2020 Election Fraud Roundup
13 Nov 2020, 12:48 am
More fraud news from the BBC: US election security officials reject Trump's fraud claims
Quote:
US federal election officials have said the 2020 White House vote was the "most secure in American history", rejecting President Donald Trump's fraud claims.
"There is no evidence that any voting system deleted or lost votes, changed votes, or was in any way compromised," the committee announced.
They spoke out after Mr Trump claimed without proof 2.7 million votes for him were "deleted" in last week's election...
"There is no evidence that any voting system deleted or lost votes, changed votes, or was in any way compromised," the committee announced.
They spoke out after Mr Trump claimed without proof 2.7 million votes for him were "deleted" in last week's election...
13 Nov 2020, 1:13 am
No evidence of US election fraud, says coalition of federal and state officials
Quote:
A coalition of US federal and state officials have said they have no evidence that votes were compromised or altered in last week’s presidential election, rejecting unsubstantiated claims of widespread fraud advanced by Donald Trump and many of his supporters.
The statement from cybersecurity experts, which trumpeted the 3 November election as the most secure in American history, amounted to the most direct repudiation to date of the outgoing president’s efforts to undermine the integrity of the contest...
...The statement’s authors include the presidents of the National Association of State Election Directors and the National Association of Secretaries of State – who run elections at the state level – and the executive committee of the government-industry coordinating council that includes all the major voting equipment vendors.
The statement from cybersecurity experts, which trumpeted the 3 November election as the most secure in American history, amounted to the most direct repudiation to date of the outgoing president’s efforts to undermine the integrity of the contest...
...The statement’s authors include the presidents of the National Association of State Election Directors and the National Association of Secretaries of State – who run elections at the state level – and the executive committee of the government-industry coordinating council that includes all the major voting equipment vendors.
auntblabby
Veteran
Joined: 12 Feb 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 115,167
Location: the island of defective toy santas
15 Nov 2020, 10:01 am
Trump’s new focus on electronic voting machines is, in my opinion, a valid concern. Voters can’t be sure that these machines are recording votes fairly and accurately. There are also security issues that do not exist with physical ballots. I don’t think there’s any evidence that these machines led to the result changing, but the very fact that they can be questioned makes them less suitable than physical ballots that people can have confidence in.
That said, Trump is also trying to question the physical ballots, so I don’t for a second think he’s motivated by genuine concerns about election security. But there are genuine concerns. We deserve to be able to have confidence in our elections, and electronic voting does not give us that confidence.
15 Nov 2020, 5:29 pm
The_Walrus wrote:
Trump’s new focus on electronic voting machines is, in my opinion, a valid concern. Voters can’t be sure that these machines are recording votes fairly and accurately. There are also security issues that do not exist with physical ballots. I don’t think there’s any evidence that these machines led to the result changing, but the very fact that they can be questioned makes them less suitable than physical ballots that people can have confidence in.
That said, Trump is also trying to question the physical ballots, so I don’t for a second think he’s motivated by genuine concerns about election security. But there are genuine concerns. We deserve to be able to have confidence in our elections, and electronic voting does not give us that confidence.
That said, Trump is also trying to question the physical ballots, so I don’t for a second think he’s motivated by genuine concerns about election security. But there are genuine concerns. We deserve to be able to have confidence in our elections, and electronic voting does not give us that confidence.
I'm willing to bet the machines are more reliable than human counting, and a damn sight easier to calibrate correctly before counting, and double check again after counting. The Trump team had every opportunity to object to the choice of particular machines or processes in the different States well in advance, but instead approved them, right up to the point when they started losing.
I work in the rail industry where there's always a similar debate over driverless trains. Everyone likes having a human presence "up front" in case something goes wrong. But in practice the thing most likely to go wrong is the human.
15 Nov 2020, 6:18 pm
Perhaps the first of many...
https://thepointnews.uk/2020/11/15/bide ... ral-fraud/
The Democrat Director of Texas state political strategy for the Joe Biden Presidential campaign has been arrested for electoral fraud.
