Does the U.S. want Trump’s Muslim solution or the vigilantis

Post Reply New Topic

The Syrian refugee crisis is very much the product of the rise of ISIS. This organization was founded as the terrorist network Jama'at al-Tawhid wal-Jihad by Abu Musab al-Zarqawi in 1999, who set up shop in Iraq in 2003 as a response to (and by some accounts, even in anticipation of) the US-led invasion of Iraq.

After two US F-16 jets killed al-Zarqawi in 2006, his network began the transformation which led - through multiple precursor organizations - it to become the current Islamic State.

So the US sends military forces into Iraq in an (1) unprovoked war of aggression on (2) false pretenses which (3) led to the death of half a million people and (4) contributed to the largest refugee crisis since World War II...

... and then you argue that the US - the country that helped bring ISIS into existence - should turn away refugees from ISIS in order to focus on the needs of people who may have *directly* contributed to creating the crisis in the first place...

Wouldn't it be more consistent if the support for taking in Syrian refugees in the US was somehow equivalent to the support for the 2003 invasion of Iraq?

Some food for thought:



.. and US public opinion on the war in Iraq on 22-23 March 2003, two to three days after the invasion started:



Source:
http://www.gallup.com/poll/186866/ameri ... aign=tiles
http://www.gallup.com/poll/8038/seventy ... -iraq.aspx

Or perhaps you believe that the European countries alone should deal with the burden of the refugee crisis (including several European countries who are facing large refugee flows even though they were against the 2003 invasion of Iraq), and that the US has no responsibility to help fix it's own mess?

... oh, wait. You *do*.

https://wrongplanet.net/forums/viewtopi ... 7#p6868037

Islam and Christianity are going to have to adapt to modern society at some point. They can't stay stuck in the past forever. I say we need more religious leaders like Pope Francis, who are compassionate and tolerant and willing to question past beliefs which no longer work. I also think that breaking down extremist organizations like Daesh from the inside-out should be a top priority.

You said:

"This organization was founded as the terrorist network Jama'at al-Tawhid wal-Jihad by Abu Musab al-Zarqawi in 1999, who set up shop in Iraq in 2003 as a response to (and by some accounts, even in anticipation of) the US-led invasion of Iraq."

What do the words "in anticipation" mean to you? Doesn't this sound like they were merely waiting for a random opportunity to start another conflict? Your assertion sounds like something medieval. I'm sure you feel the actions of the Crusaders were also a factor in creating ISIS. This sounds more like an excuse for war, unending war, the type of holy war radical Muslims preach. Where is that religion of Peace? To resist such radical action is the duty of reasoning humans everywhere.

Don't remember how Muslim terrorists attacked us on 9/11? Perhaps you feel this was a good thing and justified by your (I'm guessing) religion? Do you think a patriotic citizen wrong to choose to serve their country in times of war? Do you consider yourself responsible for harm to others because of your words here?

Or perhaps a "tempest in a tea pot" is just your kind of thing? Just cast stones about and hope none rebound?

...and you mentioned: "Or perhaps you believe that the European countries alone should deal with the burden of the refugee crisis (including several European countries who are facing large refugee flows even though they were against the 2003 invasion of Iraq), and that the US has no responsibility to help fix it's own mess?"

I believe any countries that choose to reject refugees is allowed to make their own decisions...it's an internal matter. Europe is certainly large enough to easily handle this many people. Whenever there's a problem it's always the United States that's supposed to pick up the tab...ever since before WWII...in which other Europeans fumbled the ball mightily and came up smelling like dung.

But since YOU brought it up, tell us how many European countries profited mightily in the mid-east (and in fact occupied much of the mid-east..for many many years? Hint:not the U.S).....you seem to have left this small fact out of your dissertation.

I think selective memory is disingenuous.

you realize that Christian terrorism is far more prevalent in the US than your islamic boogymen

http://www.alternet.org/tea-party-and-right/10-worst-terror-attacks-extreme-christians-and-far-right-white-men

what other purpose would the biggest military budget in the world serve except to help police it?

I especially note your use of the words "US" in your above statement. If we have "home grown" problems in this country they're ours to deal with. Not wanting Muslim radicals added to the mix just makes common sense.

And I just have to ask you: Was your use of the word "boogymen" supposed to be funny? Muslim KILLERS is what I meant.

no, it was meant to illustrate that your fear of islamic terrorists is extremely exaggerated, not unlike that of a fictional monster in the closet. Also it's less a case of 'ours to deal with' and more of 'terrorists? I see no terrorists here, only patriots'

And expect the U.S. to pay for everything too? And then b***h and moan about our actions and motives? It gets old.

Try to remember the situation after WWII and the Cold War and the devastation in Europe and how everyone expected the united States to cover everyone's butt against the Communist block takeover of Europe. We should have left Europe to their own devices/fate? We should never have been involved in that Serbian/Bosnian mess; Europeans should have handled it quickly themselves.

...you're saying that America should have let Europe descend into a fascist hellhole after ww2? ....

never mind that America wouldn't have been able to stand against a united fascist Europe, why would you think that's a good idea?

"no, it was meant to illustrate that your fear of islamic terrorists is extremely exaggerated, not unlike that of a fictional monster in the closet"
Our fear as you like to call it is more like distaste with a measure of disgust thrown in. The "terror" aspect just isn't panning out for those folks. We have more important things to do than worry about deluded people. We have people who weed out most of the insane killers before they can do harm, in case you hadn't noticed. I don't hear about people being frightened by the scarecrow.

You said: " Also it's less a case of 'ours to deal with' and more of 'terrorists? I see no terrorists here, only patriots"

It's always that way, isn't it? But perhaps then "killer" is the better term, since this is what they do. What else would you expect from those who hold up their god as the reason for killing others. They should go to school, get jobs, and be upstanding citizens like the rest of the world and lead the world again in Science, Astronomy and other fields. But instead they use war and try to convince others this is the correct path. Muhammed would cry.

I was saying our bloated defense budget is due to keeping armed after WWII and holding back the "Communist Threat" from the rest of Europe while they recovered which morphed into the rest of the world expecting us to always save their butt. My comment was to suggest perhaps we should have allowed Europe to defend themselves against becoming a "communist" hellhole, instead of always trying to involve us.

more important than worrying about deluded violent people who want to end civilized life as we know it. riiiight.that describes every religion ever.aside from the bit about muhammed you just described america pretty much. school should be cheaper/free so people can get the jobs they want and build america up, but the chickenhawks are wasting resources instead.

yah, that wouldn't have happened. if america had left europe alone before ww2, you'd be speaking german, and if they had after ww2, you'd be speaking russian.

guessing your post got eaten by the captcha. hopefully you can still hit back and save it.