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richardbenson
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08 Sep 2007, 12:14 pm

Cyanide wrote:
Yeah I don't see why it shouldn't be.


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Anubis
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08 Sep 2007, 12:16 pm

Legalised, but regulated, just like all other industries. Drug addicted prostitutes should also be taken into rehab. And the trade should only be legal in regulated brothels. Nothing outside there.

Other than that, it's probably better that such a trade is legal and regulated at the same time. At the moment, prostitutes are highly vulnerable on the streets, and are likely to end up dead or abducted if something goes wrong. It's better that prostitution is legal and under control.


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08 Sep 2007, 12:23 pm

Anubis wrote:
And the trade should only be legal in regulated brothels. Nothing outside there.
Why only regulated brothels? This reduces the number of transactions that could occur and can force out competition by increasing the costs of entry. Really, if one can give sex outside of a brothel why not give sex for money? All we do is add a little more to the transaction.
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Other than that, it's probably better that such a trade is legal and regulated at the same time. At the moment, prostitutes are highly vulnerable on the streets, and are likely to end up dead or abducted if something goes wrong. It's better that prostitution is legal and under control.

Prostitutes are likely to end up dead or abducted on the street but they are the ones choosing to work on the street, I see little reason to demand that they must act within how we want them to. Better is a value judgment as well, I might agree with legality but why seek control?



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08 Sep 2007, 1:15 pm

Because it's a risky trade, and at the moment, prostitutes often have no other option but to sell themselves off for sex. By opening legal brothels and regulating the trade, you're ensuring standards. More on this later.


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08 Sep 2007, 1:46 pm

Anubis wrote:
Because it's a risky trade, and at the moment, prostitutes often have no other option but to sell themselves off for sex. By opening legal brothels and regulating the trade, you're ensuring standards. More on this later.

I know it is a risky trade. Technically all human beings have options other than selling themselves for sex, the real question is what makes selling themselves the best option. I am not so sure that it is because of a lack of options so much as the fact that the typical prostitute earns more than the typical architect(fun fact found in Freakonomics pg 106 if one wants to verify). I think that most women will pursue that path because of very expensive habits though given the popularity of the term "crackwhore", and not be quite as driven by necessity but I could be wrong given my lack of knowledge on the particulars of the sex market, I might need to purchase more sexual services to know these people better. I know you ensure standards but I do not see this as necessary.



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08 Sep 2007, 2:23 pm

Awesomelyglorious wrote:
Yes, it should be legalized. I am not sure I support regulation of the industry to any great extent. If sex is a transaction then there are no externalities involved in sexual conduct as both sides are agreeing to risk, the market for sexual services exists with government persecution and really I think it will be more self-regulating if tolerated due to greater ability to specialize.

Not only that but given our societal distrust of prostitution, I think that information seeking tendencies of individuals will be able to compensate for concerns of imperfect information and protection from damage by that, it is true that on some levels we may have a market for lemons, however, better contracts between groups can likely help deal with that, as well as the need to maintain a good reputation in the long-run.

Finally, regulation will only create greater costs of entry or be subsidized in this industry, the former supports less competition which is bad and the latter could be described as evil by many.


surely it should pay taxes? i think it should be legal, and pay taxes (it's not as if it were an unprofitable trade), like any other legal industry (well, except first world agriculture, which is a net recipient of subsidies) - and there must be some level of regulation for it to be possible to tax it. also, safeguards are needed to avoid things like prostitution of minors.


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rideforever
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08 Sep 2007, 2:25 pm

Flagg wrote:
No, you made the choice and consented. You are only a victim if you are forced do something againist your own will or someone does something to you without your consent.


A choice ?!

If you are born into a family with nothing, have no education, no prospects, victim of abuse, what choices do you have ?

I am not sure whether it should be legalised, but there are 2 victims to prostitution :

> the prostitute : will suffer immensely, and I am not talking physically

> the client : probably suffers as well

Quick search on the internet : "Why do women become prostitutes ?"

Answer

--Some have been sexually abused as either children or adults, and see sex in exchange for money as the fair deal. They feel that if they are going to be be mistreated or used by people, they think it's better to get paid for it.

--Some have drug habits, left at a young age from bad home situations or are manipulated into working as prostitutes by boyfriends or other people in order to support that person's parasitic lifestyle. Without an address/driver's license/car/resume, it's hard to find any employment, and they are often desparate.

--Some are regular people who enjoy sex and don't have an issue with earning money for it. Obviously no one was forced to work for Heidi Fleiss or at the legal brothels in Nevada.

Sometimes this is their best option for making money because they are seriously impoverished or in some way unemployable (addiction etc). This is very sad and no woman should ever have to resort to prostitution. On the other hand some women choose to be prostitutes and I think you will have to go to Nevada or some other place where it is legal and ask in person.

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08 Sep 2007, 2:26 pm

skafather84 wrote:
well?

it's a victimless crime. if it were to be legalized, it'd be much safer and there could be standards and checks put into place to maintain safety for all involved. it could bring in more revenue towards local and federal taxes, and it would provide a service to people.


Yes, definitely agree. Not that I like the idea of prostitution, but I don't understand why it's still illegal in many parts of the world. Making it legal could bring advantages, such as earnings from taxes, and safety (since the future "workers" would be checked for STDs in order to "work"). It is imoral, yes, but after all, everyone's free to do whatever they please, as long as nobody gets hurt.