Democratic Party operative Dallas Jones was formally accused of helping to run an illegal ballot harvesting operation in the state of Texas on behalf of the Joe Biden campaign during this contested Presidential election.
According to the National File, two investigators, including a former FBI agent and former police officer, testified under oath that they have Democratic Party internal documentation, as well as video evidence and witnesses, for their investigation.
_________________
Behold! we are not bound for ever to the circles of the world, and beyond them is more than memory, Farewell!
15 Nov 2020, 6:30 pm
Mikah wrote:
Perhaps the first of many...
https://thepointnews.uk/2020/11/15/bide ... ral-fraud/
The Democrat Director of Texas state political strategy for the Joe Biden Presidential campaign has been arrested for electoral fraud.
Democratic Party operative Dallas Jones was formally accused of helping to run an illegal ballot harvesting operation in the state of Texas on behalf of the Joe Biden campaign during this contested Presidential election.
According to the National File, two investigators, including a former FBI agent and former police officer, testified under oath that they have Democratic Party internal documentation, as well as video evidence and witnesses, for their investigation.
https://thepointnews.uk/2020/11/15/bide ... ral-fraud/
The Democrat Director of Texas state political strategy for the Joe Biden Presidential campaign has been arrested for electoral fraud.
Democratic Party operative Dallas Jones was formally accused of helping to run an illegal ballot harvesting operation in the state of Texas on behalf of the Joe Biden campaign during this contested Presidential election.
According to the National File, two investigators, including a former FBI agent and former police officer, testified under oath that they have Democratic Party internal documentation, as well as video evidence and witnesses, for their investigation.
Or perhaps not?
Being accused is VERY different from being guilty.
Lots of fools around at the moment who can't seem to tell the difference.
16 Nov 2020, 2:47 pm
Mikah wrote:
Perhaps the first of many...
https://thepointnews.uk/2020/11/15/bide ... ral-fraud/
The Democrat Director of Texas state political strategy for the Joe Biden Presidential campaign has been arrested for electoral fraud.
Democratic Party operative Dallas Jones was formally accused of helping to run an illegal ballot harvesting operation in the state of Texas on behalf of the Joe Biden campaign during this contested Presidential election.
According to the National File, two investigators, including a former FBI agent and former police officer, testified under oath that they have Democratic Party internal documentation, as well as video evidence and witnesses, for their investigation.
https://thepointnews.uk/2020/11/15/bide ... ral-fraud/
The Democrat Director of Texas state political strategy for the Joe Biden Presidential campaign has been arrested for electoral fraud.
Democratic Party operative Dallas Jones was formally accused of helping to run an illegal ballot harvesting operation in the state of Texas on behalf of the Joe Biden campaign during this contested Presidential election.
According to the National File, two investigators, including a former FBI agent and former police officer, testified under oath that they have Democratic Party internal documentation, as well as video evidence and witnesses, for their investigation.
Misleading propaganda. Dallas Jones the political representative from Texas has been ACCUSED of fraud. They have a written CLAIM that someone CLAIMS they saw fraud, with no actual PROOF of fraud other than a CLAIM. Article claims "Dallas Jones" has been arrested over this. He has not. This is being conflated with another individual also named Dallas Jones, who was arrested and released over a public disturbance incident. They are two different people with the same name.
16 Nov 2020, 7:36 pm
The only thing that Mr. Trump's attorneys have delivered is a ridiculous mishmash of lawsuits that run the gamut from weak to entirely meritless to downright frivolous. Mr. Trump and his attorneys are not only humiliating themselves, they are damaging our democracy in the process. Mr. Trump, his campaign and his surrogates have been absolutely pummeled in the courts.
One of the great things about our legal system is that it requires actual proof -- not tweets, not public statements, not viral videos -- but actual, verifiable, material evidence. Mr. Trump's efforts to create evidence of voter fraud out of nothing more than rumor, innuendo, and suspicion have failed spectacularly.
