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ways that mysoginy still manifests

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Raptor
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01 Jul 2014, 11:33 pm

Pick one.

Quote:
la·dy noun, often attributive \ˈlā-dē\
: a woman who behaves in a polite way

: a woman of high social position

: a man's girlfriend


I usually think of the first one.


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Ann2011
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01 Jul 2014, 11:51 pm

Raptor wrote:
Pick one.
Quote:
la·dy noun, often attributive \ˈlā-dē\
: a woman who behaves in a polite way

: a woman of high social position

: a man's girlfriend


I usually think of the first one.


And luck, which I hear can sometimes be a lady.

But what I note about the three you've mentioned is that to be a lady one must not only be a woman (although, a dude can look like a lady,) but also have one of the three attributes - politeness, social standing, or a monogamous relationship. So if a woman lacks all of these, can one then squish her on the bus without compunction?



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02 Jul 2014, 12:13 am

/\ You appeared to be seeking definition for a word and I found it. Case closed.


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02 Jul 2014, 1:05 am

Mysogyny is not ok neither is misandry, thats my take on it, however in the medias veiw only misogyny is bad and misandry is ok and to be laughed at because men aren't human nor have feelings! After all they are the oppressors including the ones that have nothing to do with being in power.


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Ann2011
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02 Jul 2014, 7:09 am

Raptor wrote:
/\ You appeared to be seeking definition for a word and I found it. Case closed.

Thank you. That's very helpful.

The whole issue of male entitlement has been memed to death anyway. When I think about women like Meriam Ibrahim and what she is facing, I have to laugh at concerns such as leg room on the bus.



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02 Jul 2014, 8:31 am

Ann2011 wrote:

So does "lady" mean women or a sub-division of women? It could be said that "I'm no lady," so just wondering.


A woman is assumed to be a lady unless she proves herself to be otherwise. Behavior such as violence, gross impropriety, or extreme risque behavior is enough to cause a woman to be, "no lady". If a woman insists to behave like an animal then she should not expect to be treated as a lady. However, if she returns to being a lady then their is no reason to treat her as if she was not. The same goes for men who abuse woman, streak in public, and treat a lady with no respect. These individuals have lost the right to call themselves a man and have entered the realm of the douchebag.


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02 Jul 2014, 9:00 am

I can't count the times men have apologized to me for saying a cuss word,even though I can cuss as good as any sailor. :D
Once you get around fifty here you become a "granny",men will always call you Miss even if you are ninety,and you get respect,no one messes with the older ladies.
It is a sad fact that younger women who behave in not so lady like ways will get a bad rap.Its not really fair since some of the younger men behave the same.
Nobody really respects a "backroader",the nicname that women receive because men pick up to cruise around drinking and other mayhem with.


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Ann2011
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02 Jul 2014, 9:27 am

Sherlock03 wrote:
A woman is assumed to be a lady unless she proves herself to be otherwise. Behavior such as violence, gross impropriety, or extreme risque behavior is enough to cause a woman to be, "no lady". If a woman insists to behave like an animal then she should not expect to be treated as a lady. However, if she returns to being a lady then their is no reason to treat her as if she was not. The same goes for men who abuse woman, streak in public, and treat a lady with no respect. These individuals have lost the right to call themselves a man and have entered the realm of the douchebag.


So, if I've got this right, women should be free from misogynistic treatment as long as they behave like ladies. If one is risqué or improppriotous she should not be treated so.
Hmmm...Tarantella, starvingartist ... Bueller?
I'm no femimist, but I think this is problematic. Treatment of people should not depend on an arbitrary judgment by others. In other words, it is not okay to treat someone misogynistically regardless of whether they fulfill one's description of one deserving of such treatment. It's the behaviour of the misigynist not the woman that is in question.



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02 Jul 2014, 9:30 am

Sherlock03 wrote:
A woman is assumed to be a lady unless she proves herself to be otherwise.

This /\
Same rule applies for gentlemen.


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Ann2011
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02 Jul 2014, 9:37 am

Raptor wrote:
Sherlock03 wrote:
A woman is assumed to be a lady unless she proves herself to be otherwise.

This /\
Same rule applies for gentlemen.

Are you arguing that misogyny is acceptable if the woman's behaviour warrants it and further, that this status is to be judged on an individual basis?I
This sounds ... hmmm...misogynistic. It puts the treatment of women in he hands of men who are attempting to modify their behaviour.