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08 Sep 2007, 3:27 pm

pbcoll wrote:
surely it should pay taxes? i think it should be legal, and pay taxes (it's not as if it were an unprofitable trade), like any other legal industry (well, except first world agriculture, which is a net recipient of subsidies) - and there must be some level of regulation for it to be possible to tax it. also, safeguards are needed to avoid things like prostitution of minors.

Well, yes, I would not exclude it from laws to make it different from other industries. The regulations spoken of by you are significantly different than what one would typically mean by regulation, all you are doing is enforcing pre-existing laws. Minors are below the age of consent for instance. Taxation does not require a large amount of regulation.



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08 Sep 2007, 3:28 pm

gri wrote:
Yes, definitely agree. Not that I like the idea of prostitution, but I don't understand why it's still illegal in many parts of the world. Making it legal could bring advantages, such as earnings from taxes, and safety (since the future "workers" would be checked for STDs in order to "work"). It is imoral, yes, but after all, everyone's free to do whatever they please, as long as nobody gets hurt.

You are for more mandatory regulation than I would support actually. I do not want forced regulations like that, they will likely result anyway so I don't see a reason for the government to get involved.



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08 Sep 2007, 3:38 pm

rideforever wrote:
A choice ?!

If you are born into a family with nothing, have no education, no prospects, victim of abuse, what choices do you have ?
A few choices, there are other entry level jobs, and the armed services could actually be a possibility, there could be other random opportunities based upon location and local services, etc. Prostitution is still a choice within the context of how we view society.

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I am not sure whether it should be legalised, but there are 2 victims to prostitution :

> the prostitute : will suffer immensely, and I am not talking physically

> the client : probably suffers as well
Consent and victimhood are incompatible though. Whether or not the individual will suffer depends on perspective, I can agree with the stance that both groups suffer but that does not mean that they should be denied a choice to do so based upon your opinions. The prostitute and the client both think that they are getting a deal.
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Quick search on the internet : "Why do women become prostitutes ?"

Answer

--Some have been sexually abused as either children or adults, and see sex in exchange for money as the fair deal. They feel that if they are going to be be mistreated or used by people, they think it's better to get paid for it.
Ok, psychological problems are a part of life, why do you think that this site exists. A different problem perhaps but I don't think that all individuals would accept being cured of their problems if given the choice.
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--Some have drug habits, left at a young age from bad home situations or are manipulated into working as prostitutes by boyfriends or other people in order to support that person's parasitic lifestyle. Without an address/driver's license/car/resume, it's hard to find any employment, and they are often desparate.
Yes, and legalization could make it easier for these individuals to fit back into society because they no longer have to live in the underground economy. Nobody is denying that people select what they view to be the best option, however, the drug habit thing is something that I mentioned.
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Sometimes this is their best option for making money because they are seriously impoverished or in some way unemployable (addiction etc). This is very sad and no woman should ever have to resort to prostitution. On the other hand some women choose to be prostitutes and I think you will have to go to Nevada or some other place where it is legal and ask in person.

Ok, it is sad, I am not claiming that prostitution is good but rather that we shouldn't try to place moral controls over society to shape it to our will.



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08 Sep 2007, 3:50 pm

Anubis wrote:
Legalised, but regulated, just like all other industries. Drug addicted prostitutes should also be taken into rehab. And the trade should only be legal in regulated brothels. Nothing outside there.

Other than that, it's probably better that such a trade is legal and regulated at the same time. At the moment, prostitutes are highly vulnerable on the streets, and are likely to end up dead or abducted if something goes wrong. It's better that prostitution is legal and under control.

I also go with that.
I believe there are a few countries that have a system like that, aren't they?


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rideforever
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08 Sep 2007, 3:51 pm

Awesomelyglorious wrote:
we shouldn't try to place moral controls over society to shape it to our will.

Eh ?! The point of a society is to have moral controls.



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08 Sep 2007, 3:51 pm

Here are some ideas to consider:

1. Should the women be drug tested (I'm assuming they will be frequency tested for STD's anyway). This would reduce the chance
they are resorting to this job to support a drug habit(no you can not answer this question by supporting legalization of drugs :) )?

2. A large percent of the women who are hookers are resent immigrants. They are often under false pretences forced to work in the sex industry. Family in their native countries can be threaten by
international organised criminals. So would you support all non-citizens(but legal to work) and conditions on new citizenship to be a prohibition from working in the sex industry?

3. In the US the drinking age is 21. Would you support a higher minimum age for hookers?



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08 Sep 2007, 3:56 pm

rideforever wrote:
Awesomelyglorious wrote:
we shouldn't try to place moral controls over society to shape it to our will.

Eh ?! The point of a society is to have moral controls.


Not the governments job to say whats right and wrong as long as you only harm consenting adults and their property in the process of your existence in society.


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08 Sep 2007, 4:00 pm

I'm not thinking straight at the moment, so I could be completely off on this, but do you think there is a possibility that legalizing prostitution would just make it easier for men to sexually abuse/assault women and get away with it?

It seems like a dangerous lowering of moral standards, to me.

I seriously doubt that any woman who sells her body is doing so entirely of her own free will. And by that, I mean, for any reason not of pathological origin or simply for the desperate need of money.