Within just the last seven days, the Trump campaign and its lawyers have either lost or voluntarily dropped nine different cases in one day -- they have even begun to withdraw their own lawsuits, giving up on their case in Arizona and dropping their appeal of a loss in Nevada; and, on Monday, his followers dropped their lawsuits seeking to contest election results in Georgia, Michigan, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin.
Even the lawyers are jumping ship; multiple firms have now abandoned the Trump campaign's effort to dispute the election results. Judges have tossed out the preposterously infirm lawsuits nearly as quickly as Mr. Trump's attorneys have filed them; as a result, our judiciary has rightly prevented the bogus "massive fraud" narrative from taking any further hold than it already has gathered from the wild pronouncements of Mr. Trump and his enablers.
Those lawyers eagerly bringing these lawsuits deserve derision for their stubborn, pathetic attempts to conjure massive fraud where no such thing exists, and for also doing something even more insidious: they are undermining public confidence in our election system and our democratic process.
I hope President Biden and Vice-President Harris will undo every blunder and failure of the Trump administration, and restore America's faith in due democratic process. They have only four short years to accomplish this feat. Will it be time enough?
_________________
The mere fact that science may not yet adequately explain an object, event, or experience does not mean the immediate explanation should automatically default to a conspiratorial, extraterrestrial, paranormal, or supernatural cause.
16 Nov 2020, 8:26 pm
Fnord wrote:
The only thing that Mr. Trump's attorneys have delivered is a ridiculous mishmash of lawsuits that run the gamut from weak to entirely meritless to downright frivolous. Mr. Trump and his attorneys are not only humiliating themselves, they are damaging our democracy in the process. Mr. Trump, his campaign and his surrogates have been absolutely pummeled in the courts.
One of the great things about our legal system is that it requires actual proof -- not tweets, not public statements, not viral videos -- but actual, verifiable, material evidence. Mr. Trump's efforts to create evidence of voter fraud out of nothing more than rumor, innuendo, and suspicion have failed spectacularly.
Within just the last seven days, the Trump campaign and its lawyers have either lost or voluntarily dropped nine different cases in one day -- they have even begun to withdraw their own lawsuits, giving up on their case in Arizona and dropping their appeal of a loss in Nevada; and, on Monday, his followers dropped their lawsuits seeking to contest election results in Georgia, Michigan, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin.
Even the lawyers are jumping ship; multiple firms have now abandoned the Trump campaign's effort to dispute the election results. Judges have tossed out the preposterously infirm lawsuits nearly as quickly as Mr. Trump's attorneys have filed them; as a result, our judiciary has rightly prevented the bogus "massive fraud" narrative from taking any further hold than it already has gathered from the wild pronouncements of Mr. Trump and his enablers.
Those lawyers eagerly bringing these lawsuits deserve derision for their stubborn, pathetic attempts to conjure massive fraud where no such thing exists, and for also doing something even more insidious: they are undermining public confidence in our election system and our democratic process.
I hope President Biden and Vice-President Harris will undo every blunder and failure of the Trump administration, and restore America's faith in due democratic process. They have only four short years to accomplish this feat. Will it be time enough?
One of the great things about our legal system is that it requires actual proof -- not tweets, not public statements, not viral videos -- but actual, verifiable, material evidence. Mr. Trump's efforts to create evidence of voter fraud out of nothing more than rumor, innuendo, and suspicion have failed spectacularly.
Within just the last seven days, the Trump campaign and its lawyers have either lost or voluntarily dropped nine different cases in one day -- they have even begun to withdraw their own lawsuits, giving up on their case in Arizona and dropping their appeal of a loss in Nevada; and, on Monday, his followers dropped their lawsuits seeking to contest election results in Georgia, Michigan, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin.
Even the lawyers are jumping ship; multiple firms have now abandoned the Trump campaign's effort to dispute the election results. Judges have tossed out the preposterously infirm lawsuits nearly as quickly as Mr. Trump's attorneys have filed them; as a result, our judiciary has rightly prevented the bogus "massive fraud" narrative from taking any further hold than it already has gathered from the wild pronouncements of Mr. Trump and his enablers.
