First Cause

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Yup, I am most definitely into the FORCE THINGY AS GOD.. AND we and OTHERS are the sentient FORCE OF FORCE as a synergistic SENTIENT FORCE.

Seriously, if it wasn't for psychopathic leaning religious leaders ALL FOR THE POWER AND GLORY AND MATERIALISTIC GAINS THROUGH SUBJUGATION OF HUMANS THROUGH ILLUSORY FEARS, AND REPRESSION AND OPPRESSION OF HUMAN NATURE this could be so DAM easy.

MY CAT Yellow Boy THANKS GOD EVERYDAY, HE MISSED THAT PART OF HUMAN illusory LIFE.

AND Madonna has IT All FIGURED OUT TOO.



Oh and by the way, for the non-metaphorical deciphering minds out there, the Devils are religion and Love is GOD.

And Nietzche is the POPE!

Any questions?..

Oh and by the way...

Nothing definitely exists....

IN HUMAN IMAGINATION.

THAT MAKES IT REAL..

LIKE EVERYTHING ELSE WE IMAGINE.

AND WE IMAGINE EVERYTHING WE SEE, WITH EYES OPEN OR CLOSED.

SO IN human REALITY NOTHING DOES NOT EXIST AND IT DOES TOO.

It depends on who you ask.

So given everyone as part of reality, yes, it exists, at least in imagination.

And iMagiNatIon is part of HUMAN QUANTUM reality and REaLiTy in GeneREAL

Perhaps there could be a timeless existence where things occur absent causes or effects.

What we understand to be cause and effect may be a narrow condition of which things could behave.

The closest I can come to explaining this is to imagine what we mean by time.

Time is the relation of all similar motions the rotation of the earth with respect to the sun, the motion of a pendulum, the oscillation of a quartz crystal under electric current. These things are all clocks but none are time, time is the apparent relatability to all motions. The fact that we can relate one motion to another is what time is, time is relation of all motion.

The fact that we can relate motion to one another is what we mean by time. So suppose you can go back in time where motions stop being relate-able to one another, there is no earth, other clocks stop being relate-able to quartz fiber under electric current. You get to a point where things are changing but you can not tell whether you are going backwards or forwards in time with respect to clocks you were once familiar Or that relative to clocks you were once familiar extrapolated from the laws of physics at that time, you may arrive upon a realization that the clocks of the previous time that things maybe behaving backwards relative to that extrapolated clock or in a way impossible to relate.

So to the perspective of people in our time, we might see to the observer in the previous (or other time) What we might see as an effect would be a cause to the observer in that time. Even though there is no point in time where this reversal occurs, it happens slow. Something weird like that, again this is just imagination a theory of how time might work.

Anyway its pseudoscience, I have no way of demonstrating this. I just think its fun to imagine possibilities.

Thinking about infinity makes my head hurt.

Nothing wrong with this, as has been pointed out before creative thinking is vital to new discoveries. Where this becomes a problem is when people think that creative thinking is the only requirement to discover new knowledge and cannot understand why no one else will listen to their crackpot ideas. They do not understand that creative ideas need to be verified by years of experiment requiring a great deal of work. They also don't understand that if their idea does not agree with experiment then it is wrong.

Yeah, I suppose you're right. Most likely a crackpot idea though. Cool to think about, no reason to suppose it. It would have been better for me to ask the questions; can things happen before the first cause? Can things occur without cause and effect?

As I explained in another thread; denying a First Cause is like denying your own existence.

Lets call this First Cause "God".

The question "Who created God?" is an oxymoron.

What causes lightning?
Quantum Mechanics is to the Big Bang as static build-up is to a lightning bolt.
That is one possible explanation, with all of existence being eternal, in one form or another.

I know for a fact is caused by something.

It seems to me you get pleasure from asking question after question .. what is wrong with accepting the truth when it is right in your face ?

A fact? Truth?

Believe me, I felt the same way, was just as convinced, and wondered how people could be so blind to it. It was no easy thing for me to go from that certainty to realizing I could be wrong. I'm not trying to be insincere and I do not get pleasure from it at all. I had to open myself up to being wrong - not easy.

It seems to me that your a "what if" guy.

Extreme scepticism is not healthy. it will drive you insane.

Do you not see the absurdity of an infinite chain of causes ?

You see, that is what I used to do... make assumptions about where people were coming from and often also about their state of their mind.

I'm not so much a "what if" guy as someone who learned the prejudice of my own beliefs, which blinded me to other possible truths. I was so sure I was right, that others were certainly wrong.

Phew.. what a load off now.

And I'm not an extreme skeptic, and I enjoy the things that my mind is now free to explore. When I was a Christian, I was skeptical of science and the egotistic atheists it produces. Now that I'm free from that skepticism, I can enjoy things that I previously eschewed. Being open to being wrong has actually freed me - which was unexpected. Rather than drive me insane, it's made me excited to learn.

I had to question your state of mind because a normal person believes in God.

There's strong evidence that we are hard wired to believe in God.

So whenever I meet someone who says they don't believe in God whatsoever, I know they are lying, brainwashed or insane.

You know?

Yes, there was some science done a few years ago to suggest what they called the "god gene," but it is neither conclusive, nor is it common. And far from "hard-wired," it might lean us in that direction. The "god gene" was something I liked the idea of. It made sense. But then I was disappointed to learn that further scientific studies made the "god gene" less likely.

So please, be careful what you believe and how that colours your perception of people. To say you "know they are lying, brainwashed or insane," is not only an extraordinary claim, it also shows how beliefs cause judgement.

Even if we are "hard wired" to believe in God (which I think is false,) this is not proof that God exists. What we believe does not necessarily correspond with truth.

A normal person believes in God since birth. A person who is trying to disbelieve in God is abnormal.

This is the point that you missed.

But, does the God gene prove that God exists? Yes it does, because if God didn't exist, the gene wouldn't be there.