who supports marijuana rights?

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My question is, should alcohol and cigarettes also be illegal for recreational use?

You can only argue for the illegality of pot if you likewise support outlawing these items as well.

Personally, if they were outlawed, there would be no tears in my eyes. But, outlawing alch. has been tried, and failed in the united states back almost 90 years ago. cigarettes ARE harmful to those that stand in places where second hand smoke is, but they dont impare the function of the mind. I think that is the main argument others have for those. I dont smoke, nor do I drink, so having either "taken away" isnt of value to me. I personally think that the legal Blood alch level should be lowered. But again that comes from my having to scrape people off the highway because some one was intoxicated and choose to drive. I detest people doing that. I have aquaintences in the fire service that drive intoxicated on their time, and I detest them for it, I offer to drive for them but, alas, I am never invited to go out "drinking with the boys" even as a designated driver.

Maybe because they know you "detest" them for it.

Largely, it's because the fix is in. Judges won't let them present this evidence, usually. This I see as corruption.



This is a freedom that has been forcibly removed from us, and you speak of this "controlled substance" thing as if it is a law of physics or God, not a law made by an early 20th century Congress controlled by business interests.



Always looking for an alternative to freedom of choice, aren't we?



Or, a group of sharp operators has convinced the majority that they do not have these judgement skills, or that a minority is going to kill us all if we don't allow the passage of repressive laws, or that someone is having fun while we aren't having fun.



Right now, they are selling us another set of excuses for further compromising our civil rights, by once again convincing us that humans as a whole are not suitable for self-rule and must be ruled by an elite. I have crude metaphors for the morals and ethics of this elite, which I consider to largely be literally true.

The tragic thing is that your manner of speaking sounds like that of someone who is too intelligent to be taken in by the scam, but somehow has been.

A lot of people are really eager to give away their rights and help take away mine under cover of this kind of rhetoric. It is a form of predation, really, or worse, just plain destructiveness followed by scavenging whatever remains. This is why I am a Remnant. You say people can't handle drugs. I say people can't handle having that much "power" over others, or what they misinterpret as having power, but the power is only to destroy, to carry out destructive activities against our fellow humans and excuse it to ourselves. I think that those of us who use this "power" are more destructive than those few who are allegedly crazy on drugs. We destroy our fellow humans physically and psychologically.

People who cares if it impairs your ability to drive or operate heave equipment, I have about 20 bottles of medicine in my house that have that as a warning on the label. You know what I do I don’t drive while under there affects. Why should something be illegal because some people are stupid, cos that is what that argument leads to ‘lets protect people from them self’ let me fill you in on something stupid people will kill themselves, stupid people will kill other people, stupid people will use any drug in excess in fact I bet every one on this site knows some one that is abusing sugar and that causes hart attacks diabetes ect. It dos not matter what you make illegal these things will happen.

God made weed Man made Dope who do you trust

Oh and its is not called marijuana that is a name made up by the US government in there propaganda parade

Ladysmokeater wrote:

And you are happy with this. You are under the impression that the government stopping you getting a substance that would end the discomfort of diaharrea without causing further pain because other people were herting themself is a good thing and should be encouraged? are you perhaps delusional?

what is the actual name?

canibus?

Hemp?

the binomials are cannabis sativa, c. indica, c. ruderalis and hybrids thereof.

hemp is the name given to c. sativa strains that are used for industryand have no recreational benefit. Although it is exactly the same species.

The prohibition of cannabis was really an excuse to shut down the hemp industy. The wave of disinformation (much of which fed off anti black & mexican racist sentiment) was orchestrated largely by one man: Harry Anslinger, who had vested interest in other industries that were threatened by hemp production. This has all been very well documented.

Last edited by psych on 16 Jan 2006, 6:48 am, edited 2 times in total.

Wrong!

I've changed my mind. (I guess I've woken in a bad mood this morning.)

I'd like to point out that it's perfectly legal for my neighbor to pour her cigarette smoke into my apartment. Why is it legal? Because the United States loves tobacco. It's not fair. I don't have the right to breath clean air in my own apartment. I also don't have the right to keep her from triggering an asthma attack or an allergic reaction.

Laws are made by people. People are generally stupid. And aside from any medicinal benefits of pot, there's NO REASON to be tacking any drug other than to satisfy an addiction. And that's not even a good reason.

A person gets locked up if they try to hurt themselves or commit suicide. Why are drugs any different? They're addictive. And too many people running the country like 'em. Tobacco companies are good friends of politicians. And people like 'em. Most whine till the cows come home every time the tabacco tax rises.

Aside from medicinal treatments, if healthy people used logic for once they'd admit that nothing good comes of drugs but only potential harm.

If the US weren't so addicted, tobacco would be illegal. As would alcohol. We no longer have crappy sewage systems to require us to avoid drinking water.

The majority of people healthwise (and this surely includes myself) are stupid and most of the time are going to do something to end their life sooner than it should. And people don't regret it until it happens to them. In the meantime, we suck up, drink up, shoot up, and eat up until we explode.