Those lawyers eagerly bringing these lawsuits deserve derision for their stubborn, pathetic attempts to conjure massive fraud where no such thing exists, and for also doing something even more insidious: they are undermining public confidence in our election system and our democratic process.
I hope President Biden and Vice-President Harris will undo every blunder and failure of the Trump administration, and restore America's faith in due democratic process. They have only four short years to accomplish this feat. Will it be time enough?
It is curious, then, that staff from the legal firm defending against one of the currently running cases has been caught harrassing the legal firm behind the case:
Quote:
On November 14, 2020 at 8:43am, an attorney at Kirkland & Ellis left a one-minute voicemail for undersigned counsel. The voicemail, which has been provided to counsel of record from Kirkland & Ellis in this case and will be provided to the Court via email upon request, speaks for itself and by any measure falls afoul of standards of professional conduct. Local Rule 83.23.2 adopts a Code of Professional Conduct for practitioners in this district which includes a commitment to “treat with civility and respect the lawyers, clients, opposing parties, the court and all the officials with whom I work.” LR 83.23.2 also adopts the Pennsylvania Rules of Professional Conduct, the preamble to which states that “[a] lawyer should demonstrate respect for the legal system and for those who serve it, including judges, other lawyers and public officials.” Preamble ¶ 5. But if there needs to be a rule saying that Kirkland & Ellis associates should not call opposing counsel and leave an abusive voicemail then all hope is lost.
Source: https://www.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.pamd.127057/gov.uscourts.pamd.127057.131.0.pdf
If the cases are as "meritless", or "frivolous" as some claim, then why is so much effort being made to harrass the legal firms behind them, or such efforts being made to denounce the cases before a judge has had an opportunity to rule on them?
Similarly, following constitutionally permitted and legally defined procedures is not going to "damage democracy", but instead demonstrates that the democratic system works. Attempting to prevent access to these legal and constitutionally permitted procedures is a much greater threat to democracy than a court case challenging certain actions related to an election's procedure\outcome. Similarly, attempting to crown a "winner" before the requisite steps have been completed shows disdain for the democratic process as a whole.
16 Nov 2020, 9:26 pm
Brictoria wrote:
Fnord wrote:
The only thing that Mr. Trump's attorneys have delivered is a ridiculous mishmash of lawsuits that run the gamut from weak to entirely meritless to downright frivolous. Mr. Trump and his attorneys are not only humiliating themselves, they are damaging our democracy in the process. Mr. Trump, his campaign and his surrogates have been absolutely pummeled in the courts.
One of the great things about our legal system is that it requires actual proof -- not tweets, not public statements, not viral videos -- but actual, verifiable, material evidence. Mr. Trump's efforts to create evidence of voter fraud out of nothing more than rumor, innuendo, and suspicion have failed spectacularly.
Within just the last seven days, the Trump campaign and its lawyers have either lost or voluntarily dropped nine different cases in one day -- they have even begun to withdraw their own lawsuits, giving up on their case in Arizona and dropping their appeal of a loss in Nevada; and, on Monday, his followers dropped their lawsuits seeking to contest election results in Georgia, Michigan, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin.
Even the lawyers are jumping ship; multiple firms have now abandoned the Trump campaign's effort to dispute the election results. Judges have tossed out the preposterously infirm lawsuits nearly as quickly as Mr. Trump's attorneys have filed them; as a result, our judiciary has rightly prevented the bogus "massive fraud" narrative from taking any further hold than it already has gathered from the wild pronouncements of Mr. Trump and his enablers.
Those lawyers eagerly bringing these lawsuits deserve derision for their stubborn, pathetic attempts to conjure massive fraud where no such thing exists, and for also doing something even more insidious: they are undermining public confidence in our election system and our democratic process.
I hope President Biden and Vice-President Harris will undo every blunder and failure of the Trump administration, and restore America's faith in due democratic process. They have only four short years to accomplish this feat. Will it be time enough?
