote:
Declension wrote:
Prud wrote:
These festivals all revovled around the worship of the sun or a sun god, little wonder why the concept of the son of god was invented
Are you really saying what I think you're saying? That's just dumb.
Why would Jews speaking Hebrew/Greek/Aramaic have invented a story because "son" rhymes with "sun" in a language that didn't even exist at the time?
Not exactly, but when stories are told, the original meaning can be lost and all you need to do is look at spoken words for what we know as "sun" and "son" we prounounce them exactly the same so you only know what I mean if I write it down, what if you speak a different language?
Sol in greek means sun, in Norse Sol means son, Middle English sone, from Old English sunu; akin to Old High German sun son, Greek for son is Huios, sun is Helios, Latin for son is Filios. Translators could have easily got the meaning back to front, a Latin monk translating from Greek texts to uphold their myth could have easily wrote Filios in place of Helios. Ancient text is littered with the use of different letters being used when translating into a different language, F in place of S, H in place of S, L in place of F & S, the list goes on.
Latin word for god is Deus, very similar to the Greek Zeus when spoken.
So the god of the Hebrews is stolen from the greek Zeus and their Jesus is Cronus.
Israelite religion predated Greek civilization by a few hundred years.
DevilInPgh
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AngelRho wrote:
The words "Deus" and "Zeus" are distinctly different. Iuppiter is the Roman equivalent for the Greek Zeus, and the words don't even remotely resemble each other. Now, the actual Greek word for God is much closer, and that is Theos (remember, the "Th" in Greek is a single letter). And they do sound a lot more alike spoken than Deus/Zeus. Now, the MODERN Greek renders it "Dias," but again the problem is this is a name distinctly different from "Theos."
This is not correct. It is more than likely that "Deus", "Zeus", "Theos" and Iupiter (which could be seen as a contraction of "Deus Pater") are actually descended from the same Indo-European root. Indic words that are similar include "deva" and "Dyaus Pita". Indeed, the reconstructed proto-Indo-European is "dyeus", which would also give rise to words associated with the sky, such as "day" and "Tuesday" (from Tiw/Tyr, derived from proto-Germanic Tiwaz).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dyeus
AngelRho
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DevilInPgh wrote:
AngelRho wrote:
The words "Deus" and "Zeus" are distinctly different. Iuppiter is the Roman equivalent for the Greek Zeus, and the words don't even remotely resemble each other. Now, the actual Greek word for God is much closer, and that is Theos (remember, the "Th" in Greek is a single letter). And they do sound a lot more alike spoken than Deus/Zeus. Now, the MODERN Greek renders it "Dias," but again the problem is this is a name distinctly different from "Theos."
This is not correct. It is more than likely that "Deus", "Zeus", "Theos" and Iupiter (which could be seen as a contraction of "Deus Pater") are actually descended from the same Indo-European root. Indic words that are similar include "deva" and "Dyaus Pita". Indeed, the reconstructed proto-Indo-European is "dyeus", which would also give rise to words associated with the sky, such as "day" and "Tuesday" (from Tiw/Tyr, derived from proto-Germanic Tiwaz).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dyeus
Sure. But, I mean, we're talking about Latin and Greek in common usage really from around, say, 500 B.C. forward. Those specific designations aren't going to be easily confused, and that's what's really at issue here. It is not surprising in the least that religions descending from a common tradition will use words in the peoples' languages understood to mean "Father God in Heaven." If you examine the birth of Christianity, you'll note that Jesus referred to God as "Father" and encouraged His followers to do the same. It's when the context gets distorted, such as with European polytheism, that the names of the father-gods become gods in and of themselves in the mindset of local culture distinct from the one true God. The Greeks and Romans paid homage to lesser patron gods and goddesses and thus miss the point of obedience to the One. It may have started out perfectly legit and innocent, but that's not where it ended up.
NAKnight wrote:
Prud wrote:
According to "The Book of the Dead" written by the way, some 1200 years before the birth of Christianity, it tells the story of Horus who was born of a virgin, performed miracles, had 12 disciples, was crucified between two criminals and resurrected after 3 days, was known as "the messiah"
After a quick Google Search, I have found the "Book of the Dead" is actually a Egyptian funeral procession booklet of how they embalm and prepare the dead for ascension. Horus is actually referring to Jesus. Horus is Jesus reincarnate, according to the Egyptians.
Is that what you are referring to?
Slave wrote:
clash of views in 3, 2, 1....
of course Prud is correct
of course Prud is correct
You really enjoy instigating don't you. It just makes you feel all warm and fuzzy inside doesn't it?
Best Regards,
Jake
@ Jake and of course my prediction was correct as the record shows.
I didn't instigate f**k all.
