Stop using guns to kill things!

Page 18 of 21 [ 332 posts ] Go to page Previous 1 ... 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21 Next

Previous topic | Next topic

auntblabby
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 12 Feb 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 114,803
Location: the island of defective toy santas

06 Aug 2012, 1:21 am

AspieOtaku wrote:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFriRcIwqNU[/youtube]

gosh, that pose reminds me of the late c. heston at the NRA convention saying "...from my cold dead hands...."

John_Browning
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 22 Mar 2009
Age: 43
Gender: Male
Posts: 4,456
Location: The shooting range

06 Aug 2012, 1:50 am

auntblabby wrote:

Dox47 wrote:

auntblabby wrote:

maybe if i were like mike tyson. but since i'm not, i need an "equalizer" that compensates for this assymetry of ability.

If only there were such a device, a wonder weapon that let the weak defend themselves from the strong, the few from the numerous, the disabled from the fit, etc. Oh, wait...

the gun's deafening report causes the inexperienced and newly armed victim to flinch, slowing him/her down just enough for the perp to take the weapon from the victim and use it against him/her.

That's why it's best to use it before you stake your life on it. If someone who has never shot a gun is using one for self-defense, chances are that the threat is close enough to be hard to miss and the threat will, in most identical circumstances, be debilitated more than the defender.

_________________
"Gun control is like trying to reduce drunk driving by making it tougher for sober people to own cars."
- Unknown

"A fear of weapons is a sign of ret*d sexual and emotional maturity."
-Sigmund Freud

Dox47
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 28 Jan 2008
Gender: Male
Posts: 13,670
Location: Seattle-ish

06 Aug 2012, 1:59 am

auntblabby wrote:

the gun's deafening report causes the inexperienced and newly armed victim to flinch, slowing him/her down just enough for the perp to take the weapon from the victim and use it against him/her.

Presto! No bothersome noise, plus it tends to scare the sh*t out of prospective attackers, who make certain... associations... about people who habitually carry silenced weapons.

Paperwork is a bit of a pain, but on the plus side you can own and shoot it in our state.

_________________
Your boos mean nothing, I've seen what makes you cheer.

- Rick Sanchez

auntblabby
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 12 Feb 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 114,803
Location: the island of defective toy santas

06 Aug 2012, 2:24 am

Dox47 wrote:

auntblabby wrote:

the gun's deafening report causes the inexperienced and newly armed victim to flinch, slowing him/her down just enough for the perp to take the weapon from the victim and use it against him/her.

Presto! No bothersome noise, plus it tends to scare the sh*t out of prospective attackers, who make certain... associations... about people who habitually carry silenced weapons.

Paperwork is a bit of a pain, but on the plus side you can own and shoot it in our state.

$600 transfer tax?

Dillogic
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 24 Nov 2011
Gender: Male
Posts: 9,339

06 Aug 2012, 2:30 am

AspieOtaku wrote:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFriRcIwqNU[/youtube]

I've got one.

Good old Coach Gun. Pretty much outdated though (1887 Browning and 1882 Spencer were the inventions that supplanted the break actions), but I don't think the Army of the Dead has anything better.

aSKperger
Deinonychus

Joined: 12 Jun 2012
Age: 58
Gender: Male
Posts: 326

06 Aug 2012, 8:47 am

Quote:

would bypass proven weapons like knives and bludgeons in favor of finicky and unreliable pepper spray?

Point is, they would not use firearms. Sure if they want to kill you, they do it anyway, even with chair. But you too give muggers and rapists as example. They want your money/p****, not your life in the first place. If they can do it fast and easy, they would not bother with killing .
And mentioning rapists, look at this:

Quote:

In 2001, 11% of rapes involved the use of a weapon — 3% used a gun, 6% used a knife, and 2 % used another form of weapon
84% of victims reported the use of physical force only

http://www.rainn.org/get-information/st ... -offenders

Quote:

the police have masks and access to pepper spray neutralizer, and if you notice they tend to step back after using it in a one on one situation.

Well riot control units do. I am talking about ordinary one. He tend to step back, yes. And you can't?

