Can we AS sufferers reproduce with a clean conscience?
Abangyarudo wrote:
I assume he does its like for instance that you can't help someone who doesn't want to be helped. I gather from what he wrote that he has more fruitful relationships then he believes he would have had without AS.
And that's fair enough. I agree with you, you can't help those who don't want to be helped.
But regardless of how much we've resigned ourselves to living with AS, can we still have children and sleep easy at night (changing diapers and feeding babies notwithstanding
When the child is old enough to understand, could we look them in the eye and tell them we knew all along how much they would suffer, but we didn't care because we just wanted to have kids anyway?
gwenevyn wrote:
I can't guarantee they'll like having brown hair or a high IQ or near-sightedness or a slightly bent sternum or anything else that might happen to them.
What's your point?
My point is that we know our kids (or our kids' kids) would suffer from Asperger's. Therefore, would it be conscientious for us to inflict it upon them when they have no say in the matter and knowing full well that it was our fault they were born with the disorder?
Kwiksnax wrote:
gwenevyn wrote:
I can't guarantee they'll like having brown hair or a high IQ or near-sightedness or a slightly bent sternum or anything else that might happen to them.
What's your point?
My point is that we know our kids (or our kids' kids) would suffer from Asperger's. Therefore, would it be conscientious for us to inflict it upon them when they have no say in the matter and knowing full well that it was our fault they were born with the disorder?
Why are you saying "we" for? I am me. You are you.
Are you from autism speaks or something? They like to speak for others.
The world never stays the same.
_________________
I am the DAN Monster. I have your child. You owe me twenty five thousand dollars.
xx Dan Monster
Kitsy wrote:
Also, I'm very skeptical of someone with small post counts that come in attempting to cleanse the gene pool of people with AS.
Suggesting I'm a net troll here to stir up trouble?
No, more like I'm a 25 year old narcissist who was recently crushed to discover his AS condition, and to have his entire world view and life plans thrown into chaos by the realization that his defective genes make him an unviable parent.
Kwiksnax wrote:
Kitsy wrote:
Also, I'm very skeptical of someone with small post counts that come in attempting to cleanse the gene pool of people with AS.
Suggesting I'm a net troll here to stir up trouble?
No, more like I'm a 25 year old narcissist who was recently crushed to discover his AS condition, and to have his entire world view and life plans thrown into chaos by the realization that his defective genes make him an unviable parent.
only in your own mind maybe you need to change your perception of what AS is. From the research I did into it which leads me to believe I have it which is why I'm getting tested soon all it is is a different wiring which means that you are a standout from the crowd. Wouldn't a self proclaimed narcissist enjoy that because its even more reason to bask in your own glory. Honestly whether or not I have as I will still think of myself as the greatest single thing to grace this generation.
Kwiksnax wrote:
Kitsy wrote:
Also, I'm very skeptical of someone with small post counts that come in attempting to cleanse the gene pool of people with AS.
Suggesting I'm a net troll here to stir up trouble?
No, more like I'm a 25 year old narcissist who was recently crushed to discover his AS condition, and to have his entire world view and life plans thrown into chaos by the realization that his defective genes make him an unviable parent.
So because you got diagnosed you cannot see anything positive about your life and everything is different?
I will give you the benefit of a doubt. Stick around here longer. I've learned more being here and unlike what some people have suggested to me about how I should be wallowing (not from this forum) I would much rather take my life here on earth and accept the good with the bad.
If you take a look at our social structure, all of the things that are important now won't be important in the near future.
_________________
I am the DAN Monster. I have your child. You owe me twenty five thousand dollars.
xx Dan Monster
Kwiksnax wrote:
Kitsy wrote:
Why are you saying "we" for? I am me. You are you.
Because we, you and I, both know that our descendants would be likely to suffer what we've suffered.
You know what made me suffer the most? A messed up childhood.
You know what has made me twist alot of negatives into something positive? My brain.
I'm okay with being me now.
_________________
I am the DAN Monster. I have your child. You owe me twenty five thousand dollars.
xx Dan Monster
Kitsy wrote:
If you take a look at our social structure, all of the things that are important now won't be important in the near future.
