Is it WRONG to own guns, rifles, swords, knives, etc.?

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Is it wrong to bear arms?
Yes 19%  19%  [ 15 ]
No 81%  81%  [ 66 ]
Total votes : 81

snake321
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15 Sep 2007, 10:20 pm

I hardly think it's paranoia considering human history and even current dictatorships that exist today, not to mention all the points i drew about how our system in america is meeting all those same signs to becoming corrupt. Just because it's not full-blown right off the bat means nothing, Hitler did not transform Germany in a day.



snake321
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15 Sep 2007, 10:23 pm

Here, read this VEEEERRRRRYYYYY CAAAAAARRRREEEFFFFFUUUUUULLLLLYYYYYYY:

Lets list the things Bush has done that suggests trying to take over America:

1. Stealing the election (dictators usually gain power illegally)
2. Blocking many investigations into 9/11 (probably because Bush was involved, remember, 9/11 was much like Hitler's reichstag incident, it did several things for a police state agenda, it restored blind faith in the system through nationalism, it provided a scapegoat in arabs, it gave us an excuse to highten security which leads to number 3).
3. Patriot Act.
4. Integration of Church in state, which is used to systematically deny the rights of gays and people of other faiths.
5. Launching an illegal war.

Also consider:
1. Both republicans and democrats support big business, Bush gave businesses the rights of people, and now individuals are loosing their rights to corporations.
2. NAFTA made legal immigration very tough for Mexicans, which lead to them migrating here illegally. This is of coarse, hurting our economy, the right thing to do WOULD be to try and help Mexico become more prosperous of a nation, but seeing as the Mexican government encourages their citizens to jump our border so they can send more money back to Mexico, we're not likely to reach that sort of agreement with them. So this only leaves one other option to secure our financial stability as a nation, war.... But, we don't have the economic means to go to war because we're already involved in an illegal one in Iraq. If we pull our troops, there is likely to be a civil war in Iraq and WE would be hit with the bill. If we don't pull our troops, we'll continue funneling more money into this war that we already can't afford. Meanwhile, millions more illegal aliens are jumping our border, further destroying our economy (not because theyr brown but because theyr illegal, for the libs out there)..... So seeing as Mexico likely won't agree to a plan that would benefit both the US and Mexico, we'd likely have to go to war with them, but we don't have the economic means to do so. They are turning America into a 3rd world nation. Remember, Bush is already a millionaire in the oil industry, most of the higher ranking politicians are already filthy rich, they have no concern for our prosperity.



snake321
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15 Sep 2007, 10:25 pm

I mean does Bush even look like someone you could trust? He looks like a f*****g used car dealer or a f*****g lawyer. The guy screams sleazoid.



snake321
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15 Sep 2007, 10:29 pm

snake321 wrote:
Here, read this VEEEERRRRRYYYYY CAAAAAARRRREEEFFFFFUUUUUULLLLLYYYYYYY:

Lets list the things Bush has done that suggests trying to take over America:

1. Stealing the election (dictators usually gain power illegally)
2. Blocking many investigations into 9/11 (probably because Bush was involved, remember, 9/11 was much like Hitler's reichstag incident, it did several things for a police state agenda, it restored blind faith in the system through nationalism, it provided a scapegoat in arabs, it gave us an excuse to highten security which leads to number 3).
3. Patriot Act.
4. Integration of Church in state, which is used to systematically deny the rights of gays and people of other faiths.
5. Launching an illegal war.

Also consider:
1. Both republicans and democrats support big business, Bush gave businesses the rights of people, and now individuals are loosing their rights to corporations.
2. NAFTA made legal immigration very tough for Mexicans, which lead to them migrating here illegally. This is of coarse, hurting our economy, the right thing to do WOULD be to try and help Mexico become more prosperous of a nation, but seeing as the Mexican government encourages their citizens to jump our border so they can send more money back to Mexico, we're not likely to reach that sort of agreement with them. So this only leaves one other option to secure our financial stability as a nation, war.... But, we don't have the economic means to go to war because we're already involved in an illegal one in Iraq. If we pull our troops, there is likely to be a civil war in Iraq and WE would be hit with the bill. If we don't pull our troops, we'll continue funneling more money into this war that we already can't afford. Meanwhile, millions more illegal aliens are jumping our border, further destroying our economy (not because theyr brown but because theyr illegal, for the libs out there)..... So seeing as Mexico likely won't agree to a plan that would benefit both the US and Mexico, we'd likely have to go to war with them, but we don't have the economic means to do so. They are turning America into a 3rd world nation. Remember, Bush is already a millionaire in the oil industry, most of the higher ranking politicians are already filthy rich, they have no concern for our prosperity.


Come on TCO, don't ignore this because you can't counter it. If you can't counter it, then learn from it or shut up... When I can't counter something, I have a tendency to change my stance. This is called being open minded.