Vigilans
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 19 Jun 2008
Age: 37
Gender: Male
Posts: 12,181
Location: Montreal

06 Aug 2012, 11:38 am

Dox47 wrote:

Vigilans wrote:

I am thankful I don't live in a place where packing is needed to feel safe. The only people I have met around here who regularly carry are criminals worried about getting shot by other criminals, which is still a rare occurrence here, and thus their guns are mostly for intimidation. A society that lives in constant fear is not a society I want to be a part of

Common misconception; most of us don't carry out of any sense of fear, but out of a desire to be prepared and take responsibility for our own security. I suppose you'd have to live here to know that though, maybe spend some time around guns and gun carriers getting to know the subject a bit.

What kind of environment other than one involving lots of fear under the surface requires that in order to feel prepared to "take responsibility for ones own security" requires carrying a weapon capable of killing with ease? You are being typically blasé on this subject. I actually do spend a lot of time around gun owners. RIFLE owners. Hunters. Pistols are just dick extensions for (non-LEO) people who carry them in these parts.

_________________
Opportunities multiply as they are seized. -Sun Tzu
Nature creates few men brave, industry and training makes many -Machiavelli
You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do

John_Browning
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 22 Mar 2009
Age: 43
Gender: Male
Posts: 4,456
Location: The shooting range

06 Aug 2012, 12:25 pm

Vigilans wrote:

One where we don't expect or want the government to do everything for us, and where the courts have ruled there is no legal obligation for the police to protect us.

Dox47
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 28 Jan 2008
Gender: Male
Posts: 13,670
Location: Seattle-ish

06 Aug 2012, 12:48 pm

Vigilans wrote:

I also carry a first aid kit when I hike, not because I'm afraid of getting injured, but because I'm aware it's a possibility and would prefer not to have to rely on others if the worst should occur.

Seriously Vigi, I'm getting a personal vibe from you lately and I'm not sure why, there's no need for the cheap shots.

_________________
Your boos mean nothing, I've seen what makes you cheer.

- Rick Sanchez

Vigilans
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 19 Jun 2008
Age: 37
Gender: Male
Posts: 12,181
Location: Montreal

06 Aug 2012, 3:00 pm

John_Browning wrote:

Vigilans wrote:

One where we don't expect or want the government to do everything for us, and where the courts have ruled there is no legal obligation for the police to protect us.

I don't trust the judgement of the average citizen to apply principles of justice to real life situations let alone small town good old boys playing sheriff. People should be able to defend themselves but vigilantism or dueling are easily open for abuse

Dox47 wrote:

I also carry a first aid kit when I hike, not because I'm afraid of getting injured, but because I'm aware it's a possibility and would prefer not to have to rely on others if the worst should occur.

Comparing a first aid kit and a gun...? A gun can be a tool of self defense or of offense, but either way, it will take life or blood. A first aid kit has band-aids and rubbing alcohol

Dox47 wrote:

Seriously Vigi, I'm getting a personal vibe from you lately and I'm not sure why, there's no need for the cheap shots.

Not sure why you would feel that way, I didn't think I was making any cheap shots. When I said "dick extension" I also clearly said "in these parts". Few people carry concealed weapons in Montreal. The gun owners I hang out with don't either, since they are rifle owners. I don't know anyone who legally owns a pistol. On the other hand the people I do know who carry do so illegally and purely for intimidatory purposes. The gun culture is not the same here as it is in your place, people don't carry handguns here except criminals, and even then gun crime is pretty low. I don't feel the need to carry a gun around with me because simply put Montreal does not have the wild west atmosphere many Americans seem to promote for their own country.

John_Browning
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 22 Mar 2009
Age: 43
Gender: Male
Posts: 4,456
Location: The shooting range

07 Aug 2012, 12:48 am

Vigilans wrote:

John_Browning wrote:

Vigilans wrote:

One where we don't expect or want the government to do everything for us, and where the courts have ruled there is no legal obligation for the police to protect us.

Justice in such cases is secondary to survival. It only comes into play if they survive or if you do something above and beyond defense, like shooting an incapacitated attacker in the head when they are laying on the ground. Whether you are unarmed or if you kill an attacker, either way the cops are going to arrive in time to draw chalk outlines, take pictures, and scrape the loser's carcass off the pavement and it might as well not be yous. A justice system is not practical on such short notice otherwise it would be nice.

