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cathylynn
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01 Nov 2017, 9:02 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
I've known a couple of people who died because of lack of insurance. One is my wife's brother.


so sorry, kk.



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01 Nov 2017, 9:36 pm

Counterpoint for LnH:

America being great again is easier to substantiate when more people are alive to bear witness. Other countries are judged by mortality rates rather than wealth, we just picked the one of those figures we're somewhat on top of & overemphasized it until it became an overriding concern. Per capita we're not even close to the top spot in either regard.

If you're really about love then why judge by wealth? Striating economy historically results in all manner of hateful division, it's canonized by definition.


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01 Nov 2017, 10:11 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
I've known a couple of people who died because of lack of insurance. One is my wife's brother.


That shows me what a significantly corrupt system we have.

If you fill out a form and pay out x amount per month, we'll save your life, otherwise we'll let you die. I find life or death based on an insurance plan, no matter what it is, the real atrocity.

The whole health insurance system is a racket whether it's offered by the DNC or the GOP, and the less money workers make, the more they are exploited by it.



LoveNotHate
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01 Nov 2017, 10:48 pm

cberg wrote:
Counterpoint for LnH:

America being great again is easier to substantiate when more people are alive to bear witness. Other countries are judged by mortality rates rather than wealth, we just picked the one of those figures we're somewhat on top of & overemphasized it until it became an overriding concern. Per capita we're not even close to the top spot in either regard.

If you're really about love then why judge by wealth? Striating economy historically results in all manner of hateful division, it's canonized by definition.

America is #1 in per capita household income.
America is #1 in per capital household wealth.
http://www.oecdbetterlifeindex.org/coun ... ed-states/

Tax cuts take money away from wasteful politicians and puts it in the hands of the people!

Tax cuts = love, taxes = hate ... make people love, not hate.



cathylynn
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cberg
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01 Nov 2017, 11:12 pm

Per capita =/= household. That's also some people, not everyone.

It's not news that people loathe filing taxes but everyone uses things they pay for. Seeing people dying in the street of preventable causes isn't love.


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cathylynn
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01 Nov 2017, 11:31 pm

LoveNotHate wrote:
cberg wrote:
Counterpoint for LnH:

America being great again is easier to substantiate when more people are alive to bear witness. Other countries are judged by mortality rates rather than wealth, we just picked the one of those figures we're somewhat on top of & overemphasized it until it became an overriding concern. Per capita we're not even close to the top spot in either regard.

If you're really about love then why judge by wealth? Striating economy historically results in all manner of hateful division, it's canonized by definition.

America is #1 in per capita household income.
America is #1 in per capital household wealth.
http://www.oecdbetterlifeindex.org/coun ... ed-states/

Tax cuts take money away from wasteful politicians and puts it in the hands of the people!

Tax cuts = love, taxes = hate ... make people love, not hate.


except, most of those tax cuts are going to folks who already have more money than the know what to do with.



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01 Nov 2017, 11:33 pm

I try not to get tangled up in the healthcare debates, but no one is really qualified to discuss the issue who doesn't understand the idea of "that which is seen and that which is not seen." The people who push government-run healthcare/insurance are only concerned with that which is seen.


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Last edited by Darmok on 01 Nov 2017, 11:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.

cathylynn
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01 Nov 2017, 11:33 pm

LoveNotHate wrote:
cberg wrote:
Counterpoint for LnH:

America being great again is easier to substantiate when more people are alive to bear witness. Other countries are judged by mortality rates rather than wealth, we just picked the one of those figures we're somewhat on top of & overemphasized it until it became an overriding concern. Per capita we're not even close to the top spot in either regard.

If you're really about love then why judge by wealth? Striating economy historically results in all manner of hateful division, it's canonized by definition.

America is #1 in per capita household income.
America is #1 in per capital household wealth.
http://www.oecdbetterlifeindex.org/coun ... ed-states/

Tax cuts take money away from wasteful politicians and puts it in the hands of the people!

