Anti-Zionism is anti-semitism

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Never heard of Patagonia or Madagascar as proposed Jewish homelands but the Russian far east was proposed by Lenin as such(google "Birobidzhan").

God promised the land of Zion to the Jews in Exodus in the Bible. A God was supposed to return Zion to the Jews in a prophetic future.

But "Zionism" is a secular political nationalist movement of the late Nineteenth/twentieth century.


Orthodox Jews actually branded Zionism as a "blasphemy" (God is supposed to return the land to the Jews,human Jews arent supposed to make it happen). But soon after Israeli Independence most orthodox Jews accepted the state of Israel as a a "fact on the ground". And the Orthodox minority are actually a quite powerful faction in Israel today. But some tiny splinter sects of the Orthodox are still anti Zionist.

Uganda, Patagonia, a part of Australia, were all proposed as possible new Jewish homelands. The closest to becoming reality prior to Israel was the Soviet "Jewish Autonomous Province": a region the size of a small eastern U.S. state on the Amur River in the Russian far east just across the river from China that did gather a sizable minority population of several thousand Jewish settlers.

But I digress.

Since Zionism is a secular political ideology its not part of the Jewish religion. Therefore how is being against Zionism equal to "antisemitism"?

Last edited by naturalplastic on 01 Apr 2016, 12:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Well, regardless of how you want to pick at terminology - in my opinion there is a huge issue with creating a new state with no regard from the residents of the land based on a religious text.

They believe it's their promised land. So what?

Of course, now they've been their decades, they can't just be thrown out.

There needs to be a peaceful solution - not just one that involves Israel squashing Palestine and ever expanding onto Palestinian land.

Indeed. In British Palestine, Jews, Christians, Muslims and others got along a lot better than they do now. What changed? The Israeli politicization of territory and military.

Getting back to the topic title, I can support anti-Zionism wholly for reasons that don't involve antisemitism, let alone be antisemitic. The topic and its title amounts to trolling.

They've been offered peace and a two-state solution since before Israel was even founded. They've always rejected it, instead the Arabs chose violence, terrorism and a denial of Jewish history. In fact, Muslim violence towards Jews in Palestine began well before the State of Israel was even founded. We can talk about how the Jews of Hebron were massacred in 1929, for instance.

The Palestinians want to kick out the Jews for Allah. The reason why the conflict has been going on is because most Muslims (there are exceptions to this both inside and outside Israel) cannot tolerate what was once ruled over by Islam falling into non-Muslim hands.



Can I ask you a couple of questions?

a) How did "Palestine" get it's name?
b) Has there ever been a Palestinian state, like ever? What is Palestinian history? Who were the kings and queens of Palestine, the invasions of Palestine, the big events of Palestine? (Hint: Palestinians didn't even call themselves that until the mid-1960s. Before that, they were just Arabs.)
c) Judea and Samaria is a disputed territory, and the Jews have the right to build there. (There has been nothing in international law that says they cannot.)
d) Have you ever looked at Judea and Samaria? It's a vastness of nothing. Sprawling hills and countryside. You would have to spend thousands of years building at the current rate before it was all built on.
e) What do you imagine the settlements to be like? Any settlement building is happening in already-designated villages and is very restricted as it is (we're talking about a couple of houses built here, an extension on a house there - and that's over a considerable period). New villages are not being built - there is no support for this, even among the Israeli right-wing.



You could say the same about the Arabs. They believe that any land that was once Muslim land is always Muslim land. Islamists believe that Andalusia and Malta will once again fall to Allah, just as Constantinople did.

It's more to do with the fact that Jews have always lived there, and there is archaeological and other evidence linking Jews to the Land of Israel.

You mean in that British Palestine where Arabs were massacring Jews? Ethnic tensions were never far away, even in the Mandate period. In fact, they were massacring Jews before the Mandate too.

Anti-Israel and anti Zionist positions are the left-wing surrogate for outright anti-Semitism. The real anti-Semites say what they mean. The Left Wingers have to fiddle and disguise their dislike of Jews.

At least Stormfront is honest and upfront about their hate.

As is often the case, Reductio ad Hitlerum makes its inevitable appearance. Classy and logical.

I agree. But the dissolution of Israel is what anti-Zionists actively want(and that is not gonna happen). And furthermore, the Jewish people DO have historical claim to that land and this has been demonstrated with archaeology. The original canaanites no longer exist as a distinct people. So no, the Israeli's do not have the moral right to expel all Goyim from Israel and the Palestinians do have legitimate grievances.

To some extent this is true. But the left never disliked Jews until the creation of the state of Israel. Their anti-western bias definitely is a big factor here but it's gone far beyond that. The slippery slope of Anti-Zionism leads right down to the gutter of Anti-Semitism every time without fail.

But here's the kicker: Whenever Israel is attacked without direct provocation by terrorist groups or by it's neighbors(as has been done in the past), and Israel retaliates, THEY are made to look like the bad guy.

If such a thing were to happen, there would be another genocide.

Standard copy-and-paste Zionist talking points, as always.
Actual Jewish Zionists must be pretty amused at how easy people like you are to manipulate.

Is anything of what I said untrue?

In fact, Arabs were killing Jews even BEFORE the Mandate.

Yes, the implication that the Palestinian Arabs living in what is now Israel should have just accepted having a Jewish state imposed upon them in the first place, and the idea implicit in everything you post about this subject that the Palestinian Arabs deserve everything that's happened to them.

People like you always go on about things like the Hebron massacre, but if anyone brings up massacres of Arabs by Jews you'll start going on about how the Arabs deserved it, they started it, they use human shields, and so on ad infinitum.

Let me guess, you probably think Rachel Corrie had it coming too, and that the attack on the USS Liberty was just an honest mistake, and that besides those American sailors should have been more careful anyway, and that the Israeli army is the most moral in the world blah blah blah blah.

I bet you never had any political opinions beyond 'Islam is bad' and 'Nazis are bad' before Zionist propaganda entered your life and gave you a sense of moral superiority, social identity and being 'in the know'. Never mind the fact that Zionist propaganda is incoherent and contradicted by facts, or the fact that you're not even Jewish.

'Oh why won't people see that Islam is intolerant and expansionist' you moan. Well guess what. I do see it, but I still find your propaganda insufferable.

Last edited by skysaw on 02 Apr 2016, 10:12 am, edited 1 time in total.

What does this even mean?

Here's some news stories from your favourite country - if any of this was happening in Europe you'd be whining about Nazism.

Israel Bans Novel on Arab-Jewish Romance From Schools for 'Threatening Jewish Identity'
Or Kashti Dec 31, 2015
http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/.premium-1.694620
By Banning Book, Israel Maintains Purity of Blood
Jews and Arabs are forbidden to have sex, love, marry, have families or live with one another, according to the Education Minister
Alon Idan Dec 31, 2015
http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/.premium-1.694673
Russian-speakers who want to make aliya could need DNA test
Prime Minister’s Office says would-be immigrants from former Soviet Union may be asked to prove Jewish bloodline
BY ASHER ZEIGER AND TIMES OF ISRAEL STAFF July 29, 2013, 10:19 am
http://www.timesofisrael.com/russian-sp ... -dna-test/
Terra incognita: Is separate education working in Israel?
By SETH J. FRANTZMAN \ 11/30/2014
[In Israel]... the percent of students studying in mixed Arab-Jewish schools is effectively 0.
http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/Terra-inco ... ael-383276