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funeralxempire
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24 Jan 2024, 3:10 am

Fnord wrote:
Yugoslav1945 wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Socialism occurs when the producers own the means of production; NOT when the government dictates moral behavior.
And the producers will own the means of production in my socialism. Because I will push for Market Socialism and make them distribute first to the general population in my country and have them distribute the remaining surplus abroad.
Socialism does not address morality or the concept of evil; nor does it require the government to provide sex slaves to 18-year-old virgins or criminalize underaged teenagers for having sex.

What you are proposing is NOT a Socialistic economy; what you are proposing is another Totalitarian regime.

Tito would be proud.


I feel like even Tito and Lenin would be a little uncomfortable. This is more like the bad guy from every '80s teen movie would be proud, at least as long as they still get to make the local rec centre into a warehouse.


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The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.
If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing. —Malcolm X
Just a reminder: under international law, an occupying power has no right of self-defense, and those who are occupied have the right and duty to liberate themselves by any means possible.


Last edited by funeralxempire on 24 Jan 2024, 3:10 am, edited 1 time in total.

Yugoslav1945
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24 Jan 2024, 3:10 am

Fnord wrote:
Yugoslav1945 wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Socialism occurs when the producers own the means of production; NOT when the government dictates moral behavior.
And the producers will own the means of production in my socialism. Because I will push for Market Socialism and make them distribute first to the general population in my country and have them distribute the remaining surplus abroad.
Socialism does not address morality or the concept of evil; nor does it require the government to provide sex slaves to 18-year-old virgins or criminalize underaged teenagers for having sex.

What you are proposing is NOT a Socialistic economy; what you are proposing is another Totalitarian regime.

Tito would be proud.


Well, consider me the first socialist to say so because according to the freedom of speech thing you said, I have the right to also disagree with some socialist concepts and form my own socialist ideology. I disagree with Marx's antisemitism. I disagree with Stalin's political paranoia. I disagree with Juche isolationism and such. Tito is the only reliable socialist that I see because he didn't kill a lot of people and his Market Socialism worked very well until the IMF pushed for liberal capitalism on the free market and ultimately killed it.

In theory, yes, Socialism isn't really statist but more of a means to push for an alternative democracy that is better than democracy run by liberals, conservatives, and capitalists. And I also thank you for saying that Tito would be proud of me. You have acknowledged the positivity that Josip Broz Tito is watching from the skies and smiling as I make people happy with my own socialism which is truly humane!


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"In a socialist society such phenomena must and will disappear. In the old Yugoslavia national oppression by the great-Serb capitalist clique meant strengthening the economic exploitation of the oppressed peoples. This is the inevitable fate of all who suffer from national oppression."

- Josip Broz Tito (Ljubljana, 1948)


funeralxempire
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24 Jan 2024, 3:11 am

Yugoslav1945 wrote:
And I also thank you for saying that Tito would be proud of me. You have acknowledged the positivity that Josip Broz Tito is watching from the skies and smiling as I make people happy with my own socialism which is truly humane!


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insult#Ba ... ompliments


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The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.
If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing. —Malcolm X
Just a reminder: under international law, an occupying power has no right of self-defense, and those who are occupied have the right and duty to liberate themselves by any means possible.


Yugoslav1945
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24 Jan 2024, 3:12 am

funeralxempire wrote:
To paraphrase Emma Goldman, I don't want any part of your revolution if it's going to make intruding into the romantic lives of children a policy.


You literally quoted an anarchist. You know that?


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"In a socialist society such phenomena must and will disappear. In the old Yugoslavia national oppression by the great-Serb capitalist clique meant strengthening the economic exploitation of the oppressed peoples. This is the inevitable fate of all who suffer from national oppression."

- Josip Broz Tito (Ljubljana, 1948)


Fnord
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24 Jan 2024, 3:12 am

Yugoslav1945 wrote:
There are many variants of authoritarian socialism that differ from the original theories regarding a socialist society. You have many figures who developed their own thoughts on how to achieve socialism and move to communism.
Who says we want to move to Communism?  Who cares for a form of Socialism that dictates severe penalties for what two (or more) consenting people do in private?

