goldfish21
Veteran
Joined: 17 Feb 2013
Age: 43
Gender: Male
Posts: 22,612
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
15 Jan 2021, 10:54 am
Pepe wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
It was literally an attempted coup. People died. Trained leos/ex-military participated. They had guns, bombs, riot cuffs, body armour, chemical weapons, riot shields etc. They attempted to seize government by violent force and prevent the peaceful transition of power to a democratically elected President in a free and fair election that’s been investigated & recounted multiple times in contested states. Wtf else do you call it besides a coup?
Well, the way I see it, it was a protest/minor-riot by some extremists.
And you can't say that *everyone* who participated were violent people.
Apparently, the most aggressive people involved were white supremacists, who are a minor demographic in America.
I did Google about their numbers, but could only find "More than we think, but less than they want you to think".
If anyone can give a link to their estimated numbers, it would be appreciated.
The main thing to consider is that it had zero chance of changing government, hence, it was a violent protest, rather than an attempted coup, surely.
goldfish21 wrote:
Even international experts are calling it that - a failed one - but still an attempted coup, with complicit police & military actors considering the lack of law enforcement presence and delays in dispatching help.
I beg to differ with the "International Experts".
Remember, there is politics involved so I tend to take what is said with a grain of salt.
Once again, could someone explain how the incident at Capital Hill could have succeeded in changing the government?
How could it have even *threatened* the government, at that time?
Are you saying it was a 'preamble' for something bigger down the line?
Even if it were, it could hardly be called an 'attempted coup', at the time.
goldfish21 wrote:
Why would anyone be embarrassed by BLM? America’s white supremacy problem is what should be embarrassing.
The problem seems to be that a relatively few 'deplorables' are responsible for this anti-social behaviour.
I am not saying America doesn't have a social problem, btw.
goldfish21 wrote:
What do extremists shooting up a baseball game or attempting an assassination have to do with leftists? Very little compared to the Majority of republican voters that back the coup at the capitol.
Majority? So the original polls were wrong, or has there been another?
Also, you can't believe polls at their face value.
No poll predicted a trump win 4 years ago, did they?
And people aren't always honest, especially if their names are 'Donald Duck' and 'Mickey Mouse'.
White supremacy has a broad range of participants from casual to extremists. According to recent polls there are at least 74,233,744 Americans that at the very least condone it.
It was an attempted coup. I wasn’t involved, so I have no idea who was involved, at what levels, and why their plan failed. Bur regardless, even though it failed, it was still an attempted coup.
What grain of salt? I posted a thread about the security expert from Paris saying this was appears to be an attempted coup by djt and that he had assistance from the police & guardsmen/military who were supposed to be guarding that building - as evidenced by the simple fact that they did not do their jobs.
Who knows what the extent of their plans was. But they had inside help from republicans that worked in the building. Panic alarms had been ripped out of offices. Reconnaissance tours were given the day before. As much as it failed, this was a legitimate attempt at a violent government takeover.
2/3 of republicans is a majority of republicans. One article said 2/3 of republicans back what happened.
Just because it’s a small % of Americans murdering black people doesn't mean there aren’t tens of Millions (or more) just casually hating them. You don’t seem to have a grasp on the extent of racism or systemic racism in the USA. At all. (Not that this attack was racist, but you had responded about BLM protests.)
_________________
No
for supporting trump. Because doing so is deplorable.goldfish21
Veteran
Joined: 17 Feb 2013
Age: 43
Gender: Male
Posts: 22,612
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
15 Jan 2021, 10:58 am
ezbzbfcg2 wrote:
Pepe wrote:
The main thing to consider is that it had zero chance of changing government, hence, it was a violent protest, rather than an attempted coup, surely.
I agree, Pepe. And that's precisely my point of contention. I don't condone what happened that day, but to state this was a literal coup with any chance of accomplishing an actual and potential overthrow of the entire federal government apparatus is an outright ludicrous claim to make.
You think the high level people in the republican party, capitol police, military/national guard that were involved in facilitating this whole maga melee planned for it to fail?
Get real. They tried and failed. Pretending it wasn’t a serious attempt is just a display of your disappointment that they were inept.
_________________
No
for supporting trump. Because doing so is deplorable.goldfish21
Veteran
Joined: 17 Feb 2013
Age: 43
Gender: Male
Posts: 22,612
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
15 Jan 2021, 11:03 am
auntblabby wrote:
the dope from the parler people [before they wiped it all] was that they were gonna kidnap some pols including the veep.
96% of it was backed up by a hacker - 56 Terabytes or something. Posts, images, location metadata - they have almost Everything ever posted to parler for people/law enforcement to investigate. This is all thanks to parler’s apparently sh***y programming and security. It collected all kinds of data other sites strip away, and stored it insecurely so it was easy to copy. HOORAY!
_________________
No
for supporting trump. Because doing so is deplorable.auntblabby
Veteran
Joined: 12 Feb 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 115,231
Location: the island of defective toy santas
15 Jan 2021, 11:06 am
yeh, that hacker is a good egg 
15 Jan 2021, 11:26 am
auntblabby
Veteran
Joined: 12 Feb 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 115,231
Location: the island of defective toy santas
15 Jan 2021, 11:34 am
techstepgenr8tion
Veteran
Joined: 6 Feb 2005
Age: 46
Gender: Male
Posts: 24,683
Location: 28th Path of Tzaddi
15 Jan 2021, 11:37 am
15 Jan 2021, 12:08 pm
goldfish21
Veteran
Joined: 17 Feb 2013
Age: 43
Gender: Male
Posts: 22,612
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
15 Jan 2021, 12:32 pm
Pepe wrote:
ezbzbfcg2 wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
Insiders are all being investigated. They’ll be expelled, charged with treason etc.
