Republicans succeed in ploy to increase unsafe abortions

Post Reply New Topic

Your argument is essentially based on you believing that abortion is wrong. That isn't logic, it is emotion.

You don't even seem to grasp that concept that early on in the pregnancy, you are NOT defending a child, you defending a small cluster of cells that has the potential to become a human. Much the same as sperm cells have the potential to become a human, but I can essentially guarantee you have destroyed millions of sperm cells.

of course arguments hold different value,

that is the whole purpose of them,

If the basis of your argument is emotion, your argument will always fail. Emotions are not reliable. Just because one feels something is wrong does not mean it is wrong.

A liberal discounting emotion?
What next?

Emotion is much too unreliable to be used as a basis for law.

So when you make an argument, it's logical, well-thought and official. When I make an argument, it's emotional, unreliable, illogical and non-legitimate? It doesn't matter what your view on abortion is, pro-life, pro-choice it's still an opinion to be taken into consideration. For the mature and experienced twenty-year old you make yourself out to be, your tolerance of other people's views more resembles a 7-year old. Debate with me, don't pretend you have the magical sheriff's badge to take away legitimacy of speech.

Well then what is your train of logic for saying abortion is always wrong no matter what?

My train of logic for pro-choice:
I do not want my rights to be infringed, especially the right to do whatever I want with my own body. Therefore, I must support abortion otherwise I am trying to remove a womans right over her own body. Whether I personally believe abortion is right or wrong doesn't enter in to the equation.

edit:
Typo of a sort.

Quoting myself earlier:

Abortion is a very personal issue for me. I'm usually a very composed fellow, but these sorts of debates make me lose faith in the human race much more than environmental issues or corrupt governments.

It comes down to this:
I only sympathize with an infinitesimally small percent of terminated pregnancies that guarantee a woman's death. However, for the other 99% of abortions, it comes down to an argument of what we value more - the woman's right to relieve 9 months of inconvenience, or the child's right to 80 possible years of life. My point is, I feel for the women who don't want to go through the pregnancies, but 9 months vs 80 years? The math is clear.

You're correct, an unborn child cannot defend itself and will not tell you in the womb "hey, I don't really agree with this". The ones who are terminated never get a chance to speak up. However, those who grow up DO speak up and they are trying to defend the "fetus".

People have tried to "rationalize" with me by using every argument in the book. However, the right to take innocent lives should never be a diplomatic issue. It should never be a choice for anyone but the innocents to make. Calling the innocents "inhuman" does not solve the problem. Calling the defenders of the innocent "bigots" and "stupid Christians" does not solve the problem. When we start solving our problems by helping people, as opposed to terminating selected people - at war, in the justice system, in public or in the womb - then we start picking up the pieces of a morally shattered human society; and trust me, we are in a very morally shattered society right now.
[/quote]

That is an emotional argument, not logic.

You FEEL abortion is wrong. This does not make it wrong.

Way to ignore the argument that was just made. People say the pen is mightier than the sword and in general I would agree. People, however, have a much harder time ignoring a heavy blow from a sword than they do a rebuttal from a pen.

I didn't ignore it. His basic argument is that the pregnancy is not enough of an inconvenience to the mother to justify terminating the pregnancy. That is an emotional argument.

Of course he is ignoring the fact it could well destroy the mothers life and give the child a terrible life...

No, it is a consequentialist argument based upon a utilitarian assertion.

Utilitarianism is emotional. It is based on creating joy.

Consequentialism is more logical, but it is still based on emotion. It states that the outcome of an event defines whether it is good or bad, a morally correct outcome means it was a good thing to do and vice versa.

The issue then becomes whose morals we are talking about, and the basis for said morals... and the basis for morals is emotion.

