18 Dec 2020, 3:15 am
Biscuitman
Veteran
Joined: 11 Mar 2013
Age: 46
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,674
Location: Dunking jammy dodgers
18 Dec 2020, 3:34 am
18 Dec 2020, 3:58 am
18 Dec 2020, 4:09 am
18 Dec 2020, 4:24 am
18 Dec 2020, 4:27 am
Nades wrote:
If that's the case they shouldn't have had kids.
Are you trying to say that lower working class should not be allowed to reproduce?
18 Dec 2020, 4:36 am
Nades wrote:
hurtloam wrote:
People can't save up for hard times when they are already struggling to make ends meet. One unfortunate event can wipe out your pot and you have to start again.
You are working full time on minimum wage. You don't smoke and you don't drink.
You put a little by every week. The car breaks down, got to get it fixed because that's how you get to work. That's a chunk out of your savings.
Then the washing machine totally dies. Got to get a new one. Can't send Johnny to school in dirty clothes. You get one off Gumtree second hand because you want to be thrifty and have some savings. That's a bit more out of the pot.
Then you have raging toothache. Looks like you need a filling. That's your savings gone. Time to start saving again.
Then, that week, the week the pot has been emptied, you loose your job.
Now what? You need to pay rent and utilities. You live in a house with electric heating and the landlord installed a pay-per-go meter so you can't pay direct debit. The meter has run out and it's mid-winter. You need to top it up. No money left for food. Your doctor refers you to a food bank. Tea is now a luxury.
Now Johnny's got a hole in his school shoes. You send him to school in trainers and you get a letter sent home with him because hes not wearing school uniform. The school thinks this is a huge deal. you're just trying to make sure he has food in his belly.
What's that? A self righteous person on the internet says you should have saved up, so you don't deserve any help.
You are working full time on minimum wage. You don't smoke and you don't drink.
You put a little by every week. The car breaks down, got to get it fixed because that's how you get to work. That's a chunk out of your savings.
Then the washing machine totally dies. Got to get a new one. Can't send Johnny to school in dirty clothes. You get one off Gumtree second hand because you want to be thrifty and have some savings. That's a bit more out of the pot.
Then you have raging toothache. Looks like you need a filling. That's your savings gone. Time to start saving again.
Then, that week, the week the pot has been emptied, you loose your job.
Now what? You need to pay rent and utilities. You live in a house with electric heating and the landlord installed a pay-per-go meter so you can't pay direct debit. The meter has run out and it's mid-winter. You need to top it up. No money left for food. Your doctor refers you to a food bank. Tea is now a luxury.
Now Johnny's got a hole in his school shoes. You send him to school in trainers and you get a letter sent home with him because hes not wearing school uniform. The school thinks this is a huge deal. you're just trying to make sure he has food in his belly.
What's that? A self righteous person on the internet says you should have saved up, so you don't deserve any help.
If that's the case they shouldn't have had kids. Also if someone is on minimum wage with kids then they are entitled to some sort of benefits more often than not.
And you do know s**t happens after you have kids? You can become poor after you have kids? Kids are sometimes unplanned, but wait, you don't ahve the money to get an abortion. Of wait, the nearest free clinic is two hours away but you don't have time to go that far and you don't have the gas for it and the money.
Getting an abortion is a privilege, being asexual is a privilege being on birth control is a privilege.
And don't say women should keep their legs closed because that is a very misogyny thing to say and how about men keep their penises outside the p**** or how about they stop being so darn horny and go get a sex doll.
18 Dec 2020, 4:37 am
18 Dec 2020, 4:39 am
magz wrote:
Nades wrote:
If that's the case they shouldn't have had kids.
Are you trying to say that lower working class should not be allowed to reproduce? If someone willingly conceives knowing full well the child is going to be brought up in relative poverty then yes. Class has nothing to do with it.
I'm usually a man of my word. I've coped fine on marginally above minimum wage for years and I'm now doing very well on less than average hourly rate. My savings are substantial and I've only been working for 7 years full time.
This is also a forum where many people struggle to have kids and large numbers of men with autism die childless and alone and struggle to have a stable sexual relationship or sex at all for that matter. My sympathy for parents who decide to have kids before knowing how to pay for them is vanishingly small as a result. I have sympathy for the kids but none for parents who choose to bring them up in poverty.
18 Dec 2020, 4:55 am
Nades wrote:
magz wrote:
Nades wrote:
If that's the case they shouldn't have had kids.
Are you trying to say that lower working class should not be allowed to reproduce? If someone willingly conceives knowing full well the child is going to be brought up in relative poverty then yes. Class has nothing to do with it.