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15 Sep 2007, 10:29 pm

snake321 wrote:
I mean does Bush even look like someone you could trust? He looks like a f***ing used car dealer or a f***ing lawyer. The guy screams sleazoid.


Who says I trust him? So, why don't you use your supposed right to bear arms to overthrow him? Do you have a good reason why you cannot?


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15 Sep 2007, 10:31 pm

snake321 wrote:

Come on TCO, don't ignore this because you can't counter it. If you can't counter it, then learn from it or shut up... When I can't counter something, I have a tendency to change my stance. This is called being open minded.


It is called being an ornery little sod. Taunting people when you claim to have the high ground is dangerous and egotistical.

Open minded is listening to others, not just expressing your viewpoint loudly.


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snake321
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15 Sep 2007, 10:38 pm

Quatermass wrote:
snake321 wrote:

Come on TCO, don't ignore this because you can't counter it. If you can't counter it, then learn from it or shut up... When I can't counter something, I have a tendency to change my stance. This is called being open minded.


It is called being an ornery little sod. Taunting people when you claim to have the high ground is dangerous and egotistical.

Open minded is listening to others, not just expressing your viewpoint loudly.


I did listen to his view, he had nothing intelligent to offer. He presented no logical facts or points to back his views, whereas I have, and he said he's not interested in my facts.



snake321
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15 Sep 2007, 10:40 pm

Closed minded is when you loose an argument and you can't change your point of view. Being open minded means not having your point of view set in stone.



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15 Sep 2007, 10:46 pm

The_Chosen_One wrote:
That second amendment should have been flushed along with the rest of the dunny paper and crap that forms your Constitution. Jesus, will you look at yourselves, everyone running around blowing each others heads off because they are armed, and then the neighbours get bigger guns, then the street gangs get Uzis and rob petrol stations and bottle shops because they have the firepower.... Where will it end? Anyone who thinks that owning a weapon makes them safer should go and visit their nearest mental hospital and book themselves in for an extended stay, because it's the THREAT of these weapons that causes the problem. The only ones that should bear arms are the armed forces and the police, and even the police go too f*cking far. It seems to me that it all hails back to the Wild West days of Jesse James and Billy the Kid. Well, it's 2007 now and those days of 'shoot first and ask questions later' have gone. If Britain and Australia can do without the right to bear arms, then surely you could join the rest of us in the 21st century as well.


This for starters.


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snake321
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15 Sep 2007, 10:47 pm

You made no points and offered no facts that I have not countered.



snake321
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15 Sep 2007, 10:49 pm

I've admitted that guns in the wrong hands are dangerous, but good people need them to protect themselves from bad people with guns. And from their own governments going bad. So I countered all of that s**t.



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15 Sep 2007, 10:49 pm

And this

The_Chosen_One wrote:
Exactly. Allowing just anyone to walk into a gun dealer and buying a rifle or semi-automatic is the height of stupidity. What for Chrissakes would someone need a weapon for in suburbia anyway, if not to commit some sort of crime? People might say 'to protect themselves', but that is just pure BS. Guns are weapons, they are designed to kill. They have no other use but to kill. If you purchase a weapon, it means that you intend to use it, so you are more than likely going to kill someone. Pretty f**** up logic, if you ask me. No wonder there is so much violence and hatred there. We got rid of most of our privately owned weapons at least 10 years ago after Port Arthur. There still may be killings, but it's mostly criminals who get there weapons on the Black Market that use them. But you Americans tend to use your own weapons at the drop of a hat. As I've said, pretty f**** up logic, and indefensible in the 21st century.


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15 Sep 2007, 10:49 pm

snake321 wrote:
Here, read this VEEEERRRRRYYYYY CAAAAAARRRREEEFFFFFUUUUUULLLLLYYYYYYY:

Lets list the things Bush has done that suggests trying to take over America:

1. Stealing the election (dictators usually gain power illegally)
2. Blocking many investigations into 9/11 (probably because Bush was involved, remember, 9/11 was much like Hitler's reichstag incident, it did several things for a police state agenda, it restored blind faith in the system through nationalism, it provided a scapegoat in arabs, it gave us an excuse to highten security which leads to number 3).
3. Patriot Act.
4. Integration of Church in state, which is used to systematically deny the rights of gays and people of other faiths.
5. Launching an illegal war.