One of the great things about our legal system is that it requires actual proof -- not tweets, not public statements, not viral videos -- but actual, verifiable, material evidence. Mr. Trump's efforts to create evidence of voter fraud out of nothing more than rumor, innuendo, and suspicion have failed spectacularly.
Within just the last seven days, the Trump campaign and its lawyers have either lost or voluntarily dropped nine different cases in one day -- they have even begun to withdraw their own lawsuits, giving up on their case in Arizona and dropping their appeal of a loss in Nevada; and, on Monday, his followers dropped their lawsuits seeking to contest election results in Georgia, Michigan, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin.
Even the lawyers are jumping ship; multiple firms have now abandoned the Trump campaign's effort to dispute the election results. Judges have tossed out the preposterously infirm lawsuits nearly as quickly as Mr. Trump's attorneys have filed them; as a result, our judiciary has rightly prevented the bogus "massive fraud" narrative from taking any further hold than it already has gathered from the wild pronouncements of Mr. Trump and his enablers.
Those lawyers eagerly bringing these lawsuits deserve derision for their stubborn, pathetic attempts to conjure massive fraud where no such thing exists, and for also doing something even more insidious: they are undermining public confidence in our election system and our democratic process.
I hope President Biden and Vice-President Harris will undo every blunder and failure of the Trump administration, and restore America's faith in due democratic process. They have only four short years to accomplish this feat. Will it be time enough?
It is curious, then, that staff from the legal firm defending against one of the currently running cases has been caught harrassing the legal firm behind the case:
Quote:
On November 14, 2020 at 8:43am, an attorney at Kirkland & Ellis left a one-minute voicemail for undersigned counsel. The voicemail, which has been provided to counsel of record from Kirkland & Ellis in this case and will be provided to the Court via email upon request, speaks for itself and by any measure falls afoul of standards of professional conduct. Local Rule 83.23.2 adopts a Code of Professional Conduct for practitioners in this district which includes a commitment to “treat with civility and respect the lawyers, clients, opposing parties, the court and all the officials with whom I work.” LR 83.23.2 also adopts the Pennsylvania Rules of Professional Conduct, the preamble to which states that “[a] lawyer should demonstrate respect for the legal system and for those who serve it, including judges, other lawyers and public officials.” Preamble ¶ 5. But if there needs to be a rule saying that Kirkland & Ellis associates should not call opposing counsel and leave an abusive voicemail then all hope is lost.
Source: https://www.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.pamd.127057/gov.uscourts.pamd.127057.131.0.pdf
If the cases are as "meritless", or "frivolous" as some claim, then why is so much effort being made to harrass the legal firms behind them, or such efforts being made to denounce the cases before a judge has had an opportunity to rule on them?
Similarly, following constitutionally permitted and legally defined procedures is not going to "damage democracy", but instead demonstrates that the democratic system works. Attempting to prevent access to these legal and constitutionally permitted procedures is a much greater threat to democracy than a court case challenging certain actions related to an election's procedure\outcome. Similarly, attempting to crown a "winner" before the requisite steps have been completed shows disdain for the democratic process as a whole.
That "official" looking paper that you've linked to merely shows a CLAIM of misconduct. IT doesn't say what the voicemail consisted of, merely several pages CLAIMING that their behavior was "bad!", with no actual proof or explanation. And, that's *one* CLAIM. Since when does ONE *CLAIM* constitute "SO MUCH EFFORT BEING MADE"? If SO MUCH EFFORT is going into ANYthing, it's SO MUCH EFFORT going into manufacturing an endless supply of hollow claims, and acting like they're pillars of proof built upon foundations of evidence, when in actuality its nothing more than someone saying "I totally swear this totally happened, but I don't have any proof, so just believe me!"
Regurgitating trump-ian defense of american democracy is phony enough by its own merit. Trump-ian faux american nationalistic pride is even weirder sounding when coming from an individual who isn't even a member of the nation who's system they're "fighting for the honor" of. You're more than welcome to. But it DOES come of as so totally fake, even if it isn't.