Sure, if an unwanted pregnancy occurs, the father should pay his fair share for birthing and raising the child; and if a sexually transmitted disease is involved, both parties should pay for treatment.

But imposing prison time on minors for a little paradise by the dashboard light is sick and perverse in its own right.



funeralxempire
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24 Jan 2024, 3:12 am

Yugoslav1945 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
To paraphrase Emma Goldman, I don't want any part of your revolution if it's going to make intruding into the romantic lives of children a policy.


You literally quoted an anarchist. You know that?


Yes, I'm quite familiar with Mrs. Goldman.


_________________
The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.
If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing. —Malcolm X
Just a reminder: under international law, an occupying power has no right of self-defense, and those who are occupied have the right and duty to liberate themselves by any means possible.


Yugoslav1945
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24 Jan 2024, 3:13 am

funeralxempire wrote:
Yugoslav1945 wrote:
And I also thank you for saying that Tito would be proud of me. You have acknowledged the positivity that Josip Broz Tito is watching from the skies and smiling as I make people happy with my own socialism which is truly humane!


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insult#Ba ... ompliments


I mean, we are opponents in terms of politics so, kinda true.


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"In a socialist society such phenomena must and will disappear. In the old Yugoslavia national oppression by the great-Serb capitalist clique meant strengthening the economic exploitation of the oppressed peoples. This is the inevitable fate of all who suffer from national oppression."

- Josip Broz Tito (Ljubljana, 1948)


Yugoslav1945
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24 Jan 2024, 3:15 am

Fnord wrote:
Yugoslav1945 wrote:
There are many variants of authoritarian socialism that differ from the original theories regarding a socialist society. You have many figures who developed their own thoughts on how to achieve socialism and move to communism.
Who says we want to move to Communism?  Who cares for a form of Socialism that dictates severe penalties for what two (or more) consenting people do in private?

Sure, if an unwanted pregnancy occurs, the father should pay his fair share for birthing and raising the child; and if a sexually transmitted disease is involved, both parties should pay for treatment.

But imposing prison time on minors for a little paradise by the dashboard light is sick and perverse in its own right.


I don't want be the grandfather of a child born from my poor daughter who was raped by a gang of mentally ill neer-do-wells. I'd rather pursue for abortion.


_________________
"In a socialist society such phenomena must and will disappear. In the old Yugoslavia national oppression by the great-Serb capitalist clique meant strengthening the economic exploitation of the oppressed peoples. This is the inevitable fate of all who suffer from national oppression."

- Josip Broz Tito (Ljubljana, 1948)


Fnord
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24 Jan 2024, 3:15 am

Yugoslav1945 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
To paraphrase Emma Goldman, I don't want any part of your revolution if it's going to make intruding into the romantic lives of children a policy.
You literally quoted an anarchist. You know that?
Even Anarchists can speak the truth.



Yugoslav1945
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24 Jan 2024, 3:16 am

Fnord wrote:
Yugoslav1945 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
To paraphrase Emma Goldman, I don't want any part of your revolution if it's going to make intruding into the romantic lives of children a policy.
You literally quoted an anarchist. You know that?
Even Anarchists can speak the truth.


Sure they can speak the truth but I ain't buying for any anarchist theories if their goal is to abolish the state before a socialist revolution is even complete.


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"In a socialist society such phenomena must and will disappear. In the old Yugoslavia national oppression by the great-Serb capitalist clique meant strengthening the economic exploitation of the oppressed peoples. This is the inevitable fate of all who suffer from national oppression."

- Josip Broz Tito (Ljubljana, 1948)


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24 Jan 2024, 3:17 am

Yugoslav1945 wrote:
I don't want be the grandfather of a child born from my poor daughter who was raped by a gang of mentally ill neer-do-wells. I'd rather pursue for abortion.
Your hypothetical daughter is more likely to be raped by a first-degree relative than by a "gang of mentally ill neer-do-wells".



Yugoslav1945
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24 Jan 2024, 3:18 am

Fnord wrote:
Yugoslav1945 wrote:
I don't want be the grandfather of a child born from my poor daughter who was raped by a gang of mentally ill neer-do-wells. I'd rather pursue for abortion.
Your hypothetical daughter is more likely to be raped by a first-degree relative than by a "raped by a gang of mentally ill neer-do-wells".


