What do you think about abortion

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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9kCyqBKewr4[/youtube]This is so true!! ! Conservatives want to raise babies to be dead soldiers!

back around 1939 and 1940 it was Conservatives who wanted the U.S. to stay out of any European wars. If the Japanese had not bombed Pearl Harbor the U.S. might have remained neutral in WW2. The America First folks had no desire whatsoever to waste treasure or blood in the European war.

ruveyn

If my mother, in this hypothetical scenario, pulled the plug on me, it would kill me. She would be taking direct action to end my life, and she would be completely within her rights to do so. It doesn't matter how the initial hook-up of mother to zef (or adult offspring) happened.

I do not see how this relates to women's rights except that it makes them out to be better than the fetuses in their womb. Not sure why women go before the ones who will be children. Children should be protected and celebrated not "burned at the stake"

Obviously my point of relating abortion and adoption together has fell on deaf ears and it seems most people are not open to the truth. A truth you do not need proof of. Murder is the killing of any living thing regardless of if its animal, human, half-human, alien, whatever it is. So you are basically saying that a fetus has no rights and it is just garbage to be thrown away on a whim. I find it hard to swallow that murder is humanitarian. I mean if you think you are sparing these soon to be humans from a life of hell. How do you know if that child will live a life of hell. What.... are you a fortune teller all of a sudden. Clairvoyent? Didn't think so.. I am against abortion the same as I am against the killing of criminals. Killing is wrong period and should never occur unless absolutely necessary. I mean if you know a baby is dying in a womb this is necessary. I believe in abortion only if the baby will literally not survive or it is suffering in some way because of some medical condition where they have to be on life support and will not live more than a few hours. Then and only then is abortion something to be considered. Just my opinion.

Why would someone want to try and prove a way to make murder okay.

How is what I am saying selfish. Only god or a higher power has the ability to choose who or what should live and who or what should die. We cannot choose that if a woman miscarries the baby it is god's will. If a mother kills their unborn child that is man's will and not god's. Basically my argument is on the grounds that all god's children deserve to be here. Even if you are born to s**t you need to learn to be grateful. Sparing someone a life that may be bad does not justify the murder of innocents. We just do not know with any certainty who will suffer and who will not. Do you really want to take that risk that a person could grow to be able to survive in this world.

The road to hell is paved with good intentions. Everyone needs to remember this line. The good intentions of sparing innocents from a life even if its not pleasant will only lead to hell.

Do not take this a religious stance because it is not. I am not religious but I do still believe in some god and I know that that god who probably created us does not take these choices lightly. To keep someone from this world and its wonder is wrong on so many levels. It would take pages upon pages of proof as to why every body should get a chance to live in this world no matter how messed up their life becomes because it jsut is preparing for the peace that will most likely occir upon death. You will exist forever. Do we know if when a fetus dies that a soul was not created and by doing the abortion you probably damn that soul to eternal torment. Did anyone ever consider that. It is a belief and cannot be proven. It is what I believe and I don't need to explain or prove that to anyone.

I am privileged because I am alive. Everyone who is alive is privileged. You can be rich and not own one thing. You have to learn to make due with what you have if you grow up without a home or with a home. It does not matter. Everyone needs to embrace this world and no matter what hardship there is you can still be grateful for life itself.

I have been beaten down by life and choices over and over. I have tried to destroy myself but you cannot destroy your soul. It is unending and will endure the most grossest punishment. I am here as a testament that life can happen even in your darkest days or hours. Not everyone is so lucky but they have to make due with what they have.

My point was just to say that maybe someone thought I was being unrealistic and not understanding that adoption does not always happen for everyone. Some never find a family but I bet if they asked this person if they would have rather been aborted in the heart they would say no because every human. People may say why do I deserve this life and I deserved to be aborted. That person needs to find help and there needs to be a hand to help. We need to advocate for more of the welathy to adopt children there are enough families and loving people it is just that people are being selfish and we need to push more people to adopt if they have the means. Instead of the government funding instruments of destruction they need to focus their enrgy on helping ourselves and this country. The rest of the world does not matter. As a nation we need to start taking of ourselves and our own poor instead of forcing them into ghettoes and slums.