16 Nov 2020, 10:10 pm
uncommondenominator wrote:
Brictoria wrote:
Fnord wrote:
The only thing that Mr. Trump's attorneys have delivered is a ridiculous mishmash of lawsuits that run the gamut from weak to entirely meritless to downright frivolous. Mr. Trump and his attorneys are not only humiliating themselves, they are damaging our democracy in the process. Mr. Trump, his campaign and his surrogates have been absolutely pummeled in the courts.
One of the great things about our legal system is that it requires actual proof -- not tweets, not public statements, not viral videos -- but actual, verifiable, material evidence. Mr. Trump's efforts to create evidence of voter fraud out of nothing more than rumor, innuendo, and suspicion have failed spectacularly.
Within just the last seven days, the Trump campaign and its lawyers have either lost or voluntarily dropped nine different cases in one day -- they have even begun to withdraw their own lawsuits, giving up on their case in Arizona and dropping their appeal of a loss in Nevada; and, on Monday, his followers dropped their lawsuits seeking to contest election results in Georgia, Michigan, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin.
Even the lawyers are jumping ship; multiple firms have now abandoned the Trump campaign's effort to dispute the election results. Judges have tossed out the preposterously infirm lawsuits nearly as quickly as Mr. Trump's attorneys have filed them; as a result, our judiciary has rightly prevented the bogus "massive fraud" narrative from taking any further hold than it already has gathered from the wild pronouncements of Mr. Trump and his enablers.
Those lawyers eagerly bringing these lawsuits deserve derision for their stubborn, pathetic attempts to conjure massive fraud where no such thing exists, and for also doing something even more insidious: they are undermining public confidence in our election system and our democratic process.
I hope President Biden and Vice-President Harris will undo every blunder and failure of the Trump administration, and restore America's faith in due democratic process. They have only four short years to accomplish this feat. Will it be time enough?
One of the great things about our legal system is that it requires actual proof -- not tweets, not public statements, not viral videos -- but actual, verifiable, material evidence. Mr. Trump's efforts to create evidence of voter fraud out of nothing more than rumor, innuendo, and suspicion have failed spectacularly.
Within just the last seven days, the Trump campaign and its lawyers have either lost or voluntarily dropped nine different cases in one day -- they have even begun to withdraw their own lawsuits, giving up on their case in Arizona and dropping their appeal of a loss in Nevada; and, on Monday, his followers dropped their lawsuits seeking to contest election results in Georgia, Michigan, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin.
Even the lawyers are jumping ship; multiple firms have now abandoned the Trump campaign's effort to dispute the election results. Judges have tossed out the preposterously infirm lawsuits nearly as quickly as Mr. Trump's attorneys have filed them; as a result, our judiciary has rightly prevented the bogus "massive fraud" narrative from taking any further hold than it already has gathered from the wild pronouncements of Mr. Trump and his enablers.
Those lawyers eagerly bringing these lawsuits deserve derision for their stubborn, pathetic attempts to conjure massive fraud where no such thing exists, and for also doing something even more insidious: they are undermining public confidence in our election system and our democratic process.
I hope President Biden and Vice-President Harris will undo every blunder and failure of the Trump administration, and restore America's faith in due democratic process. They have only four short years to accomplish this feat. Will it be time enough?
It is curious, then, that staff from the legal firm defending against one of the currently running cases has been caught harrassing the legal firm behind the case:
Quote:
On November 14, 2020 at 8:43am, an attorney at Kirkland & Ellis left a one-minute voicemail for undersigned counsel. The voicemail, which has been provided to counsel of record from Kirkland & Ellis in this case and will be provided to the Court via email upon request, speaks for itself and by any measure falls afoul of standards of professional conduct. Local Rule 83.23.2 adopts a Code of Professional Conduct for practitioners in this district which includes a commitment to “treat with civility and respect the lawyers, clients, opposing parties, the court and all the officials with whom I work.” LR 83.23.2 also adopts the Pennsylvania Rules of Professional Conduct, the preamble to which states that “[a] lawyer should demonstrate respect for the legal system and for those who serve it, including judges, other lawyers and public officials.” Preamble ¶ 5. But if there needs to be a rule saying that Kirkland & Ellis associates should not call opposing counsel and leave an abusive voicemail then all hope is lost.