On the contrary, peak oil and global warming mean we shall gradually return to an agrarian lifestyle. Agrarian = communal. Communal = AS people are f**ked!
Kitsy wrote:
You know what has made me twist alot of negatives into something positive? My brain.
I'm okay with being me now.
That's awesome, and I'm truly happy for you. Unfortunately, my career isn't looking so bright. Now I have to watch my High School and University friends charge even further ahead while I wallow behind as the poor, pitiful guy who couldn't cut it in the real world because he went crazy.
Yeah yeah yeah, disability is a state of mind. Sure.
Kwiksnax wrote:
Kitsy wrote:
If you take a look at our social structure, all of the things that are important now won't be important in the near future.
On the contrary, peak oil and global warming mean we shall gradually return to an agrarian lifestyle. Agrarian = communal. Communal = AS people are f**ked!
_________________
I am the DAN Monster. I have your child. You owe me twenty five thousand dollars.
xx Dan Monster
Kwiksnax wrote:
Kitsy wrote:
You know what has made me twist alot of negatives into something positive? My brain.
I'm okay with being me now.
That's awesome, and I'm truly happy for you. Unfortunately, my career isn't looking so bright. Now I have to watch my High School and University friends charge even further ahead while I wallow behind as the poor, pitiful guy who couldn't cut it in the real world because he went crazy.
Yeah yeah yeah, disability is a state of mind. Sure.
there are people with what you view as a disability who have had successful careers and furfilling lives. You can either choose to let it ruin you or exalt you but thats just my opinion. I'd rather be exalted personally ...
Abangyarudo wrote:
Honestly whether or not I have as I will still think of myself as the greatest single thing to grace this generation.
That's cool, but I'd rather actually be great than just fool myself into thinking I'm great while everyone else in society merely tolerates me and the burdens I bring.
Kwiksnax wrote:
Kitsy wrote:
You know what has made me twist alot of negatives into something positive? My brain.
I'm okay with being me now.
That's awesome, and I'm truly happy for you. Unfortunately, my career isn't looking so bright. Now I have to watch my High School and University friends charge even further ahead while I wallow behind as the poor, pitiful guy who couldn't cut it in the real world because he went crazy.
Yeah yeah yeah, disability is a state of mind. Sure.
What are your exact problems? Explain. Elaborate. Be specific.
_________________
I am the DAN Monster. I have your child. You owe me twenty five thousand dollars.
xx Dan Monster
techstepgenr8tion
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Kwiksnax wrote:
Let's face it, as much as we try to rationalize our condition and make productive lives for ourselves, we AS sufferers are defective people.
There is a genetic component to AS, so any children we have shall carry the genes that cause our affliction. All the awkwardness we've suffered throughout our lives, all the pain of exclusion and confusion, all the unfairness we face in school and work shall be passed on to the next generation(s) should we choose to have kids. So, knowing this, should we thus deliberately inflict our disorder onto our descendants? Or would it be more socially responsible to let our disorder die with us?
In our case, having kids and raising a family would be a selfish act. We would be doing it for ourselves alone. We would be inflicting our disorder onto the next generation to satisfy our parental instincts. How many of us, given the choice, would choose to have AS over being NT? Not many, if we're honest about it. But our children wouldn't have that choice, just as we didn't have that choice.
Most of us fundamentally dislike who and what we are, and with good cause. We have very little to offer society in real terms. Having intelligence is useless if you lack the social skills to share your gifts with others. Now we've all heard the happy-clappy rhetoric about how everyone is special and everyone has something to offer and people should just accept one another for who they are, but we know in our hearts that this is just the mewling of weaklings and freaks, trying desperately to assuage their despair and rage at being the objects of derision and ridicule to all those around them.
Well, fortunately for the human gene pool, our condition severely limits our opportunities to reproduce anyway. Regardless, would any of you say it is socially irresponsible and cruel for AS sufferers to have children?
There is a genetic component to AS, so any children we have shall carry the genes that cause our affliction. All the awkwardness we've suffered throughout our lives, all the pain of exclusion and confusion, all the unfairness we face in school and work shall be passed on to the next generation(s) should we choose to have kids. So, knowing this, should we thus deliberately inflict our disorder onto our descendants? Or would it be more socially responsible to let our disorder die with us?
