In my view the Democrats are just as much a Rich people's po

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Sweetleaf
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16 Aug 2011, 11:24 am

Tequila wrote:
androbot2084 wrote:
If you were a Billionaire and were taxed 60 percent you would still have 400 million dollars.


Perhaps they could use that money in order to invest? And anyway, people that rich would not pay much tax due to having well-paid and very clever people avoiding tax.

Really, it's the people further down who pay most of the tax and who get discouraged when they see 40% of their earnings going to 'aid' in Pakistan, for instance.


Yeah that is reasonable......now if 40% was going to things U.S citizens including them can benifit from it, then would make more sense...but aid in pakistan? that is more what I think chairity should be for



Tequila
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16 Aug 2011, 11:56 am

Sweetleaf wrote:
If that much is going to taxes then why would there be a need for chairity?


That's exactly how many taxpayers in the UK feel. They feel that so much of their money is being wasted in taxation (most people pay 30-40% on income tax straightaway, and that's without all the other taxes they have to pay on top). Many NHS hospitals offer such poor care that many well-off people simply go private or go abroad bypassing the often lethal bugs that infect state hospitals. The state often does not take care of those that really need help because they fail to qualify for benefits through sheer honesty, and those that do claim benefits sometimes have no entitlements to them whatsoever. They can get away with it due to the bureaucratic, tick-box culture that we have.

It's tip of the iceberg stuff, really.

And then you have a justice system that is a shambles because people who commit crimes are not properly punished but are encouraged to commit further crimes and are sometimes even directly rewarded for doing so - i.e. the bad kids get taken to Alton Towers, whereas the good kids get nothing.

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I would assume that money is going to public services


A good deal of it doesn't go to the frontline (i.e. the bits that people actually use), but to administrators, managers, consultants, bureaucrats and so on. The biggest irritance in the NHS is the insane target-driven / managerialist culture that exists there, stopping GPs, nurses and other medical staff from doing their job properly. Don't get me wrong: the NHS can be very good when it's allowed to be but it can be appalling.

Have you seen some of the disgraceful slop they serve in many NHS hospitals? A chap called Mark Sparrow brought this issue to wide public attention with his blog "Notes from a hospital bed". Google it.

This is all out there, in the public domain.

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I would have to look into their system and how citizens of that country feel about it before I judge wether I think its a good system or not but still what would be the need for chairity?


The government even funds some of the larger charities through taxation anyway, so in some instances they aren't even really charities any more.

People will fund those charities they deem necessary - like the RNLI - but most people donate to many of the larger ones out of ignorance, mostly.



Last edited by Tequila on 16 Aug 2011, 12:02 pm, edited 2 times in total.

androbot2084
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16 Aug 2011, 11:57 am

That is exactly what these Ebenezer Scrooge people do they disown members of their own family for no reason.



Vexcalibur
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16 Aug 2011, 11:58 am

mikecartwright wrote:
In my view the Democrats are just as much a Rich people's political party as the Republicans are both are funded and supported by and run by Rich/Wealthy Lobbyists who here agrees ?

http://www.socialistalternative.org/...10.php?id=1297


Hello,

The republicans make tax cuts for the rich.
The democrats make sure to "regulate" things in a way that the rich keep their monopolies.


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Tequila
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16 Aug 2011, 11:59 am

Sweetleaf wrote:
but aid in pakistan? that is more what I think chairity should be for


Cameron has given millions of pounds of money away to 'aid' in Pakistan and India. To countries that has its own space programme and could easily much better look after its own citizens if it wished whilst British pensioners are starving and freezing to death in the UK. I've not heard one normal person ever try to justify this policy at the expense of people in Britain.

The Indians and the Pakistanis must be dying of heart attacks from laughing.



Sweetleaf
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16 Aug 2011, 12:34 pm

androbot2084 wrote:
That is exactly what these Ebenezer Scrooge people do they disown members of their own family for no reason.


hmm maybe a point was being made...



Sweetleaf
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16 Aug 2011, 12:45 pm

Tequila wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
but aid in pakistan? that is more what I think chairity should be for


Cameron has given millions of pounds of money away to 'aid' in Pakistan and India. To countries that has its own space programme and could easily much better look after its own citizens if it wished whilst British pensioners are starving and freezing to death in the UK. I've not heard one normal person ever try to justify this policy at the expense of people in Britain.

The Indians and the Pakistanis must be dying of heart attacks from laughing.


Yes nothing like contributing to chairity so you can prove how generous you are, while still screwing over the people in your own country.



Dox47
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16 Aug 2011, 3:35 pm

Why wouldn't they be? They've been bought and paid for, often by the same set of people who buy the GOP who like hedging their bets. You might have slightly different players, a bit more union money than corporate money and trial lawyers rather than oilmen, but the end result is pretty damn similar.


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16 Aug 2011, 4:01 pm

Quote:
Top 20 Political Donors, 1989-2010

Rank Organization Total Donations, 1989-2010 Dem % Rep %
1 ActBlue $52,572,081 99% 0%
2 American Federation of State, County & Municipal Employees $45,238,103 94% 1%
3 AT&T Inc. $41,314,444 45% 54%
4 National Association of Realtors $39,717,410 47% 49%
5 National Education Association $36,312,895 81% 5%
6 Service Employees International Union $36,043,789 77% 2%
7 American Association for Justice $33,983,671 89% 8%
8 International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers $33,476,655 97% 2%
9 Laborers Union $31,335,267 89% 7%
10 American Federation of Teachers $31,023,603 90% 0%
11 Teamsters Union $30,632,309 89% 6%
12 Carpenters & Joiners Union $30,523,437 86% 9%
13 Communications Workers of America $29,468,934 95% 0%
14 American Medical Association $27,431,405 39% 59%
15 United Auto Workers $27,108,182 98% 0%
16 United Food & Commercial Workers Union $26,788,209 93% 0%
17 National Auto Dealers Association $26,664,992 32% 67%
18 Machinists & Aerospace Workers Union $26,407,374 98% 1%
19 United Parcel Service $24,505,222 37% 62%
20 American Bankers Association $24,190,464 39% 60%
Average 76% 20%

Note: Koch Industries ranks #87 at $9.5 million and AFSCME ranks #2 at $45.2 million. Read here what AFSCME has to say about the evil Koch brothers.


http://mjperry.blogspot.com/2011/08/top ... ocrat.html

I can't get the chart to paste in it's proper format, so just remember that Dems are always the first percentage listed. Or just click the link.


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Tequila
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16 Aug 2011, 4:03 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
Yes nothing like contributing to chairity so you can prove how generous you are.


...erm, Cameron is giving away millions of pounds of British taxpayer's money - really frittering it away - on deranged and nonsensical projects in India and Pakistan whilst a lot of people here are out of work or are very impoverished here. The guy's a scumbag. The three main parties have long ago stopped listening.



Inuyasha
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16 Aug 2011, 4:05 pm

Vexcalibur wrote:
mikecartwright wrote:
In my view the Democrats are just as much a Rich people's political party as the Republicans are both are funded and supported by and run by Rich/Wealthy Lobbyists who here agrees ?

http://www.socialistalternative.org/...10.php?id=1297


Hello,

The republicans make tax cuts for the rich.
The democrats make sure to "regulate" things in a way that the rich keep their monopolies.


Of the two seems you've just admitted Republicans are the less evil. Republicans are letting rich people keep more of their own money, if someone wants to start a business that ends up competing with the rich person's business and happens to outdo that rich guy's business, Republicans are fine with that too.