If you want to deface what I have said than go right ahead because that is your choice as a human being. I will not hold it against you because there is no reason for hate. I do not honestly hate anyone and I respect what everyone else thinks.

Well, of course you don't see it.




They don't even need to be "better" than the fetus to deserve the right to abort.

If we forced the woman to go through pregnancy, then we wouldn't be talking of the fetus as a "human being" or "person", but as some sort of super human being, that somehow has far more rights than other people.

You cannot force people through law to donate organs because "other people without organs WILL DIE and "every life deserves to exist". It would be ridiculous. Of course, enforced pregnancy is not exactly the same - It is a lot worse, because you are donating far more than just some organs.

Although the early fetus is by no measure anything close to a "human being" that deserves ANY right whatsoever. This argument is not necessary to justify making abortion legal AND a basic right. (In fact, Abortion should be free). As you can see, even if that thing was a human being, to force another human being to go through pregnancy would be a total abuse. A person's rights end where the rights of others begin.

Or we could use your logic. If by any chance you have two kidneys, then, according to your logic, you are a murderer. You could have donated one of your kidneys and stop some person from dying.

It does not follow from your example that your mother would be justified in shooting you, or snipping your spine or in destroying your body with a high powered vacuum cleaner, or slicing you up, or salt poisoning you or another.... Abortion is not the removal of life support, it is the termination of a human life. It seems you entirely missed my point.

So if you removed the fetus as a whole, without physically damaging it, and then let it die by himself because of his physical functions not being able to keep it alive on its own, it would be ok because then you are not killing it, but simply watching it die by himself?

Actually a very good point and I will take that on board. I would however argue that there is a significant duty of care involved in the case of pregnant mother as distinct from an every day social or familial relationship due to the mothers' role in being a causal agent. In any circumstance where the abortion is caused by the same person who created the human life, then it follows from that the circumstances would still be different from the example LKL gave.

Pregnancy is the natural order of life. The natural order of things does not care about your rights. Everything has a right to live.

Every living thing should have equal rights. I agree with women's rights I just do not think that being able to abort a baby should be a choice. Just my opinion. If you want to argue with me it will make no difference. I am not you. I am done trying to convince you because there is no point. As you can see no one can change another person's views. You can think I ma some kind of anti-women's rights person but I believe a woman is equal to a man. Everyone should be equal including anything that would become a human being.

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What meaningful difference is there between her mother pulling out a cable and her mother shooting her?

Would you be fine with women taking drugs to induce pregnancy at 18 weeks? That would only withdraw life support rather than actively killing the foetus.

Also is dying from preventable disease. Humans aren't supposed to fly, either.

This is BS. In nature nothing has the right to live. No lion goes to jail for killing an elephant.

Human law is a way by which we go over the silly laws of nature. We extend them by adding rules of our own and rights of our own.


Nope, that fly is annoying me, I will squash it. Living is a very easy thing to do, and I don't think that just "living" entitles anything to have rights. In our law system it certainly isn't true.


It is a fetus. Not a baby.


I am not arguing with you to change your opinion.

I am arguing with you so that other people know that you are utterly wrong.

Honestly I think you have some serious problems and I am not going to sit here and take this abuse. I have a right to say what I want and do whatever I want. Its called freedom of expression and freedom of speech.

If you want to sit there and say a human does not have a right to live than you need professional help. baby, fetus its all semantics. It is life period.

And I said that nature doesn't care about you or any human for that matter. Disrespect nature and it will disrespect you. Nature will fight back to protect itself. This is not our world because it does not belong to anyone or anything. This world has been here a heck of a lot longer than us and will continue to be here long after we are extinct. And man only knows how to destroy and take. We will take until there is nothing left to take and then nature will rise up to take its property.

This is above you or me or anyone else. Nature is god and god is nature. That is my belief. I do not believe in some god you worship in a church. The world is the church.