I'm usually a man of my word. I've coped fine on marginally above minimum wage for years and I'm now doing very well on less than average hourly rate. My savings are substantial and I've only been working for 7 years full time.
This is also a forum where many people struggle to have kids and large numbers of men with autism die childless and alone and struggle to have a stable sexual relationship or sex at all for that matter. My sympathy for parents who decide to have kids before knowing how to pay for them is vanishingly small as a result. I have sympathy for the kids but none for parents who choose to bring them up in poverty.
What Hurtloam described is, for some, not considered "poverty" but "just reality".
I have been there. You don't think of yourself as "the poor", you just day-to-day try to make ends meet and you think it's normal. You even give to charity and try to help those who have it worse.
Why not have kids, then?
18 Dec 2020, 5:04 am
magz wrote:
Nades wrote:
magz wrote:
Nades wrote:
If that's the case they shouldn't have had kids.
Are you trying to say that lower working class should not be allowed to reproduce? If someone willingly conceives knowing full well the child is going to be brought up in relative poverty then yes. Class has nothing to do with it.
I'm usually a man of my word. I've coped fine on marginally above minimum wage for years and I'm now doing very well on less than average hourly rate. My savings are substantial and I've only been working for 7 years full time.
This is also a forum where many people struggle to have kids and large numbers of men with autism die childless and alone and struggle to have a stable sexual relationship or sex at all for that matter. My sympathy for parents who decide to have kids before knowing how to pay for them is vanishingly small as a result. I have sympathy for the kids but none for parents who choose to bring them up in poverty.
What Hurtloam described is, for some, not considered "poverty" but "just reality".
I have been there. You don't think of yourself as "the poor", you just day-to-day try to make ends meet and you think it's normal. You even give to charity and try to help those who have it worse.
Why not have kids, then?
It might be reality for many but it's still poverty.
I'm working class myself. I was brought up with a working class family in one of the poorest counties in the country, 30 years later I still live in the same working class town of little means. I'm very well accustomed with families that live on benefits and have been around them my entire life. When I see kids wearing rags and going hungry I've learned over the years that it's almost always the parents fault and not the state.
What do you mean by why not have kids? I assume me?
auntblabby
Veteran
Joined: 12 Feb 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 115,289
Location: the island of defective toy santas
18 Dec 2020, 5:05 am
18 Dec 2020, 5:18 am
Nades wrote:
magz wrote:
Nades wrote:
magz wrote:
Nades wrote:
If that's the case they shouldn't have had kids.
Are you trying to say that lower working class should not be allowed to reproduce? If someone willingly conceives knowing full well the child is going to be brought up in relative poverty then yes. Class has nothing to do with it.
I'm usually a man of my word. I've coped fine on marginally above minimum wage for years and I'm now doing very well on less than average hourly rate. My savings are substantial and I've only been working for 7 years full time.
This is also a forum where many people struggle to have kids and large numbers of men with autism die childless and alone and struggle to have a stable sexual relationship or sex at all for that matter. My sympathy for parents who decide to have kids before knowing how to pay for them is vanishingly small as a result. I have sympathy for the kids but none for parents who choose to bring them up in poverty.
What Hurtloam described is, for some, not considered "poverty" but "just reality".
I have been there. You don't think of yourself as "the poor", you just day-to-day try to make ends meet and you think it's normal. You even give to charity and try to help those who have it worse.
Why not have kids, then?
It might be reality for many but it's still poverty.
I'm working class myself. I was brought up with a working class family in one of the poorest counties in the country, 30 years later I still live in the same working class town of little means. I'm very well accustomed with families that live on benefits and have been around them my entire life. When I see kids wearing rags and going hungry I've learned over the years that it's almost always the parents fault and not the state.
Side note: wearing second hand and eating potatoes, cabbage and giblets (or whatever cheap food in your location can be combined into a balanced diet) is not "wearing rags and going hungry" - that's an important part of the equation.
In the time of crisis, however, things collapse despite best efforts.
Now is the time of crisis.
Nades wrote:
What do you mean by why not have kids? I assume me?
I was refering to your words: "they shouldn't have had kids".
18 Dec 2020, 5:31 am
magz wrote:
Nades wrote:
If that's the case they shouldn't have had kids.
Are you trying to say that lower working class should not be allowed to reproduce? This could be your kid's or your grandkid's future.
I have a dim view of humanity/huwomanity.
Quite a surprise, huh?
18 Dec 2020, 5:39 am
18 Dec 2020, 9:20 am
