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Should There Be A Hunter Biden Probe?

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ASPartOfMe
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22 Dec 2020, 5:43 am

Trump made US foreign policy subservient to a domestic matter, specifically a personal interest. That was the abuse of power he was impeached for. No evidence has come out that Clinton's dalliance with the intern affected how he did his job.


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QFT
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22 Dec 2020, 6:38 am

ASPartOfMe wrote:
Trump made US foreign policy subservient to a domestic matter, specifically a personal interest.


That statement follows from the assumption that Hunter Biden is not guilty. Yet people no longer believe that assumption since they are in favor of Hunter Biden being investigated. So if Hunter Biden is, in fact, doing something shady, then there is nothing wrong with Trump trying to investigate it.

Even if he wanted to investigate it for his personal motive, how would this be any different from a cop doing his job in order to earn money for a nice family vacation? It ultimately doesn't matter whether the motive is selfish or not -- what matters is whether one is investigating someone who is actually suspicious or whether one is making a false charge. If in Trumps case it was the former, then he didn't deserve to be impeached over it.



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22 Dec 2020, 7:39 am

You always shade things to the advantage of Trump. I probably shade things to the disadvantage of Trump. Ah...Politics!

As for myself, my feeling about Trump and his Presidency will be reflective of the historians’ assessment: he might beat out Buchanan, but Nixon will come out higher.



Last edited by kraftiekortie on 22 Dec 2020, 11:56 am, edited 1 time in total.

ASPartOfMe
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22 Dec 2020, 9:02 am

QFT wrote:
ASPartOfMe wrote:
Trump made US foreign policy subservient to a domestic matter, specifically a personal interest.


That statement follows from the assumption that Hunter Biden is not guilty. Yet people no longer believe that assumption since they are in favor of Hunter Biden being investigated. So if Hunter Biden is, in fact, doing something shady, then there is nothing wrong with Trump trying to investigate it.

Even if he wanted to investigate it for his personal motive, how would this be any different from a cop doing his job in order to earn money for a nice family vacation? It ultimately doesn't matter whether the motive is selfish or not -- what matters is whether one is investigating someone who is actually suspicious or whether one is making a false charge. If in Trumps case it was the former, then he didn't deserve to be impeached over it.

It has nothing to do whether Hunter Biden is guilty. The cop investigating a criminal is doing his job. Trump’s job is to do things in the national interest not his. What Trump did is a rough equivalent of the NYPD commissioner threatening to withhold intelligence from the Miami police unless they investigate a personal rival.


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kraftiekortie
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22 Dec 2020, 11:57 am

Excellent analogy.

If we allow these sorts of conflicts of interest, our relative democracy will go down the drain.



Tempus Fugit
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22 Dec 2020, 1:38 pm

Hunter Biden should also be impeached. It's only fair.



kraftiekortie
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22 Dec 2020, 2:09 pm

He can't be "impeached." He's not an elected official.

In essence, being "impeached" doesn't mean all that much. All that means is that the person "impeached" has been indicted for/accused of a crime. Far from a conviction.



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22 Dec 2020, 5:11 pm

ASPartOfMe wrote:
It has nothing to do whether Hunter Biden is guilty. The cop investigating a criminal is doing his job. Trump’s job is to do things in the national interest not his.


But wouldn't it be in *national* interest to investigate Hunter Biden if he is, indeed, guilty? So that would be an overlap between national interest and his, when both point in the same direction. With cop it is the same thing. Its also an overlap between national interest (keeping people safe) and his (getting the salary).



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22 Dec 2020, 5:17 pm

Tempus Fugit wrote:
Hunter Biden should also be impeached. It's only fair.


He'll need to become president first and I don't think anyone wants that.


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ASPartOfMe
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22 Dec 2020, 6:46 pm

QFT wrote:
ASPartOfMe wrote:
It has nothing to do whether Hunter Biden is guilty. The cop investigating a criminal is doing his job. Trump’s job is to do things in the national interest not his.


But wouldn't it be in *national* interest to investigate Hunter Biden if he is, indeed, guilty? So that would be an overlap between national interest and his, when both point in the same direction. With cop it is the same thing. Its also an overlap between national interest (keeping people safe) and his (getting the salary).

How would Hunter Biden engaging old fashioned corruption be against the national interest? An exception would be if Hunter's corruption was helping an adversary of the US. If that is the case it is up to the F.B.I. and C.I.A. to launch an investigation.