How is it somehow my fault that treasonous republicans could only recruit such minimal numbers of military/police trained insurrectionists and had to rely on morons that didn’t know what they were doing?
They’re all going to jail. Maybe trump included.
How is it somehow my fault that treasonous republicans could only recruit such minimal numbers of military/police trained insurrectionists and had to rely on morons that didn’t know what they were doing?
They’re all going to jail. Maybe trump included.
Perhaps, but what you're peddling is still hearsay and contradictory to the official narrative. And what was the end goal? Temporary disruption of the certification process? Actually harming, taking hostages, and perhaps killing members of Congress? Would all branches of the US military back and defend these intruders and take orders from whatever they might have decreed from the Capitol?
I still fail to see how this could, in any reality, have totally dismantled and usurped the federal government of the USA or changed anything.
How can people see it any other way.
It is bizarre that they don't.
These domestic terrorists had all kinds of weapons & seem to have been intent on taking hostages and possibly killing lawmakers. Hell, they were saying out loud that they wanted to hang Mike Pence.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national ... story.html
_________________
No
for supporting trump. Because doing so is deplorable.15 Jan 2021, 12:50 pm
League_Girl wrote:
Don't forget that when Hitler invaded Poland, he didn't mean for the war to start. It was not his attempt to start a world war.
I wouldn't consider this the best example. Poland was the neceesary first step in Hitler's vision of exterminating the Slavs and Jews of Eastern Europe to provide ethnic Germans with Lebensraum. He may not have planned on the UK and France declaring war on Germany when they invaded Poland, but he knew he would have to defeat them eventually if he wanted to realize his plans.
Instead, try:
"Guys, most of those German soldiers didn't want to exterminate Pole and Jews. Don't act like they were wrong just because they knowingly fought alongside those seeking to carry out genocide
Plus, the genocide never would have worked so it's nbd."The people who stormed the capitol didn't seem to have much issue marching alongside those wearing Auschwitz t-shirts, waving swastikas, and carrying around zip-ties.
15 Jan 2021, 1:10 pm
goldfish21
Veteran
Joined: 17 Feb 2013
Age: 43
Gender: Male
Posts: 22,612
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
15 Jan 2021, 1:27 pm
uncommondenominator wrote:
An unsuccessful coup attempt by a band of inept meatheads is still a coup attempt. The fact that it didn't overturn the government doesn't mean they didn't try. You don't get to plead not-guilty to robbery just cos you're a moron and screwed up the robbery.
So now we can add "a coup isn't a coup" to the "Ministry Of Faktz" list of things-that-aren't-things. Right next to "traitors aren't traitors", "bigots aren't bigots" and, "nazis aren't nazis". STOP CALLING THINGS WHAT THEY ARE!! !
I can't wait to hear the coughed-up kool-aid as people try to rationalize how the kobold army meant "HANG MIKE PENCE!" in a totally non violent and supportive way...
So now we can add "a coup isn't a coup" to the "Ministry Of Faktz" list of things-that-aren't-things. Right next to "traitors aren't traitors", "bigots aren't bigots" and, "nazis aren't nazis". STOP CALLING THINGS WHAT THEY ARE!! !
I can't wait to hear the coughed-up kool-aid as people try to rationalize how the kobold army meant "HANG MIKE PENCE!" in a totally non violent and supportive way...
Funniest thing I’ve read all morning! 6 out of 5 laughs, would lol at again.
_________________
No
for supporting trump. Because doing so is deplorable.
15 Jan 2021, 1:39 pm
uncommondenominator wrote:
... So now we can add "a coup isn't a coup" to the "Ministry Of Faktz" list of things-that-aren't-things. Right next to "traitors aren't traitors", "bigots aren't bigots" and, "nazis aren't nazis"...
You left out:• "Grab 'em by the p****" is not sexist misogyny
• "I would date her myself" is not incestuous perversion
• Fewer inauguration attendees is more inauguration attendees
• Any act of violence committed is always the other person's fault
uncommondenominator wrote:
I can't wait to hear the coughed-up kool-aid as people try to rationalize how the kobold army meant "HANG MIKE PENCE!" in a totally non violent and supportive way...
You left out:• How the kobold army meant "KILL HIM WITH HIS OWN GUN!" in a totally non-violent and supportive way
• How the President leaving his advancing troops before they got to the Capitol means that the Vice-President is a coward
• How people bragging on-line about how they "OWNED THE LIBERALS" have since been arrested and charged by those same "liberals" with everything from unlawful entry to first-degree murder.
I am certain we could dig up more...
... and for many years to come!
goldfish21
Veteran
Joined: 17 Feb 2013
Age: 43
Gender: Male
Posts: 22,612
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
15 Jan 2021, 1:41 pm
_________________
No
for supporting trump. Because doing so is deplorable.15 Jan 2021, 1:49 pm
One of my Sociology profs once said words to the effect that nothing unites a disparate people so much as a common enemy. Were it not for Trump, I am certain that Goldie and I (and several others) would still be sniping and snarking at each other. Thank you, Mr. Trump for bringing us all together; too bad for you that it is because you are now our "common enemy".
15 Jan 2021, 1:55 pm
