debtor's prisons are back

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Raptor
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24 Jul 2014, 7:33 pm

auntblabby wrote:

how about not kicking people when they're already down? how 'bout leaving the down and out alone, at least let them have peace if one doesn't want to actually help them? what is wrong with this nation? the jails are already bursting at the seams as it is without cramming in poor debtors as well. seems like there is a lack of 1] compassion, and 2]common sense happening on a large scale. where is the good sense in spending more money to jail people than to fix their problems in the first place?

By allowing them to break the law with impunity and leaving them alone just because they are poor? I won't buy that for a minute. Don't do the crime if you can't do the time BUT the penalties should be proportionate to the actual crime for all citizens. It won't get any better than that from me.
And why didnt you start this thread in PPR where it belongs? There is no news story associated with this.

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auntblabby
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24 Jul 2014, 7:34 pm

just because the lamestream media don't report it doesn't mean it is not news, it is news to the people involved as well as their loved ones. but I supposed that doesn't matter. :roll:

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24 Jul 2014, 7:56 pm

/\ Yeah, well using a recent example right up front would have made it more relevant to a news forum.

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Sweetleaf
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24 Jul 2014, 9:53 pm

I hope not in my state, otherwise that unpaid ER/ambulance bill and inability to pay student loans back could land me in prison, which I find to be ridiculous.

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sonofghandi
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25 Jul 2014, 9:51 am

Sweetleaf wrote:

I hope not in my state, otherwise that unpaid ER/ambulance bill and inability to pay student loans back could land me in prison, which I find to be ridiculous.

In Colorado you can only be imprisoned for "criminal justice" debt. So as long as you don't owe anything to the court system you should remain free.

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Sweetleaf
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25 Jul 2014, 10:32 am

sonofghandi wrote:

Sweetleaf wrote:

I hope not in my state, otherwise that unpaid ER/ambulance bill and inability to pay student loans back could land me in prison, which I find to be ridiculous.

In Colorado you can only be imprisoned for "criminal justice" debt. So as long as you don't owe anything to the court system you should remain free.

Yeah as far as I know I have no bills/debt related to any criminal justice stuff......though I know if say I had an unpaid light-rail ticket like what you get if you get caught on there without paying the fare and didn't pay that off in time they can arrest you for that not sure if people actually get a prison sentence from that though.

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25 Jul 2014, 10:39 am

Seems like people could work off fines doing community service if they are physically able.
I don't think folks that have no income to pay bills should be punished for that.
Some people should be punished for not paying debts,this former friend ran her up credit card bill then laughed about it,said what are they going to do about it.This ticked me off becuse I'm anal about paying mine,and I only use it for emergencies,she was buying clothes and eating out.

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auntblabby
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25 Jul 2014, 1:18 pm

Misslizard wrote:

in ASS-P's case it was fines for vagrancy [basically for having no fixed address and having no sign of gainful income] that accumulated to the $20k range, judging from his posts. he did nothing wrong for our two tier [justice for wealth, brick wall for poverty] legal system to dun him as they did.

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25 Jul 2014, 1:19 pm

Moved from New and Current Events to PPR

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khaoz
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28 Jul 2014, 10:00 am

sonofghandi wrote:

It is illegal to federally imprison someone for debt. At the state level, however, it is not. Many states have debtor imprisonment laws on the books.

Here in Ohio, it isn't allowed under state law (it actually isn't addressed), but it is on the local level in many areas. For example, East Cleveland has a statute under the Home Rule clause of the Ohio Constitution allowing the imprisonment of anyone who cannot pay fines or fees payable to the court. I actually saw someone who had his traffic court case dismissed, but could not pay the court fees (including the "not guilty" fee), and get hauled off to spend a night in jail.

Land of the free.
With liberty and justice for all.

I don't know about debtor prisons but I know that locally, Debtor Court is big business for lawyers. One day each week, at the crack of dawn, they start lining up at the courthouse steps. Nothing but people being dragged into court over debt issues. On this day, debt issues only, with lawyerss and debtors staked out around small tables making "arrangements" for payment rather than plead before the judge.

AspieUtah
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28 Jul 2014, 10:06 am

khaoz wrote:

Wow. That conjures an image of the money changers at the Temple of Solomon. Hm.

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28 Jul 2014, 11:40 am

sonofghandi wrote:

"It is illegal to federally imprison someone for debt."

Try not paying your taxes for a while and you may soon find someone has taken over the responsibility of housing, feeding and clothing you.

This is, I believe, the one federal exemption.

NobodyKnows
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28 Jul 2014, 4:36 pm

They never went away. Take a look at paternity law in the US.

AspieUtah
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28 Jul 2014, 5:02 pm

Imprisonment for lawful public debts (taxes, traffic tickets, etc.) is one thing. Imprisonment for private debts is another thing altogether. Should government enforce private contracts that involve debt by imprisoning the debtor? At least the idea of imprisonment for public debts is based on laws governing taxes and traffic tickets, etc., that we can change. But, a third party (government) involving itself in the resolution of a private contractual debt seems facially unnecessary beyond the inevitable court order, and possible seizure and sale of some property, to settle the debt. But, imprisonment?!?

auntblabby
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28 Jul 2014, 6:47 pm

seems FDR said something along the lines of how when big business takes over the gov't that is corporatism/fascism. this is what we have now.

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28 Jul 2014, 6:55 pm

auntblabby wrote:

seems FDR said something along the lines of how when big business takes over the gov't that is corporatism/fascism. this is what we have now.

It was Benito Mussolini who coined the word "fascism." He said the it meant simply corporatism (when government is controlled by, or benefits, corporations).

Last edited by AspieUtah on 28 Jul 2014, 6:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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