Source: https://www.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.pamd.127057/gov.uscourts.pamd.127057.131.0.pdf
If the cases are as "meritless", or "frivolous" as some claim, then why is so much effort being made to harrass the legal firms behind them, or such efforts being made to denounce the cases before a judge has had an opportunity to rule on them?
Similarly, following constitutionally permitted and legally defined procedures is not going to "damage democracy", but instead demonstrates that the democratic system works. Attempting to prevent access to these legal and constitutionally permitted procedures is a much greater threat to democracy than a court case challenging certain actions related to an election's procedure\outcome. Similarly, attempting to crown a "winner" before the requisite steps have been completed shows disdain for the democratic process as a whole.
That "official" looking paper that you've linked to merely shows a CLAIM of misconduct. IT doesn't say what the voicemail consisted of, merely several pages CLAIMING that their behavior was "bad!", with no actual proof or explanation. And, that's *one* CLAIM. Since when does ONE *CLAIM* constitute "SO MUCH EFFORT BEING MADE"? If SO MUCH EFFORT is going into ANYthing, it's SO MUCH EFFORT going into manufacturing an endless supply of hollow claims, and acting like they're pillars of proof built upon foundations of evidence, when in actuality its nothing more than someone saying "I totally swear this totally happened, but I don't have any proof, so just believe me!"
Regurgitating trump-ian defense of american democracy is phony enough by its own merit. Trump-ian faux american nationalistic pride is even weirder sounding when coming from an individual who isn't even a member of the nation who's system they're "fighting for the honor" of. You're more than welcome to. But it DOES come of as so totally fake, even if it isn't.
As I stated in the post to which you replied:
Brictoria wrote:
If the cases are as "meritless", or "frivolous" as some claim, then why is so much effort being made to harrass the legal firms behind them, or such efforts being made to denounce the cases before a judge has had an opportunity to rule on them?
Similarly, the ""official" looking paper" (as you phrased it) is a copy of a court filing, where those who filed it face the possibility of sanctions should they be unable to substantiate the claim put forward...Evidence (such as transcripts of voicemail) are generally not attached to this portion, hence the reason it was not included here.
16 Nov 2020, 10:49 pm
16 Nov 2020, 11:08 pm
Jiheisho wrote:
From your article:
Quote:
Trump: "Dominion deleted 2.7 million Trump votes nationwide."
Verdict: There is no evidence to support this claim.
Verdict: There is no evidence to support this claim.
So, not proven, but equally, not disproven...
Quote:
Trump: "Radical Left owned Dominion Voting Systems."
Verdict: This is not correct - the company is not owned by the "Radical Left". It has made donations to both Republicans and Democrats in the past.
It's not clear who Trump is referring to when he talks about ownership by the "Radical Left".
Verdict: This is not correct - the company is not owned by the "Radical Left". It has made donations to both Republicans and Democrats in the past.
It's not clear who Trump is referring to when he talks about ownership by the "Radical Left".
So, not "owned" by a group which the "fact checkers" are unable to clarify who the members are...
Quote:
Trump: The machines were "turned down by Texas and many others because they were not good or secure."
Verdict: It's true that Texas did not provide certification for the machines.
Their approach is different to other states.
Verdict: It's true that Texas did not provide certification for the machines.
Their approach is different to other states.
So, from this we end up with a "true", and 2 "unconfirmed" (Absence of evidence is not the same as evidence of absence, and not knowing who was referred to as the "owners" means you can't confirm or refute the claim) results.
Besides, Has so much changed from what the New York Times reported 2 years ago?
16 Nov 2020, 11:11 pm