In our case, having kids and raising a family would be a selfish act. We would be doing it for ourselves alone. We would be inflicting our disorder onto the next generation to satisfy our parental instincts. How many of us, given the choice, would choose to have AS over being NT? Not many, if we're honest about it. But our children wouldn't have that choice, just as we didn't have that choice.
Most of us fundamentally dislike who and what we are, and with good cause. We have very little to offer society in real terms. Having intelligence is useless if you lack the social skills to share your gifts with others. Now we've all heard the happy-clappy rhetoric about how everyone is special and everyone has something to offer and people should just accept one another for who they are, but we know in our hearts that this is just the mewling of weaklings and freaks, trying desperately to assuage their despair and rage at being the objects of derision and ridicule to all those around them.
Well, fortunately for the human gene pool, our condition severely limits our opportunities to reproduce anyway. Regardless, would any of you say it is socially irresponsible and cruel for AS sufferers to have children?
I have a feeling we could probably work on the Palestinian/Israeli conflict and come up with a unanimous and workable answer about as fast.
From what I understand it seems to be hit and miss - usually though if you have a few kids you'll still have some NTs along with some aspies or auties. The trouble with looking at it sheerly like this though, like gwen pointed out in a sense, there's hardly anyone out there who doesn't have some sort of health defect and its a gamble no matter what. When you really look at it though, no matter who you are or in what part of our red-taped social cast system we have in this world, I don't think anyone's really free. The sorts of happy clappy illusions that a lot of people broadcast about uniquness (which makes me want to gag half the time as well) really don't seem to be too far off from what people do in general and the fact that we'd put ego over the idea of spreading something that really is in far more cases than not a disability seems right in line with what any other group of people would do. Bringing kids into this world period is a weird choice when you think about it and really comes down to needs - after all its not such a great place to be in general, some people are able to gloss that over or are able to see around it and still have a rosy outlook but then again that's almost the sort of distortion people need to procreate at all.
To address your question more directly though - I think we'd do best if we were able to find the right NT partners, just to keep the AS genes from being too concentrated; they're helpful in small doses but rather caustic when pooled too intensely. Our whole society's "like meets like" idea where anything else would just fall apart and people can't make things work or grow to understand each other any other way - that's a cultural problem that's really causing people with the same genes to get together just because, whether its an NT subgroup or us, the natural inclination is to go that way because its the easiest. If we could, as a society, see what we're doing to ourselves with that we'd probably be much more apt to fix the whole "alpha is god" thing in our romance world - we've learned enough from breeding dogs to see what happens when you start making purebreds. Whether its people who's neurology keeps them socially crippled or its people who are in jail for life just because they're too badass for their own good to be on the outside, I think both of those particular ends like many others were created much in the same manner.
Kwiksnax wrote:
Abangyarudo wrote:
Honestly whether or not I have as I will still think of myself as the greatest single thing to grace this generation.
That's cool, but I'd rather actually be great than just fool myself into thinking I'm great while everyone else in society merely tolerates me and the burdens I bring.
I am great no matter what diagnosis or label anyone can attach to me. Most people who would have had to deal with my life would have let it ruin them and thats without a diagnosis. I suffered horrible horrible depression and I tried to take my life 3 times. Third time I said to myself either I suceed or I make my life what I wanted to be. I failed again or maybe I acually reverse succeeded but in the end I sat down and made a list of what I do not like about myself, what I wanted to be better, and the characteristics that I felt I didn't have that I wanted to. I did alot of personal work on myself the hardest being reprogramming how I think, calming my natural fiery temper , and seeing the postive side of things. Instead of being a suicide statistic I went from someone who loathed himself to someone who knows that life is what you make it. I wanted to make it great and honestly now it is does stuff still happen that gets me down? yea but in the end I worked hard to make my life what is it and anytime my life isn't what I wish it to be then its time for me to work hard to make it what I want it to be. So I don't think I'm great I know I'm great because noone has the willpower, charm, intellect, sexiness, and honor that Brandon has.