Still gonna go for abortion. I ain't letting the rapist get away.


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"In a socialist society such phenomena must and will disappear. In the old Yugoslavia national oppression by the great-Serb capitalist clique meant strengthening the economic exploitation of the oppressed peoples. This is the inevitable fate of all who suffer from national oppression."

- Josip Broz Tito (Ljubljana, 1948)


Fnord
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24 Jan 2024, 3:20 am

Yugoslav1945 wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Yugoslav1945 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
To paraphrase Emma Goldman, I don't want any part of your revolution if it's going to make intruding into the romantic lives of children a policy.
You literally quoted an anarchist. You know that?
Even Anarchists can speak the truth.
Sure they can speak the truth but I ain't buying for any anarchist theories if their goal is to abolish the state before a socialist revolution is even complete.
WHAT Socialist revolution?

All I see are a collection feudalist states owning the means of production while oppressing their citizens and calling it "Socialism".



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24 Jan 2024, 3:23 am

Yugoslav1945 wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Yugoslav1945 wrote:
I don't want be the grandfather of a child born from my poor daughter who was raped by a gang of mentally ill neer-do-wells. I'd rather pursue for abortion.
Your hypothetical daughter is more likely to be raped by a first-degree relative than by a "raped by a gang of mentally ill neer-do-wells".
Still gonna go for abortion. I ain't letting the rapist get away.
Murdering a child for the alleged "crimes" of its parents is pure EVIL.

Is THIS part of the "Socialist Revolution" you propose?



Last edited by Fnord on 24 Jan 2024, 3:23 am, edited 1 time in total.

Yugoslav1945
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24 Jan 2024, 3:23 am

Fnord wrote:
Yugoslav1945 wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Yugoslav1945 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
To paraphrase Emma Goldman, I don't want any part of your revolution if it's going to make intruding into the romantic lives of children a policy.
You literally quoted an anarchist. You know that?
Even Anarchists can speak the truth.
Sure they can speak the truth but I ain't buying for any anarchist theories if their goal is to abolish the state before a socialist revolution is even complete.
WHAT Socialist revolution?

All I see are a collection feudalist states owning the means of production while oppressing their citizens and calling it "Socialism".


So you consider any form of human protection regarding consent to sex to be a form of some government feudalism?! I think you are lost. I want to establish MAROF as a means of making it secure, free, and fair for all and that no one can violate the system and no one can corrupt it. Loneliness would drop drastically, the workers would be happy, they would no longer worry about how much money to pay to satisfy their other comrades. Why is this so hard for liberals and right-wingers to understand?!


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"In a socialist society such phenomena must and will disappear. In the old Yugoslavia national oppression by the great-Serb capitalist clique meant strengthening the economic exploitation of the oppressed peoples. This is the inevitable fate of all who suffer from national oppression."

- Josip Broz Tito (Ljubljana, 1948)


Yugoslav1945
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24 Jan 2024, 3:25 am

Fnord wrote:
Yugoslav1945 wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Yugoslav1945 wrote:
I don't want be the grandfather of a child born from my poor daughter who was raped by a gang of mentally ill neer-do-wells. I'd rather pursue for abortion.
Your hypothetical daughter is more likely to be raped by a first-degree relative than by a "raped by a gang of mentally ill neer-do-wells".
Still gonna go for abortion. I ain't letting the rapist get away.
Murdering a child for the alleged "crimes" of its parents is pure EVIL.

Is THIS part of the "Socialist Revolution" you propose?


But you just said that my hypothetical child would be raped by incest. How is abortion at an early stage of pregnancy now considered "murder"? What, you want to have a baby who is unhealthy and has complications because her mother was underaged and wasn't fully developed?!


_________________
"In a socialist society such phenomena must and will disappear. In the old Yugoslavia national oppression by the great-Serb capitalist clique meant strengthening the economic exploitation of the oppressed peoples. This is the inevitable fate of all who suffer from national oppression."

- Josip Broz Tito (Ljubljana, 1948)