Tax cuts = love, taxes = hate ... make people love, not hate.


when i practiced medicine, i paid LOTS of taxes. i didn't hate it. i was happy to help those less fortunate. that's love.



cathylynn
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01 Nov 2017, 11:35 pm

Darmok wrote:
I try not to get tangled up in the healthcare debates, but no one is really qualified to discuss the issue who doesn't understand the idea of "that which is seen and that which is not seen." The people who push government-run healthcare/insurance are only concerned with that which is seen.



the long-run effects of tax cuts for the rich is a slowed economy. look at kansas.



EzraS
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02 Nov 2017, 1:46 am

Touted As Middle-Class Win, GOP Tax Plan Directly Benefits Wealthy, Analysis Finds.

Quote:
They predict that nearly three-quarters of the savings from the tax overhaul would go to the top 20 percent of earners — those making more than $149,000.


http://www.npr.org/2017/10/04/555433641 ... he-wealthy



LoveNotHate
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02 Nov 2017, 3:16 am

EzraS wrote:
Touted As Middle-Class Win, GOP Tax Plan Directly Benefits Wealthy, Analysis Finds.

Quote:
They predict that nearly three-quarters of the savings from the tax overhaul would go to the top 20 percent of earners — those making more than $149,000.


http://www.npr.org/2017/10/04/555433641 ... he-wealthy

It's misleading, because 63% of federal tax payers pay very little federal taxes, so they can't benefit.

And now with the increased standard deduction (+2000 deduction) ... that percent will go up.

From 2014 ....
Image



LoveNotHate
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02 Nov 2017, 12:17 pm

Trump delivers on tax cuts.

Good news:
-The first $12,000 in income would be tax free so an immediate savings of $1,323.75 for anyone earning more than $12,000.
-The first tax bracket is 12% $12000-$45000 is mostly 3% lower than the present 15%, so $26000 is tax 3% lower which results in $780 savings for anyone earning more than $38,000.
-Non-itemizers will gain a +2000 deduction (increased standard deduction - loss of personal exemption) so a $200-250 savings

So, individual non-itemizing middle class filers will save like $2300.

While individual itemizing filers will lose deducting the local, state tax, and other deductions, so their savings will be like $1800.

The upper middle class will save more as the 28% bracket would be gone now. So, they could see savings like $4000-5000

Bad News:
The brackets will be based on the Chained CPI.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kellyphill ... 973d24eb83



Darmok
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02 Nov 2017, 4:02 pm

LOL, Trump has the media so deranged they can't even think straight. :D

Image


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EzraS
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02 Nov 2017, 9:39 pm

Darmok wrote:
LOL, Trump has the media so deranged they can't even think straight. :D

Image


LOL indeed.



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02 Nov 2017, 9:57 pm

LoveNotHate wrote:
Trump delivers on tax cuts.

Good news:
-The first $12,000 in income would be tax free so an immediate savings of $1,323.75 for anyone earning more than $12,000.
-The first tax bracket is 12% $12000-$45000 is mostly 3% lower than the present 15%, so $26000 is tax 3% lower which results in $780 savings for anyone earning more than $38,000.
-Non-itemizers will gain a +2000 deduction (increased standard deduction - loss of personal exemption) so a $200-250 savings

So, individual non-itemizing middle class filers will save like $2300.

While individual itemizing filers will lose deducting the local, state tax, and other deductions, so their savings will be like $1800.

The upper middle class will save more as the 28% bracket would be gone now. So, they could see savings like $4000-5000

Bad News:
The brackets will be based on the Chained CPI.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kellyphill ... 973d24eb83


Forbes released further update. Now they say the 12% bracket starts at $1.

So that cuts down the savings.

So, individual non-itemizing middle class filers will only save like $1200.

No word whether it's retroactive or not.

The upper middle class does pretty good still, unless they use a lot of deductions.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kellyphill ... c501c4519b