Horror of Abortion!

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I'd also have to laugh at 91's self-righteous indignation over the "condescension" of reproductive rights proponents here. This thread was started by someone who's used it for trollish amusement and the strident anti-abortionist, Gedrene, has really just whined at people for rejecting his premises while using really poorly formulated arguments to justify the sacredness of ZEFs.

Last edited by Master_Pedant on 18 Oct 2011, 10:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Well if the shoe fits wear it

Like I said, this has been gone over already between Gedrene and Vex. It has already received far more attention than it deserves.



You are if you intend to contribute to the conversation. One of the reason I avoid these abortion threads is that they tend to have an extra ten pages on them when I get home.



Because we cannot determine an absolute point cannot be taken as evidence that there is no such point. My argument is that the default position with regards to the unknown is that we ought to exercise restraint. As to the absolutist position of people who advocate rights, as visagrunt pointed out, unfortunately our positions are mutually exclusive.

U mad bro?

Not at all didn't you notice the wink It takes a lot to get me upset

Would it upset you to know that every time you maturely rise above your own emotions, Cthulhu eats a kitten?

What is a Cthulhu

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cthulhu

And if wiki is just too dry...

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-DsgZ4JXXB8[/youtube]

Danke

Is the only way you can actually sound like you hav an argument grounded in the truth by using a slur. Fetus fetishistic? That doesn't represent the idea that I make. It is vague and mocking, not really concentrating on the fact of the argument I make. It's an ad hominem argument used to bully people furthermore by pejorising them with a name whilst not actually saying anything.



Fethisize the foetus by saying that it is a human individual. Well I am sorry that you declare a fact as mockable because all it shows is an inability to actually engage with an argument. Why don't you be analytical and actually say why I was wrong rather than make a bigot's argument with name-calling?


Because you say so. Both are cases of using bigot's names to try and insult and push down the other side. Black Republican. Fetish fetishist. Sounds like it comes from the same kind of man to me, bigots that is.


By saying that we give rights to 'people' and not Humans.


And that doesn't make any sense because a Zygote is a Human individual. A clump of skin cells do not grow or go through a Human life cycle as I have already statted. You are the only one who is a fetishist, because you have to try and ignore every argument I make constantly to sound credible. A zygote is a human individual. Quit trying to dehumanize it by saying it is not a Human individual. Your inability to go past simple physical qualities and not understand any sense of growth, change, individualhood or anything else shows you have no imagination, as further evidenced by your bigoted claim of 'fetus fetishism'.


But a Human sperm isn't a Human individual because it is not part of a Human life cycle. Why is it that you have to ignore facts all the time in order to try and make an argument? Why must you must try and twist things by adding Human and person next to each other in order to construct some untrue vagary about the fact that Human rights are given to Humans? Why is it that you try to ignore the fact that tissue is tissue and a Human individual is aHuman individual by trying to say that a Zygote is not a Human?

My probem is not when it fails but when people deflect it in the case of just wanting it for contraception. Whether it fails and one wants to increase their fertility is for the parents to decide, not me.

Good, because I agree with abortion in the case of rape. You're ruining someone's psychology by forcing them to bear the child of their violator, an level of intimacy with such an antagonist that it would be insane to think that it wouldn't cause trouble. It's fortunate that I said this several times already then.


Don't be a bigot.

What an aborted foetus could have been is not a good argument against abortion. The only real concern anyone should have when they approach this matter is that Human Rights are not violated. And a zygote is a Human.

Well they don't because he doesn't say that using contraception is evil like with the catholic church. You're so blinded by your bigotry that you can't even actually tell what arguments any of us are making.


Which is exactly the point 91 is making and that you're ignoring. Sperm dying is sperm dying because naturall if sperm don't fertilize then they die. A Human Zygote is a Human because it's natural for a Human zygote to grow. You keep on ignoring this fact with fatuous comparisons between a Zygote and tissue or a Zygote and sperm whilst constantly ignoring the point I make.


True, but if you look like an ignorant bigot because of it then it's your own fault.


Yes, because saying that a Zygote is a Human being because it's part of a Human life cycle whilst a sperm is not important because it's natural for it to die off is not important. Only to idiots. Even conditional pro-choice abortionists admit this fact. A Human Zygote is a Human.


Yes and here we go, flying headlong away from fact by claiming that a foetus is not a human because it's just a 'cluster of cells', just like claiming the Universe isn't the universe because it has no stars despite the fact that the universe did. Fact is everything starts small, but it still is what it is even though it might not have arbitrary characteristics that you want to associate as being what makes it something.


Telling the truth about how someone sounds isn't condescending.


Reproductive rights conflict with rights to live. Rights aren't something written in stone. One doesn't have to be restrained though. However one does have to show respect towards their fellow Human beings when it's due, and you haven't neither in what you argue nor in who you argued with.

No, there are moral arguments that support abortion in some cases. However, in all cases there are no moral arguments to support abortion at will.

It's easy to believe in moral absolutes but how do you propose caring for all these unwanted children?