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Ancalagon
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16 Jun 2009, 6:00 am

cognito wrote:
yet again, it seems god has claimed another victim via proxy of his evil flock, striking down a man performing a needed and legal service, and was killed all because some small minded, easy deceived fool thought the sun told him to go murder an innocent man. gotta love the Christians!

8O

Sun worship? You seriously don't know how anti-sun worship Christianity is? Wow.

It's rather diffucult to imagine a more blatantly un-Christian thing to do than murdering someone because you're a sun-worshipper.


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ruveyn
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16 Jun 2009, 7:46 am

Shadowgirl wrote:

Christians like myself get killed everyday for spreading the Gospel in many countries. So in many places that in itself is just as dangerous. If I lived in North Korea I could get the death penalty for more then half of what I've said.



I just had an idea. Maybe Christians should not go to those countries to spread the Gospel.

Attempting to convert or inject a religion in someone's life is invasive and just plain impolite. People's beliefs are private and should not be meddled with.

ruveyn



vibratetogether
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16 Jun 2009, 9:17 am

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Sure. But I don't see how being open to the possiblity that you are wrong precludes being open to the possibility that you are right. Or thinking that you actually are.


Well, the first part I agree with, but the last sentence is where I disagree. The key is to be open to possibilities, not tied down by perceived certainties. I acknowledge that I could be wrong, because history has shown this to be a possibility. I have, in the past, held opinions that I now would consider incorrect. People get too tied up in their opinions, are generally self-centered, and come to the conclusion that their was is the best way. I think that's silly.

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What do you mean by 'fallible'? If you mean 'false', then obviously that statement is false. If you mean 'suspect', then why do you exempt that statement from being fallible? If all you mean is that something might possibly be incorrect, I'd say that every statement, absolute or not, is fallible.


Fallible - liable to be erroneous or false; not accurate

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Yes. Something suggested by nearly everyone in this thread, whether they think Tiller's murder was absolutely morally wrong, absolutely morally right, or perceived a conflict between 2 absolute moral principles.


Well, then nearly everyone in this thread has made fallible assertions. I've come to terms with the seeming truth that not many people can "see" relativity.

Infallible - "I think murder is wrong"

Fallible - "Murder is wrong"

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I just defined it for you. You can object to the verbiage all you want, but that doesn't change the concept it represents.


I reject your definition. I can conceive of someone who commits no sin, yet is not perfect. As such, I find that the two statements represent different concepts.

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Feeling it superior to other opinions just makes it your opinion, not 'correct' or even 'better than'.


Correct. That is why I put "better than" in quotes. I am not saying it is representative of an absolute concept of "better", but trying to relay the feeling we have as individuals that one choice is preferable to another.

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For there to be a 'better than', it would have to be 'closer to correct', hence there would have to be a 'correct'.


Not correct. I hold the opinion that murder is wrong, not because murder is wrong, but because I feel that to hold the opinion that murder is wrong is preferable to holding the opinion that murder is not wrong, for a multitude of reasons. I do not need to recognize a moral absolute to hold opinions.

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Holding an opinion means that you think it is correct.


Super not correct. Refer to the last response.

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Your thoughts on what is correct may not be correct, but that doesn't stop there from being a 'correct' for them to be incorrect about.


But my opinion does not need to assume this "absolute correctness". I can acknowledge the possibility of this, but it is not absolutely required.

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In other words, they might be wrong, therefore they are wrong?


Better to say - "they might be wrong, therefore they might be wrong".



0_equals_true
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16 Jun 2009, 9:48 am

vibratetogether wrote:
Fallible - liable to be erroneous or false; not accurate

sorry to pipe in there fallible can actually means capable of error (as in everyone), or liable to be false. It is not the same as not accurate. Infallible would be godlike.



vibratetogether
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16 Jun 2009, 10:39 am

0_equals_true wrote:
vibratetogether wrote:
Fallible - liable to be erroneous or false; not accurate

sorry to pipe in there fallible can actually means capable of error (as in everyone), or liable to be false. It is not the same as not accurate. Infallible would be godlike.


I included the definition that fit what I was getting at. The full definition per my resource is...

Fallible - (of persons) liable to err, esp. in being deceived or mistaken.
- liable to be erroneous or false; not accurate: fallible information.
- Capable of making an error: Humans are only fallible.
- Tending or likely to be erroneous: fallible hypotheses.
- Liable to fail, mistake, or err; liable to deceive or to be deceived; as, all men are fallible; our opinions and hopes are fallible.



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16 Jun 2009, 10:51 am

Ok I have not heard the not accurate it doesn't really matter though.



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17 Jun 2009, 12:38 pm

greenblue wrote:
JonhyCarcinoegn wrote:
That's "Cain and Abel", not "Cain and Able".

If you're going to reference the bible, at least have the decency to use correct spelling, pronunciation & grammar.

Have the dececny to refere to the Bilbe with the first letter capital, woudl you!


...My apologies. Bible.