Also consider:
1. Both republicans and democrats support big business, Bush gave businesses the rights of people, and now individuals are loosing their rights to corporations.
2. NAFTA made legal immigration very tough for Mexicans, which lead to them migrating here illegally. This is of coarse, hurting our economy, the right thing to do WOULD be to try and help Mexico become more prosperous of a nation, but seeing as the Mexican government encourages their citizens to jump our border so they can send more money back to Mexico, we're not likely to reach that sort of agreement with them. So this only leaves one other option to secure our financial stability as a nation, war.... But, we don't have the economic means to go to war because we're already involved in an illegal one in Iraq. If we pull our troops, there is likely to be a civil war in Iraq and WE would be hit with the bill. If we don't pull our troops, we'll continue funneling more money into this war that we already can't afford. Meanwhile, millions more illegal aliens are jumping our border, further destroying our economy (not because theyr brown but because theyr illegal, for the libs out there)..... So seeing as Mexico likely won't agree to a plan that would benefit both the US and Mexico, we'd likely have to go to war with them, but we don't have the economic means to do so. They are turning America into a 3rd world nation. Remember, Bush is already a millionaire in the oil industry, most of the higher ranking politicians are already filthy rich, they have no concern for our prosperity.


Counter this TCO.



snake321
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15 Sep 2007, 10:50 pm

The_Chosen_One wrote:
And this

The_Chosen_One wrote:
Exactly. Allowing just anyone to walk into a gun dealer and buying a rifle or semi-automatic is the height of stupidity. What for Chrissakes would someone need a weapon for in suburbia anyway, if not to commit some sort of crime? People might say 'to protect themselves', but that is just pure BS. Guns are weapons, they are designed to kill. They have no other use but to kill. If you purchase a weapon, it means that you intend to use it, so you are more than likely going to kill someone. Pretty f**** up logic, if you ask me. No wonder there is so much violence and hatred there. We got rid of most of our privately owned weapons at least 10 years ago after Port Arthur. There still may be killings, but it's mostly criminals who get there weapons on the Black Market that use them. But you Americans tend to use your own weapons at the drop of a hat. As I've said, pretty f**** up logic, and indefensible in the 21st century.


You didn't even say anything new, all you did was repeat the same thing from before in different words. Counter my other arguments if you can.



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15 Sep 2007, 10:51 pm

And this

quote="The_Chosen_One"]Agent80s: All that paperwork is obviously there so that a loon can't just walk onto a firing range and blow up anything they like, then go out after practice and knock off East Fremantle or Subiaco (remember Martin Bryant or Julian Knight, cos I sure do). The original idea with the gun laws, if you'll remember was to ban them outright; but the gun lobby complained that much that they were watered down so that you sporting shooters could still practice your hobby. I personally couldn't give a stuff about whether people were killing themselves off for whatever reason, if they want to be f*ckwits, let them. On the same token I would also prefer to be able to go out any time I felt like it, say around Melbourne, and not have the fear that some ret*d loser is going to blow my head off because he didn't like the footy jumper I was wearing. As I said, guns are meant to kill, and it's the idiots on the end that do the damage. Hey, maybe one way to solve it would be if those idiots turned those guns around 180 degrees and blew their own f*cking heads off. Thin the herds that way, and it would save the expense of taking these imbeciles to court.[/quote]


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snake321
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15 Sep 2007, 10:51 pm

snake321 wrote:
Here, read this VEEEERRRRRYYYYY CAAAAAARRRREEEFFFFFUUUUUULLLLLYYYYYYY:

Lets list the things Bush has done that suggests trying to take over America:

1. Stealing the election (dictators usually gain power illegally)
2. Blocking many investigations into 9/11 (probably because Bush was involved, remember, 9/11 was much like Hitler's reichstag incident, it did several things for a police state agenda, it restored blind faith in the system through nationalism, it provided a scapegoat in arabs, it gave us an excuse to highten security which leads to number 3).
3. Patriot Act.
4. Integration of Church in state, which is used to systematically deny the rights of gays and people of other faiths.
5. Launching an illegal war.

Also consider:
1. Both republicans and democrats support big business, Bush gave businesses the rights of people, and now individuals are loosing their rights to corporations.
2. NAFTA made legal immigration very tough for Mexicans, which lead to them migrating here illegally. This is of coarse, hurting our economy, the right thing to do WOULD be to try and help Mexico become more prosperous of a nation, but seeing as the Mexican government encourages their citizens to jump our border so they can send more money back to Mexico, we're not likely to reach that sort of agreement with them. So this only leaves one other option to secure our financial stability as a nation, war.... But, we don't have the economic means to go to war because we're already involved in an illegal one in Iraq. If we pull our troops, there is likely to be a civil war in Iraq and WE would be hit with the bill. If we don't pull our troops, we'll continue funneling more money into this war that we already can't afford. Meanwhile, millions more illegal aliens are jumping our border, further destroying our economy (not because theyr brown but because theyr illegal, for the libs out there)..... So seeing as Mexico likely won't agree to a plan that would benefit both the US and Mexico, we'd likely have to go to war with them, but we don't have the economic means to do so. They are turning America into a 3rd world nation. Remember, Bush is already a millionaire in the oil industry, most of the higher ranking politicians are already filthy rich, they have no concern for our prosperity.


Here it goes again, go ahead OTC, counter it. You can't. Because I've won the argument. Sorry if I'm proving you to be closed minded.