Terrorist attack in France

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#illmassacrewithyou

But their religion says that they have to make us all follow their law.

I hope some of that money the Pentagon keeps soaking up helps to kill them and their fellow believers ASAP. This thing in Paris has re-ignited some of my post 9/11 feeling. I really hope everyone who thinks Sharia is the solution to anything will be dead soon. I want to be a tolerant person, but these bastards make me want to pick up a rifle and end them.

They think they can make us follow their laws, do they? Well, they can follow this! (Makes lewd hand gesture.)

Every free newspaper should put a mocking image of Muhammad on the front page on a set day soon.

Screw those guys.

(If people were doing the same in the name of Jesus, then the same should happen.)

Every single time this question has been asked (post 9-11) that's exactly the defense used by practicing muslims. Islam at it's core is a religion of peace.

So is it?

The answer is a little tricky. Here's my take. In Islam the Quran is the literal word of god (Allah). The Quran clearly instructs muslims that they "must" follow all the content of the Quran. If a muslim person says the Quran teaches peace then first confirm they are true muslims and that they "believe all of the Quran must be followed". You will find they can't squirm out of that question and they must answer in the affirmative.

Now that you have them pinned down ask them to confirm the Surahs that call on muslims to kill infidels (unbelievers). There are many, for example; Quran (2:191-193) - "And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah [disbelief] is worse than killing... but if they desist, then lo! Allah is forgiving and merciful. And fight them until there is no more Fitnah [disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allah] and worship is for Allah alone. But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zalimun (the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.)"

Now a common defense presented to the questioner is that you are taking these Surahs "out of context". That Mohammed and his followers were under attack. If you read the English translation of the Quran (which muslims assume you will not) then it's patently obvious that in most of these situations Mohammed's followers are infact living in peace and not under threat. Thus the Quran is infact inciting offensive warfare against non-believers (in the context of Surah 2:191 it was offensive attack on the Meccans).

What this demonstrates is either i) ignorance on the part of the average muslim of their holy book (this is possible as most are muslim in name only and only really follow the 5 pillars of islam). Alternatively ii) they know the Surahs but practice what is referred to in the Quran as Taqqiya. The Quran instructs muslims not to lie. However one is permitted to lie to a non-believer if their motive is for a higher purpose (i.e. subverting the non-believers to accept islam and/or an islamic state). This is referred to as Taqqiya.

One final verse worth pondering is Surah 3:28 This verse tells Muslims not to take those outside the faith as friends, unless it is to "guard themselves."

I received a private message from Kiprobalhato this morning:


yeah. your avatar. may you please remove it, or at least change it to something less lewd?

i know you're trying to make a statement about what happened in france, but you can do that by other means.

thank you.

-kip (mod)


Dear Kip,

Please perform your censorship tasks in the open and refrain from sending me private messages. If my avatar bothers you, know I'm not going to change it. What is the real offense here, the penis visible in my avatar (taken from a cartoon that has appeared in Charlie Hebdo) or yesterday's massacre in Muhammad's name?

Of course you are free to ban me if you so desire. However, in that case we both know who you are really censoring for.

Best wishes,

ST.

Last edited by SweetTooth on 08 Jan 2015, 4:58 am, edited 1 time in total.

THIS:

So, the Quran (and the Bible, apparently) are "open to interpretation", as we are often told by apologists in times like this. Well, if that's the case, I interpret it (them) to be primitive, violent, hateful, sexist, misogynistic, homophobic BS.

I suggest that you use a different cartoon for your avatar. This is supposed to be a family friendly site and you've received a private message from a mod then they can take away your privileges for uploading your own avatar. It's been done before.

Once again, I'm not going to give in to censorship by changing my avatar, so please ban me if you cannot live with this, in which case I believe that WrongPlanet and I will not be a big loss for one another. Just know: If you ban me for this reason, you have essentially become the prophet's censor clerk.

These are the last words I will write about my avatar. I would prefer to return attention to the news item discussed in this topic.

I think you made your point by shoving 'your ass' into everybody's face. We now know that you're angry at what happened in Paris ... maybe even some trauma regarding Pim F. and Theo v. G. added. BUT(T) that doesn't excuse your own behaviour!

Even before you actually get kicked off, you already start to scream bloody murder. You seem to think that you're a victim for a good cause, but you're actually behaving like an idiot! Are you really so blind that you can't distinguish the problem people have with your avatar from a real problem? If that's the case you're a rebel without a clue ... nobody will censor you because of anything Mohammed-related (dhimmi etc), but because it's offensive to people here.


But don't get me wrong: I do understand that you're angry because of the attack ... so am I!! !

Its all about you, eh?

And here you can turn a simple forum rule into an opportunity for heroic martyrdom to the cause... except it isn't.
Pick a cartoon without the private parts and see what happens.

As it stands you will not look like a hero of freedom up against the wp mod stooges of the global jihad.

Back to topic, I just wanted to say that these cold blooded killers do not represent any agenda other than their own demented vision of the world. They certainly don't represent the Islamic faith which according to them, condemns these men to hell for eternity for their actions. Just as they killed these innocent cartoonists, they also killed a Muslim policeman. It is said that the two brothers have come from Iraq, where I presume they have been killing innocent Shiite Muslims, as well as Christians and Kurks. So, getting angry with Islam as a religion is I believe counterproductive to solving the problem of disillusioned youth resorting to violence for no useful point. The real problem lies in failed Middle East and North Africian states where violence is the norm and AK-47's takes precedence over supplying the population with food. George W Bush tried to solve the problem through American intervention in Iraq. That failed. All other strategies have so far failed. Perhaps it just has to play itself out over the next decade or two before it plays itself out.

I think they'd disagree with you, and state categorically that they were doing exactly that.

They do represent Islam in it's most dangerous, literal, undiluted, delusional form.

"Oh, they're fundamentalists", people say. Well, the only thing wrong with Islamic fundamentals, are the fundamentals of Islam. Destroy anyone and anything that does not follow the same belief. Evil, twisted primitive beliefs, based on disgusting, horrific and violent Fairy Tales that as a species we need to move away from and leave in the Dark Ages where they belong.

Then you will be banned as you have divulged private PM and aren't willing to abide with the forum rules.

I think you are somewhat right, and in principle I agree with elements of what you say. Kristof wrote a good piece for the New York Times about this.LINK

But the ideas that it is just disillusioned youth, or violence with no useful point are wrong.

There are many highly educated professionals working in support of the dream of a new caliphate. They long to bring the peace of total submission to their idea of God to all people. They are not disillusioned, they are deeply in the grip of an illusion and committed to forcing others to share in it.

The point of this violence is to impose the jihadi/takfiri style of Salafist Islam on everybody. First all Muslims, then unbelievers and apostates... if they survive. Killing writers, cartoonists, journalists, etc. has a point: to intimidate others into the "correct" position. It seems quite effective.

We can't deal with this problem by pretending it isn't there or has other causes. Yes, other factors contribute, but the heart of the movement really is this romanticized view of violent Islam as the universal solution to all problems.