I already know two close females in my life who experienced the worst pregnancies possible, and they still pulled through. Logically, I'd say it's doable. Putting a child up for adoption is all you have to do if you don't want it in your life, and it's much better to give it a chance than to kill it outright, LOGIC. Here, in case you want to argue that it's illogical, I wrote it into binary. Compile it and your computer will find no logic errors

01001001 00100000 01100001 01101100 01110010 01100101 01100001 01100100 01111001 00100000 01101011 01101110 01101111 01110111 00100000 01110100 01110111 01101111 00100000 01100011 01101100 01101111 01110011 01100101 00100000 01100110 01100101 01101101 01100001 01101100 01100101 01110011 00100000 01101001 01101110 00100000 01101101 01111001 00100000 01101100 01101001 01100110 01100101 00100000 01110111 01101000 01101111 00100000 01100101 01111000 01110000 01100101 01110010 01101001 01100101 01101110 01100011 01100101 01100100 00100000 01110100 01101000 01100101 00100000 01110111 01101111 01110010 01110011 01110100 00100000 01110000 01110010 01100101 01100111 01101110 01100001 01101110 01100011 01101001 01100101 01110011 00100000 01110000 01101111 01110011 01110011 01101001 01100010 01101100 01100101 00101100 00100000 01100001 01101110 01100100 00100000 01110100 01101000 01100101 01111001 00100000 01110011 01110100 01101001 01101100 01101100 00100000 01110000 01110101 01101100 01101100 01100101 01100100 00100000 01110100 01101000 01110010 01101111 01110101 01100111 01101000 00101110 00100000 01001100 01101111 01100111 01101001 01100011 01100001 01101100 01101100 01111001 00101100 00100000 01001001 00100111 01100100 00100000 01110011 01100001 01111001 00100000 01101001 01110100 00100111 01110011 00100000 01100100 01101111 01100001 01100010 01101100 01100101 00101110 00100000 01010000 01110101 01110100 01110100 01101001 01101110 01100111 00100000 01100001 00100000 01100011 01101000 01101001 01101100 01100100 00100000 01110101 01110000 00100000 01100110 01101111 01110010 00100000 01100001 01100100 01101111 01110000 01110100 01101001 01101111 01101110 00100000 01101001 01110011 00100000 01100001 01101100 01101100 00100000 01111001 01101111 01110101 00100000 01101000 01100001 01110110 01100101 00100000 01110100 01101111 00100000 01100100 01101111 00100000 01101001 01100110 00100000 01111001 01101111 01110101 00100000 01100100 01101111 01101110 00100111 01110100 00100000 01110111 01100001 01101110 01110100 00100000 01101001 01110100 00100000 01101001 01101110 00100000 01111001 01101111 01110101 01110010 00100000 01101100 01101001 01100110 01100101 00101100 00100000 01100001 01101110 01100100 00100000 01101001 01110100 00100111 01110011 00100000 01101101 01110101 01100011 01101000 00100000 01100010 01100101 01110100 01110100 01100101 01110010 00100000 01110100 01101111 00100000 01100111 01101001 01110110 01100101 00100000 01101001 01110100 00100000 01100001 00100000 01100011 01101000 01100001 01101110 01100011 01100101 00100000 01110100 01101000 01100001 01101110 00100000 01110100 01101111 00100000 01101011 01101001 01101100 01101100 00100000 01101001 01110100 00100000 01101111 01110101 01110100 01110010 01101001 01100111 01101000 01110100 00101100 00100000 01001100 01001111 01000111 01001001 01000011 00101110 00100000

You are ignoring the downfalls of adoption. My mothers best friend was put up for adoption, ended up in foster care getting sexually and physically abused for 16 years. Children who are adopted often also have issues, trying to find out why their mother had given them up.

Logically, it is also doable for you to run for 24 hours straight. THis does not mean I can force you to do it

Also, why is it better to give it a chance? Because you don't agree with killing it? EMOTION.

Your seven-year old side is showing. Every single argument I make is dismissed as illogical. You flaunt the term as if it is actually applicable to politics. Logic is a lucrative and is applicable only when you have a clear goal in mind. I want to turn the number two into the number eight, logically I multiply by four. It would be illogical to multiply by four if I wanted to get negative eight instead! The question is - what is society's goal? We can't determine that with logic because logic needs a goal!! !
My goal is to make the world a better place, where everybody has a right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. So everything I'm saying sounds pretty logical in my ears. What's your goal? Whine on the forums like a seven-year old? Because you're doing so in a pretty logical way right now.