Many of the psychedelic drugs are anti-addictive. They are not habit forming in themselves (in the chemical sense) and have been sucessfully used therapeutically to reform addicts and career criminals. Because of its complex effects, Cannabis occupies a grey area in between the psychedelic and stimulant/narcotic. So it can be habit-forming, but mainly in the sense that any enjoyable activity is habit forming, as one wishes to do it again.

That brings me to my main point: I do not see a clear-cut distinction between medical & non-medical use. This is a drug that can (certain strains) relieve stress, reduce the susceptability to certain cancers, and offer psychological therapeutic insights.

How many people in the modern world would NOT benefit from a little therapy, stress-relief or reduced cancer risk? (all medical issues)

Answer: None (that i know of)

http://www.erowid.org/

http://www.erowid.org/plants/cannabis/cannabis.shtml

good sites

I wouldn't have too much of a problem if it were legalized, but only if it were heavily regulated. I think it should be tested in the same way other legal drugs are tested to ensure safety and good quality, for one thing. Also, I'd rather it's use only be allowed in designated areas so that the rest of us could avoid it if we wanted to, so people wouldn't have to breathe in the second-hand smoke. Also, people should be educated in an open, accurate way as to the nature of the drug, it's dangers and risks, particularily the dangers of driving under the influence.

I do understand and agree with some of the points made by people who are against legalization, however. If all the drugs, alcohol, and tobacco on earth suddenly disappeared tomorrow you wouldn't hear any complaints from me In their most natural forms and usage (the use of coca leaves by people native to the Andes region to give them the energy required to perform strenuous tasks at high altitudes, for instance) they're just fine, but in their more powerful forms and more excessive usages they do more harm than good IMHO. Our culture is one of excess, and we pay for it every day. Cannabis lies somewhere in between, it seems. One the one hand, I'm sure some of it is quite close to it's natural form, and used in moderation, but on the other hand, some of it has probably been made more potent, and is used in excess.

Why do we even want it to be regulated? We let a lot of people run around freely with a drug that alters the mind horribly and inspires violence. Why would a much more benign recreational drug need this horrible kind of fight against its use? Why would we sacrifice so many people to this fight? Considering how much has been done to people over this I would think that rational human beings would need better reasons than the occasional automobile accident that someone has arbitrarily decided was caused by a given drug, even if it was caused by the use of that drug. The consequences of that war have been far worse than free use ever could have been, and the promoters of that war seem unable to see that, or to care.

I need the ability to produce a readily usable and portable liquid fuel to heat my home and run my technology, using renewable resources. Hemp IS the only such thing available.

To the person who created the debate about smoking pot imparing your co-ordination and ability to drive. Here is something to think about, I was stoned for both my beginners and my final drivers test, I passed with flying colours. I also was stoned when I tested for my black belt, once again, I passed with flying colours. I even wrote a large portion of my college exams stoned, I passed all of those too.

I suffer from social anxiety, I also suffer from depression, and lack of motivation. Smoking "the devil's weed" reduces my inhibitions and I will chat people's ears off. This in turn makes me happier. It also motivates me. Whenever I smoke up, I get the urge to do something. It maybe something less productive like playing video games, but often I end up going to the gym, go for a run. Sometimes I will manage to put in a few extra hours of coding before bed, because getting high eliminated the stress that was causing a mental block. Would this not qualify as "medical" use? Sure, sometime I smoke it just to have some fun and relax with my friends -- but isnt socializing and having fun important to someone like me hardly leaves his room/office and otherwise has no urge to socialize?

I work 50 hours a week, pay my bills and taxes. I dont drink. If it werent for weed - I'd might as well be a robot.

The problem is, the sterotype we have for druggies are the losers who dont work, dont go to school, live off welfare and are generally just losers who mooch off society. Take away their weed, they'll find another crutch (if they dont already have one). Dont ban weed. Dont ban alcohol. Ban the bums who give these "tools" a bad reputation.

It's not my way to quote a whole post, but I must here. Appreciate someone standing up & saying this.
I believe there are all varieties of people even within sub-groups. There are lazy people who don't smoke pot, there are pot-smokers who aren't lazy, and there are some cases of overlap. Doesn't mean that one leads to the other-correlation is not causation. Does an individual's laziness make him/her smoke pot ?
If one wants/needs a chemical "crutch" to improve one's subjective experience, if it's not weed then it'll be something much worse. I'd feel much safer (mentally & physically) in the company of a smoker of pot than a user of any other substances.
Don't consider myself able to change anyone's mind on this-nor do I wish to have others try to convince me that my p.o.v. is wrong. Okay ?

Belfast, the more of us speak up for our rights, the more minds will change. Things like this reach a critical mass and then they tip.

Congratulations to anyone who stands up for their rights on this. I've already said what the stakes are. Unfortunately hemp also seems to be the only source of renewable liquid fuel that produces more usable energy than we can put into it. Maybe it's fortunately, because it seems to take a lot to drive people to stand up for their human rights. As has been acknowledged in the case of alcohol and tobacco, we have a right even to our "demon drugs." This is because the mere judgement that the free exercise of a right may be hazardous should not be sufficient to sway a legislature or a court to remove that right from us. This is why there is sometimes talk about a "clear and present danger" standard. The "clear and present danger" standard is not satisified when some people screw up while using it and other people pretend the drug caused the screwing up.