Utopianism and intractible problems

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yeah, but I'm thinking rather more from the subjective experience of this: like, I don't experience myself as mediocre genetic material and get hung up about not having access to a-grade genes of the opposite sex. I don't want to think of myself that way when talkin to a woman, like, I don't want to calculate my odds on a "how many points do I need to subtract from my biological attractiveness-score because of the slightly noticeable bald spot on the back of my head"-level. Neither do I want to talk to a woman and think: "can I get a better one or should I settle on this"?
but that's the level on which the mechanical way of talking to women that pick up artists engage in are thinking of themselves: fat belly, -5; but you can counter that with some accessories that give you +6 on your attractiveness score. Say something negative to her so she feels like you looked through her +6 accessories and straight at her -5 belly, so she feels she needs to prove she's actually more attractive etc., etc.p

I accept that that's going on subconsciously, but bloody hell I don't want to identify with it, or calculate things this way. It's basically telling yourself that you're too fat to be talking to the woman you like.

Yeah, I do nothing with it from the moment to moment calculation level. To say anything of my life life in PPR (which oddly enough I'm talking politics a bit in L&D right now - one good turn deserves another I guess!) I really don't bother with most women at all, regardless of level of attraction, unless I feel like there's enough emotional, intellectual, and life-curiosity bonding glue to work with - which is almost never, so having to suss out what here status is, whether I'm x points down for this or for that, I don't really do that either but at the same time I can tell when someone's in a different social caste and when the people around her would be quite hostile to my approach.

What you brought up though hits one thing about this. It tends to happen with really bad news of this sort that people tend to be parted by it on both sides - ie. lots of people don't want to believe it and fall into naturalistic fallacy when it's brought up, a certain amount of scavengers (ie. PUA) throw themselves at it cynically because it's true and they want to use it to their own ends for their own gains, I think for me I split the difference and on one level want to accept what's true if it's true regardless of whether it's an enjoyable or heartening truth but also I tend to be quite hard on myself, 'possibility' and not making it click is something I've historically been quite hard on myself about, so deflating false possibility bubbles helps that a lot. I've also noticed that I get depressed much less often in the traditional sense when I don't feel like there's some huge pasture that I'm locked out of, if it were true I'd for sure have to make peace with that (still better not to lie - false heuristics IMHO just aren't useful to me) but I've noticed that depression seems to be about mismatches between perceived possibilities and what you actually have - which is why I tend to delight in crushing false appearances of possibility.

That's all fine, but the question for me is not just how things work, but what do ai want to identify with - imagine a red pilled pick up artist encounters an actually nice woman who for some magic is showing interest in him - would he even be capable of accepting that he met a nice woman, or would he be so entrenched in his identity as red-pilled pick up artist that he can't see her as a person anymore, but only as this scapegoat he needs to be what he tinks he is?

Also: I get depressed thinking about how my morals hinder me from doing things I would enjoy but know are "wrong" - like travelling to far off lands, a lot. (I try to fly less). At least I tell myself that's my morals, but maybe it's just me having chosen that that would make me feel superior - a form of self-centered virtue signalling, if you will - while in reality, all I'm doing is barring myself from experiences, for the sake of ... What?

That's still a very narrow bandwidth to jam the information into

There are far more guys who could use information in ways like knowing what constitutes creepy, how not to be creepy, how to play the 'above board' game society has while understanding its rules, and I would add - having a much better radar for whose actually identified you as a human being having worth who happens to be of your gender (or spread) of preference rather than throwing some sort of Darwinian spam your way (like love-bombing, which I saw even in my early 20's was really saccharine and creepy - put it on the list of things women shouldn't do to men), and it's also good for sort of popping mythological bubbles we've been telling around 'just be a decent person and you'll get ahead', that's Coachman and Lampwick taking us to Pleasure Island already and it deals with a problem I'm increasingly coming to discover - ie. that guys who don't have significant inner demons on a leash to intimidate the people around them with generally get treated a bit like they're background drapery regardless of how right or wrong they are about a lot of other things.

I think not facing up to realities like this is part of how we can oversubscribe to public mythologies that lets say function quite well in a given narrow scope but then go right off the map if they're read tautologically. Knowing what both genders have forced on them by nature itself is a good way of preventing people from reading us as if we're these little engines of logic and moral philosophy in some state of crudeness or refinement the way schools try to teach kids to be. It seems like culture's sort of just the syntax for the 'real' stuff that's going on and when it's not tended to in a self-aware or awake manner it ends up getting used by pragmatists and bandits, PUA's being a great example.


I'm sort of the same way in the sense of being a natural minimalist and also having the take that if I'm going to take a vacation make it big and make it rare (like going to Australia and New Zealand in 2011 or Calgary/Banff across to Vancouver which I did a little over a month ago).

I'm increasingly noticing that morals don't just have pressures from societal opposition, there's a lot more to deal with the fundamental issue of what power is and how it wins that have to be game-theorhetically accounted for otherwise we're stuck with platitudes which we can at least emotionally orient ourselves with but which don't solve the problems they were meant to because our treatment of them is overgeneralized.