Why does God allow bad things to happen?

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What did he do for Job? i never read the bible beyond genesis, i'm trying by god, but i barely understand it because of how it is written. One of these days i'm going to learn the languages it was written in originally and read it like that. In the king james version what page does it describe what he does for Job?

Ahh dear, Job! Hate to break it to you kiddies, but there is substantial evidence supporting the theory that the last chapter of Job was an add on by some dude who didn't like the idea that a righteous man suffered and was not attoned! According to a good many learned theologians, Job in fact did not get twice as many animals, friends, family etc.

However, Job is an EXCELLENT part of the Bible for explaining God's role in suffering. I don't believe the message of Job was that God will always make things come good for righteous people, nor do I believe that God was punishing Job and handing him over to Satan. I believe that at the heart of the story is the message that indeed, God will NOT forsake or abandon us, just as he did not abandon Job.

As other people have already said, there is a bunch of free will in this: God gave us the power of choice, and the choices we make have consequences. And whilst I don't believe that God causes random tragedies to happen in order to help us grow, I believe that even in terrible things we can experience God's goodness and His presence. I certainly don't think he weighs things up and decides to kill off someone so that their friends will learn to appreciate life, but I do think that when our free will leads us to demise, he is able to shine through the darkness and help us to grow as people.

Well i am about as religious as a turtle, but i am still interested in the stories and philosophies that can be gleaned from holy texts.

*nods* I'm 'religious', but I tend to read the Bible more out of interest in other texts!

The other story that always pops into my mind when people mention suffering is the story of Joseph and his brothers. Nomaken, since you said you've read Genesis, you should be familiar with it, but I'll give you guys a quick summary.


Joseph was the youngest of the 12 brothers of Jacob and his father's favourite. One day, Jacob gave his son a beautiful cloak that was dyed the different colours of the rainbow. His brothers were jealous, partly because of the cloak and partly because of Joseph's dreams. Joseph had two dreams that were interpreted that his 12 brothers (or is it 11?) would someday bow to him. His brothers were jealous, so they sold him into slavery.
Joseph was taken into Egypt and sold to Potipher. He became one Potipher's trusted servants, and God blessed him. Potipher's wife was jealous, so she had Joseph put into jail. While in jail, he met the king's former baker and the king's former cupbearer. One night, both men had dreams and Joseph interpreted them. Life happened as Joseph had interpreted the dreams.
One night, the king had a dream that there were seven fat cows and the seven thin cows at the fat ones up. He eventually called for Joseph to interpret the dream and he did. There would be seven years of plenty of food in the land followed by seven years of faimine. The people would have to prepare accordingly. The king put Joseph in charge of the food.
A few years into the famine, Jacob and his sons were running out of food, so he sent his sons to get some from Joseph. (I'm just going to give a quick summary here.) Eventually, the brothers bowed to Joseph, not knowing it was him.


Joseph had a lot of bad things happen to him, but these things worked out for the better when looking at the giant picture. As aspies, we tend to obsess over details and forget about the larger picture of things.

Nomaken, what versions have you tried? If you want something close to modern English, I would try one of the Bibles for teens or something, or perhaps the NLT (new living translation). Personally, I prefer the NKJV (new king james version) or even the more archaic KJV. Or perhaps reading it in the original Hebrew and Greek would work...

I would have to caution against the KJV and NKJV: it's actually not a very accurate translation for many complicated reasons!

Something that really puts things in perspective for me is an idea I first came across via Alan Watts. He makes the point that many things have opposites that they cannot exist without. For example, in order for there to be a "something" there needs to be a "nothing" that it exists in. In order for there to be something that humans recognize as good there needs to be something that we recognize as evil to contrast with it. The important thing about evil, then, is that it can show you good. If you see something bad, you may be inspired to do something to stop it - which would be good. If an earthquake happens it may inspire you to build earthquake-proof buildings, preventing loss of life in the future. I don't know if that helps anyone at all - I tend to have kind of an "out-there" philosophical/religious bent.

<i>You know, Jesus did say in Matthew that he did not come to bring peace, but a sword, and would turn brother against brother, son against father, husband against wife, and so on. You do have a point to why would Jesus use such violent force to get people to follow him.</i>

Maybe you could point me to where Jesus used violent force to make people follow him? Because I haven't seen any examples. When Judas betrayed him and the temple guards came to have him crucified Peter attempted to fight them and Jesus stopped him and healed the guard that Peter assaulted. The verse you cited is Matthew 10:34, and I think it's quite an interesting verse. Luke 12:51 is also relevant: "Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division: For from henceforth there shall be five in one house divided, three against two, and two against three. The father shall be divided against the son, and the son against the father; the mother against the daughter, and the daughter against the mother; the mother in law against her daughter in law, and the daughter in law against her mother in law." And here's Matthew 10:37, "He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me." I think the point of this is that Jesus doesn't just appear and the world turns magically utopian - the beliefs he teaches are important, and holding them may induce conflict (represented by the sword) - even with your family members, but that the message he's teaching is important enough to hold onto even if it causes divisions and conflict. I think considered in the context of the rest of his message it has minimal importance, and considering the actions of him and the disciples (giving themselves over to death) shouldn't be seen as a call for violence.

Romans 3-4 (someone was wondering if this was from the Bible): "Not only so, but we also rejoice in our sufferings, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope."

And I'll second the KJV and NKJV sucking - a lot. Personally, my favorite is the NASV, it's a more literal and current translation that's sometimes harder to read but I think more accurately represents the original message.

I've been asking myself that question, very recently. Now I've decided buck up and face the music.

To define, religion stems from society. It's like an autism, so different that it draws peoples attentions. God cannot command everything there is to know on Earth, this is for us to experience.

I find that for every bad thing that God allows to happen, he lets something wonderful happen, afterwards.

If there is a "God", the reason he lets bad things happen to people who have done nothing wrong is because...

God is all-loving, but not all-powerful, and so while God would not want babies to be stricken with fatal diseases and sickness, God is not powerful enough to prevent it.

OR...

God is all-powerful, but not all-loving, and so therefore is not interested in helping everyone or anyone at any given time.

Hmm... One must be careful of a liberally transliterated ANYTHING, but I must say that as a general rule, NIV tends to be more reliable, although if you really want reliable, I believe the NRSV is the closest. King James is a bit of a trap though, as it was written before the Dead Sea Scrolls were found and because it is translated from Latin.

I always like to question basic assumptions about things. Mine and people in general. What I have come to believe is that the things we think are "bad" are really just the path back to "god." We think they are bad, because we are attracted to pleasure and averse to pain.
In order for us to live (as individuals) we must some day die (give up individuality) But the latter is the true life, the former is delusion.
Losing someone you love is like losing a part of yourself. But for each part of you that dies, that is one step closer to "god" And when you get there of course, that which you lost is already there.

Spacemonkey, that's quite a way of viewing things! I think I agree, except to say that I think trials and hardships are OPTIONAL paths to God: I think that it is possible for a berieved person to choose to blame God, rather than to grow closer.