Laws for anything that could be considered "vigilantism" have narrowly defined exceptions regarding the defense of another, and dueling has been legally and socially out of vogue for over a century.

Vigilans wrote:

Dox47 wrote:

I also carry a first aid kit when I hike, not because I'm afraid of getting injured, but because I'm aware it's a possibility and would prefer not to have to rely on others if the worst should occur.

Comparing a first aid kit and a gun...? A gun can be a tool of self defense or of offense, but either way, it will take life or blood. A first aid kit has band-aids and rubbing alcohol.

You'd be surprised what can be done with the stuff in a first aid kit, and a gun can have non-aggressive uses for survival as well. Taking life or blood is not unconditionally bad either.

aSKperger
Deinonychus

Joined: 12 Jun 2012
Age: 58
Gender: Male
Posts: 326

07 Aug 2012, 9:17 am

Quote:

One where we don't expect or want the government to do everything for us, and where the courts have ruled there is no legal obligation for the police to protect us.

What's the point in having government/ police then?

JakobVirgil
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 15 Feb 2011
Age: 51
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,744
Location: yes

07 Aug 2012, 9:35 am

aSKperger wrote:

Quote:

One where we don't expect or want the government to do everything for us, and where the courts have ruled there is no legal obligation for the police to protect us.

What's the point in having government/ police then?

shh they will hear you. :lol:

_________________
?We must not look at goblin men,
We must not buy their fruits:
Who knows upon what soil they fed
Their hungry thirsty roots??

http://jakobvirgil.blogspot.com/

Vigilans
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 19 Jun 2008
Age: 37
Gender: Male
Posts: 12,181
Location: Montreal

07 Aug 2012, 12:12 pm

John_Browning wrote:

We haven't clearly defined what exactly this hypothetical situation we are talking about is, unfortunately, so neither of us are going to be able to reflect our views with complete accuracy.

John_Browning wrote:

Laws for anything that could be considered "vigilantism" have narrowly defined exceptions regarding the defense of another, and dueling has been legally and socially out of vogue for over a century.

What I am more referring to is the trend that seems to be on the rise in your nation whereby citizens are encouraged to take the law into their own hands by other like-minded citizens. This also gets a lot of support from religious nuts who want to kill abortion clinic staff out of "preemptive defense of life". As for dueling, I am glad you think it is a backwards tradition; unfortunately many, even on this forum think it should be a legal practice for conflict resolution. I don't want to derail with that topic, especially since it does not necessarily have to involve guns in any case.

John_Browning wrote:

You'd be surprised what can be done with the stuff in a first aid kit, and a gun can have non-aggressive uses for survival as well. Taking life or blood is not unconditionally bad either.

The point is a first aid kit is not a weapon. A gun is a weapon, it does not serve any other purpose, unless you installed a beer holder or a compass in the stock or something :lol:

. Whether you just shoot at a range or you use it for man hunting it is a weapon. Taking life or blood is always bad, even when necessary. There is no "nice shooting", only good shooting (and bad shooting I guess but n00bs don't count

LKL
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 21 Jul 2007
Age: 49
Gender: Female
Posts: 7,402

07 Aug 2012, 3:39 pm

AspieOtaku wrote:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFriRcIwqNU[/youtube]

good thing for the dirty gunman that there weren't any archers. :wink:

LKL
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 21 Jul 2007
Age: 49
Gender: Female
Posts: 7,402

07 Aug 2012, 3:41 pm

Dox47 wrote:

auntblabby wrote:

the gun's deafening report causes the inexperienced and newly armed victim to flinch, slowing him/her down just enough for the perp to take the weapon from the victim and use it against him/her.

Presto! No bothersome noise, plus it tends to scare the sh*t out of prospective attackers, who make certain... associations... about people who habitually carry silenced weapons.

Paperwork is a bit of a pain, but on the plus side you can own and shoot it in our state.

"no noise"?
My understanding was that 'silencers' just lowered the apparent caliber of the sound of the weapon (as opposed to the 'pew!' noise made on tv and in movies).

Page 18 of 21 [ 332 posts ] Go to page Previous 1 ... 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21 Next

Jump to:

Stop using guns to kill things! Post Reply New Topic

Stop using guns to kill things!