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02 Jul 2014, 10:04 am

Ann2011 wrote:

So, if I've got this right, women should be free from misogynistic treatment as long as they behave like ladies. If one is risqué or improppriotous she should not be treated so.
Hmmm...Tarantella, starvingartist ... Bueller?
I'm no femimist, but I think this is problematic. Treatment of people should not depend on an arbitrary judgment by others. In other words, it is not okay to treat someone misogynistically regardless of whether they fulfill one's description of one deserving of such treatment. It's the behaviour of the misigynist not the woman that is in question.
On the contrary, if a man is abused or derided by a woman it is unjust to expect them to treat such a woman the same way they would a lady. Such expectations of blind virtue in the face of abuse is misandry and not in accordance with truth. If ones actions and behavior should not be the basis of judgment than by what action does one govern their own behavior and deeds?


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02 Jul 2014, 10:04 am

Ann2011 wrote:
Raptor wrote:
Sherlock03 wrote:
A woman is assumed to be a lady unless she proves herself to be otherwise.

This /\
Same rule applies for gentlemen.

Are you arguing that misogyny is acceptable if the woman's behaviour warrants it and further, that this status is to be judged on an individual basis?I
This sounds ... hmmm...misogynistic. It puts the treatment of women in he hands of men who are attempting to modify their behaviour.


It's more like a case of if the shoe fits, wear it (i.e. treat people according to how they act since you have nothing else to go on).
And I think there's been some misuse of the term misogyny here. Male chauvinism would probably be more applicable in this thread.


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Ann2011
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02 Jul 2014, 10:42 am

Sherlock03 wrote:
Ann2011 wrote:
Treatment of people should not depend on an arbitrary judgment by others. In other words, it is not okay to treat someone misogynistically regardless of whether they fulfill one's description of one deserving of such treatment. It's the behaviour of the misigynist not the woman that is in question.
On the contrary, if a man is abused or derided by a woman it is unjust to expect them to treat such a woman the same way they would a lady. Such expectations of blind virtue in the face of abuse is misandry and not in accordance with truth.

I split this quote to deal with a point here. Abuse and derision are wrong and should be treated as such. In this example I would think misogynistic behaviour in retaliation to the abuse is unproductive. I would suggest: telling the abuser/derider to bugger off, physical self defense or calling the authorities.
Sherlock03 wrote:
If ones actions and behavior should not be the basis of judgment than by what action does one govern their own behavior and deeds?

So, one's own actions, I believe, should not be governed by others' individual opinion but rather by my own moral code (which is a mixture of Christianity and Buddhism.) If I have to answer to an almighty for my behaviour I want to be able to say more than, "well, the guy next to me said it was cool."

Raptor wrote:
It's more like a case of if the shoe fits, wear it (i.e. treat people according to how they act since you have nothing else to go on).


So, for example, if a woman is wearing a low cut tank top or a man is wearing a speedo then misogynistic/misandristic treatment is appropriate?

See, I think it is not up to us to judge others and behave retributively. Unless they violate my rights I treat everyone exactly the same. It's my behaviour that concerns me, not theirs.



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02 Jul 2014, 11:02 am

Ann2011 wrote:
Raptor wrote:
It's more like a case of if the shoe fits, wear it (i.e. treat people according to how they act since you have nothing else to go on).


So, for example, if a woman is wearing a low cut tank top or a man is wearing a speedo then misogynistic/misandristic treatment is appropriate?

See, I think it is not up to us to judge others and behave retributively. Unless they violate my rights I treat everyone exactly the same. It's my behaviour that concerns me, not theirs.


Okay whatever. I'm a pig; oink oink. :pig:
Time to move on.....
:roll:


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Ann2011
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02 Jul 2014, 11:25 am

Raptor wrote:
Okay whatever. I'm a pig; oink oink. :pig:
Time to move on.....
:roll:


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Sherlock03
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02 Jul 2014, 12:01 pm

Ann2011 wrote:

So, for example, if a woman is wearing a low cut tank top or a man is wearing a speedo then misogynistic/misandristic treatment is appropriate?

See, I think it is not up to us to judge others and behave retributively. Unless they violate my rights I treat everyone exactly the same. It's my behaviour that concerns me, not theirs.
You are essentially describing the beach. Is it too overt, possibly but it doesn't warrant comment since it is considered appropriate attire. If however you were on a subway and a man was dressed so as to let the top of his pool cue be visible, then he should be rebuked for his behavior. Likewise if a woman was wearing a mini skirt without underwear she should also be treated as harshly for lewd behavior in public


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