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22 Dec 2020, 7:53 pm

ASPartOfMe wrote:
QFT wrote:
ASPartOfMe wrote:
It has nothing to do whether Hunter Biden is guilty. The cop investigating a criminal is doing his job. Trump’s job is to do things in the national interest not his.


But wouldn't it be in *national* interest to investigate Hunter Biden if he is, indeed, guilty? So that would be an overlap between national interest and his, when both point in the same direction. With cop it is the same thing. Its also an overlap between national interest (keeping people safe) and his (getting the salary).

How would Hunter Biden engaging old fashioned corruption be against the national interest? An exception would be if Hunter's corruption was helping an adversary of the US. If that is the case it is up to the F.B.I. and C.I.A. to launch an investigation.


If it wasn't affecting national interests they wouldn't be investigating him now.

Simple question: how come when they are investigating Hunter Biden now it is okay, but when Trump tried to order this same kind of investigation it wasn't okay?



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22 Dec 2020, 10:06 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
He was impeached (indicted). He was acquitted. His impeachment is part of history.

Just like Clinton's impeachment cannot be "retracted."

What makes Trump better than Clinton? Why should Trump's impeachment be "retracted," and not Clinton's, too?

Trump is too hung up over the election. He has provided very little actual leadership after the election was over. All he does, it seems, is tweet, and think of crazy ways to overturn the election.

That's not true...he just issued a wave of presidential pardons. Yeah...that buffoon is just proving why he was never qualified to be in office to begin with.



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23 Dec 2020, 12:47 pm

QFT wrote:
ASPartOfMe wrote:
QFT wrote:
ASPartOfMe wrote:
It has nothing to do whether Hunter Biden is guilty. The cop investigating a criminal is doing his job. Trump’s job is to do things in the national interest not his.


But wouldn't it be in *national* interest to investigate Hunter Biden if he is, indeed, guilty? So that would be an overlap between national interest and his, when both point in the same direction. With cop it is the same thing. Its also an overlap between national interest (keeping people safe) and his (getting the salary).

How would Hunter Biden engaging old fashioned corruption be against the national interest? An exception would be if Hunter's corruption was helping an adversary of the US. If that is the case it is up to the F.B.I. and C.I.A. to launch an investigation.


If it wasn't affecting national interests they wouldn't be investigating him now.

Simple question: how come when they are investigating Hunter Biden now it is okay, but when Trump tried to order this same kind of investigation it wasn't okay?

Now the Justice Department is investigating him. Trump said to the Ukrainian President you investigate him or we cut off the aid you need to fight off Russia.


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23 Dec 2020, 1:41 pm

ASPartOfMe wrote:
Now the Justice Department is investigating him. Trump said to the Ukrainian President you investigate him


Why can't both parties investigate him? Since it was done in Ukraine, then it is relevant to Ukrainian president too.

ASPartOfMe wrote:
or we cut off the aid you need to fight off Russia.


But the US isn't obligated to help Ukraine on the first place. First of all, there are arguments on both sides in terms of whom Crimea should belong to. And, secondly, its not American business anyway. So since American involvement in the conflict to begin with was voluntary rather than obligatory, there is nothing wrong with US stopping that voluntary activity for any or no reason.

By the way isn't it a double standard that it is wrong for Ukrainian president to investigate Hunter Biden yet its not wrong for the US to get involved in the conflict between Russia and Ukraine? In fact, I can argue it should be just the opposite. Ukrainian president investigating Hunter Biden is justified, because the activities of Hunter Biden took place in Ukraine, but American involvement in the Crimea situation is not justified since none of this ever took place in the US.



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23 Dec 2020, 5:24 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
Tempus Fugit wrote:
Hunter Biden should also be impeached. It's only fair.


He'll need to become president first and I don't think anyone wants that.


I'd love to see Hunter running against Donald Jr in 2024 :twisted:



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23 Dec 2020, 10:18 pm

I'm sure the Republicans will beat this dead horse the same way they had with Hilary Clinton, despite never finding a thing. Whether Hunter Biden had committed any crime or not, I think it's clear Republican plans to investigate and possibly prosecute him has far more to do with politics than not.
But one thing I'm certain you'll never see in such an investigation is Joe Biden interfering with the legal proceedings the way Trump had during the investigation culminating to his impeachment.


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