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monty
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17 Jun 2009, 12:54 pm

JohnnyCarcinogen wrote:
greenblue wrote:
JonhyCarcinoegn wrote:
That's "Cain and Abel", not "Cain and Able".

If you're going to reference the bible, at least have the decency to use correct spelling, pronunciation & grammar.

Have the dececny to refere to the Bilbe with the first letter capital, woudl you!


...My apologies. Bible.


So many tyopgraphic errors!!



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17 Jun 2009, 1:01 pm

monty wrote:
JohnnyCarcinogen wrote:
greenblue wrote:
JonhyCarcinoegn wrote:
That's "Cain and Abel", not "Cain and Able".

If you're going to reference the bible, at least have the decency to use correct spelling, pronunciation & grammar.

Have the dececny to refere to the Bilbe with the first letter capital, woudl you!


...My apologies. Bible.


So many tyopgraphic errors!!


:?:


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17 Jun 2009, 5:21 pm

ruveyn wrote:
Shadowgirl wrote:

Christians like myself get killed everyday for spreading the Gospel in many countries. So in many places that in itself is just as dangerous. If I lived in North Korea I could get the death penalty for more then half of what I've said.



I just had an idea. Maybe Christians should not go to those countries to spread the Gospel.

Attempting to convert or inject a religion in someone's life is invasive and just plain impolite. People's beliefs are private and should not be meddled with.

ruveyn


Well many of them are thankful and want to know. I want to go one day and help those poor people by bringing them food, clothes, first aid supplies, help them get clean water so spreading the Gospel isn't all they do.


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17 Jun 2009, 7:04 pm

Shadowgirl wrote:
ruveyn wrote:
Shadowgirl wrote:

Christians like myself get killed everyday for spreading the Gospel in many countries. So in many places that in itself is just as dangerous. If I lived in North Korea I could get the death penalty for more then half of what I've said.



I just had an idea. Maybe Christians should not go to those countries to spread the Gospel.

Attempting to convert or inject a religion in someone's life is invasive and just plain impolite. People's beliefs are private and should not be meddled with.

ruveyn


Well many of them are thankful and want to know. I want to go one day and help those poor people by bringing them food, clothes, first aid supplies, help them get clean water so spreading the Gospel isn't all they do.

yes, here is food but you gotta believe in this book first, ignore your own religion, we have food.


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17 Jun 2009, 7:36 pm

cognito wrote:
Shadowgirl wrote:
ruveyn wrote:
Shadowgirl wrote:

Christians like myself get killed everyday for spreading the Gospel in many countries. So in many places that in itself is just as dangerous. If I lived in North Korea I could get the death penalty for more then half of what I've said.



I just had an idea. Maybe Christians should not go to those countries to spread the Gospel.

Attempting to convert or inject a religion in someone's life is invasive and just plain impolite. People's beliefs are private and should not be meddled with.

ruveyn


Well many of them are thankful and want to know. I want to go one day and help those poor people by bringing them food, clothes, first aid supplies, help them get clean water so spreading the Gospel isn't all they do.

yes, here is food but you gotta believe in this book first, ignore your own religion, we have food.


Thats not how it goes. You give them the food whether they believe or not because it is the right thing to do.


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ed
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18 Jun 2009, 8:31 am

greenblue wrote:
Have the dececny to refere to the Bilbe with the first letter capital, woudl you!


Are you serious?

holy bible, god, jesus christ

and what the hell is a Bilbe?


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cognito
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18 Jun 2009, 12:12 pm

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monty
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18 Jun 2009, 1:55 pm

Shadowgirl wrote:
cognito wrote:
Shadowgirl wrote:
ruveyn wrote:
Shadowgirl wrote:

Christians like myself get killed everyday for spreading the Gospel in many countries. So in many places that in itself is just as dangerous. If I lived in North Korea I could get the death penalty for more then half of what I've said.



I just had an idea. Maybe Christians should not go to those countries to spread the Gospel.

Attempting to convert or inject a religion in someone's life is invasive and just plain impolite. People's beliefs are private and should not be meddled with.

ruveyn


Well many of them are thankful and want to know. I want to go one day and help those poor people by bringing them food, clothes, first aid supplies, help them get clean water so spreading the Gospel isn't all they do.

yes, here is food but you gotta believe in this book first, ignore your own religion, we have food.


Thats not how it goes. You give them the food whether they believe or not because it is the right thing to do.


That sounds like welfare to me ... I think they should be required to convert to Christianity, or at least sing some hymns or say some prayers to earn the meal. It's like the old saying,"give a man a fish, he will eat for a day ... teach a man to fish, and he will deplete the fishery resource stocks."



ed
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18 Jun 2009, 3:08 pm

monty wrote:
That sounds like welfare to me ... I think they should be required to convert to Christianity, or at least sing some hymns or say some prayers to earn the meal. It's like the old saying,"give a man a fish, he will eat for a day ... teach a man to fish, and he will deplete the fishery resource stocks."


Is that how you think Jesus would have felt about it?


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