At the same time there is human nature which is entirely separate from nature in general. It is not surprising that people destroy fetuses because that is all humans are capable of in the end. Destruction.

I do not believe in killing anything for any reason. I do not believe in war and I do not believe in this society. The only society I will condone is one not tied to an economical social structure or one that does not condone the killing of innocents.

You are probably the same person that believes in the vivisection of animals to further human scientific study. People who condone death for scientific study are just as bad as the doctors in nazi Germany. experimenting on human fetuses, and animals is wrong, unethical and should be illegal. Basing scientific research on animal testing does not apply to human disease.

Abortion is immoral and unethical.

Honestly nobody is really wrong here. I am not going to argue with you about what you believe in. Do whatever you want. But to use your response as a way to defame or otherwise slander me is not acceptable and I will not allow it to continue.

I have no problem with you or what you believe. If anyone wants to push me to silence it will not work. I do not have time for games. I feel I have been disrespected. I was being pretty dang nice to you and I was not jumping all over anyone in this thread. You obviously misunderstood my stance on this issue.

People will argue for or against abortion until the end of mankind. Nothing will change as long as society continues to fall apart and collapse under its own weight. Mankind can no longer contain itself from imploding. The road to hell is paved with good intentions. "Saving" something from being born is no one's choice to make. Just my opinion. You are entitled to believe what you want and say what you want.

Abortion is just the prologue of things to come. It is just another form of population control. Maybe I am crazy. I have no proof to back up my arguments because there is no way to prove something that is being disguised and hidden. We are blind to the truth. And when your back is against the wall maybe then people will believe that society is a lie created by governments to instill fear, obedience and to spread propaganda. America is a nation built on the suffering of others. In fact, its entire inception had to do with declaring war on the natives and annihilating as many as they could. The history books paint a far different picture than what was really going. The natives were fighting against a takeover and their very existence was threatened. What did people expect them to do just lie down and take it. What would you do if someone came into your house and said this is now my property. America continues its legacy of brutality even today. We are a colonial nation that continues to sat we are right because we stand for Democracy. Democracy is not about the free it is about the few and the rich. Democracy has no room for the poor and the destitute. The reason why abortion has become viable is because America no longer can handle the rampant poverty and unemployment. So abortion is just a stop gap a way for Amrica to have less births and thus less poor. This is a guise to hide the governments true purpose to eliminat the weak the poor, the mentally ill. Unfortunately where do you think Autism lies. They continue to fail to recognize us as a minority and refuse to give us the respect any minority deserves. Any attack or statement that paints aspies in a bad light is discrimination and is a hate crime. We cannot change the fact that we have this condition any more than a person that is black can change their skin color. The next on the list is the idea of the fetus and that human rights do not apply to it. I totally disagree and think this is wrong.

The idea that humans have a right to live is a different concept and belief than what popular opinion believes based on this issue. I think people need to consider if a human has a right to live and breath. I think that this should also be extended to fetuses that are yet "human". To try and argue that the fetus is not human makes no sense. The fetus is not an unknown organism and has a developed body. Maybe it has no thought process or understanding but it still is a living thing that has every right to be here.

The same people that disrespect the fetus by killing it are the same people that believe in the slaughtering of the smallest organism. Murder is a wa y of life for most people and they have no qualms and quashing a thing. And to most people a fetus is a thing.

How is what the doctors are doing to unborn fetuses any different than a mother doing it herself and then putting it in their trash behind their apartment. If a woman did that you would be disgusted and repulsed. I would cross the street just to avoid a person who would commit this act.

My argument is not any different than what the pro-lifers are arguing. We demand that the human fetus be given a right to live and only under extreme circumstances should a fetus be "killed". The rules should be very strict. And if anyone tries to abort on their own it would be equal to the stiffest manslaughter sentence.

Someone actually told me I was wrong and that they were going to prove me wrong. I guess if you want you can go up against all the pro-lifers out there. I mean I like to see people try to prove that they are right on something that has a moral standing and ethical standing. We will not back down from our belief just as much as Pro-choice will not back off.