Illegal Immigration (My Personal Anecdote)

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Well, I can play the same game too. I can undercut anyone else's price to scrub toilets. If one group will do it for $5.00, I can do it for $2.50 per hour.

Hah! I'm doing it for $1.25

I wish there was a way to help these illegal immigrants. If they really did benefit the economy, I would not try to report illegal immigration or make it a big deal at all. But I overwhelmingly see it cause economic destruction of a community. I am not the only place. My whole family in different areas of southern California has experienced this.

I see it causes hardship for African Americans who now cannot get out of poverty. Ever wonder why it's always "Hispanics vs blacks"? Or why there are so many racial riots in cities like Los Angeles where there are a high percentage of African Americans and illegal immigrants? It's because there is competition for these low paying jobs that native Americans supposedly don't want.

When there was a racial riot at the high school, I didn't understand what was going on or why there would be so much tension. I now understand entirely why there is that tension. And this is the reason:

Native Americans do want these jobs. Often, they want more than one of these low paying jobs so they can lift themselves out of poverty. Yet they see a person who broke the law and entered the country illegally. Someone who does not pay taxes so they can afford to be paid less than minimum wage. Then the native American who has to pay taxes cannot realistically compete. It sucks. My heart bleeds for them.

Show me one example where a city or county which accepted an influx of illegal immigrants had a higher quality of life and had better schools which scored higher on standardized testing.

I feel the need to tell you something as a fellow human being; the illegal immigrants will not be so kind to you once they become the majority.

Remember, the Mexican people are a mixture of the native people's of Mexico of the Spanish who conquered them.

The Mexican people can be very discriminatory against people who identify as natives. I heard this from a lot of students at my university who have ties with Mexico.

Hmmm, techn0 might be right on his last paragraph here. But I "think" that it's mostly the case in some places of South America where the indigenous people do not constitute a majority (such as Brazil, the contrary being Bolivia, with Evo Morales representing the indigenous people (I reckon it's somewhere along 50% of "autochtones" and there's also a percentage of people of mixed heritage, hence the majority)).

I for one, find it amusing that the conquest of South and Central america was "motivated" in part by christianity to bring "civilization" to the "savages" into the universal message of "god", yet mexicans being mostly christian (last I checked) are being detrimental (so to speak) to their anglo-saxon christian neighbor (Although it has been said that there's been increasing activity by evangelicals to convert latinos (that includes brazilians)...).

It's a semi-good thing that us french can somewhat associate with hispanic / portuguese people, at the very least to a cultural / linguistic level. =/

They're Catholics though, that makes all the difference.

(I say that jokingly as a raised and confirmed RC BTW)

An illegal alien entering the US is a foreign invader and shouldn't be handled much differently. Do I need to be specific?
I don't care what their claimed reason is for being here .
They could be carrying diseases that we don't want here and we'd have no way to know.
They could be fugitives from the law in their country or ours and we'd have no way to know.
They could be terrorists infiltrating across the border and we'd have no way to know.
They could be spies and we'd never know.
Do I need to add more?
There's a reason we have people go through customs on the way in.
I've been through customs in other countries. If I'd tried to evade that and got caught on the inside I wouldn't blame them for shooting me on the spot.

There's a lot of things to do to get rid of alien invaders. We need to use the corporate death penalty and revoke the local business licenses of chronic offenders, and make identity theft by an illegal eligible to be tried as a capital offense. First off we need to militarily fortify the border, build a wall, and shoot everybody that crosses it without exception. We would need to use data mining technologies using all available IRS, social security, FBI, and credit information to identify illegals. Then surround city blocks and raid workplaces and serve warrants on all houses, apartments, and schools in the quarantined zone suspected of containing illegals as well as any building they are seen running into. Take them to a detention facility that is like a cross between the ministry of love in 1984 and MK-Ultra to await a hearing. Summarily execute those with a criminal history, then brand and electronically tag the rest and send them to a forced labor camp. That's legal to do to convicts. Then you could lease chain gang labor to farms and ranches and other certain approved rural businesses that only need them from the neck down. They would be leased at rates that would severely undercut the UFW. It's not like you are gong to have any civil engineers or IT administrators in the bunch anyway. You could use the most flexible interpretations of cruel and unusual punishment to match things that our all volunteer military has to go through, which would give us the ability to, if need be, cut out hot meals, make them work non stop for days on end, use group discipline, and have the option to transfer those from terrorist states or suspected terrorist sleepers to the CIA rendition program for further interrogation outside of US jurisdiction. Then after about a year or two, kick them out of the country, and if we catch anyone with a brand or electronic tag on our side of the border we give them another hearing at the detention center before we summarily execute them. That should drive them out. We'd kick as many kids out as possible, and move the American Indian kids to schools on or near their reservations and overhaul the Indian school system to board all the anchor babies until they are 18 or join the military. It wold be hard to do with the Spanish speaking ones, but for kids from other parts of the world, it would be best to mix them up so they are more easily forced to use English and lose their ability to identify with their 3rd world roots. That should drive most of them out!

The writing is on the wall that sooner or later our military is going to have a campaign in Mexico whether we are invited there or not, so we need to get control of potential saboteurs before then.

Gangs of slave labor: yeah, that'll drive the wages back up!

(/sarcasm)

"They are only doing the jobs that Americans are too lazy to do."

It would free up a lot of restaurant, maintenance, construction, and some retail jobs mostly. It's not the most ideal thing to get the economy going again, but it would get people employed and making more than they did on an unemployment check! Wages go up, more people have healthcare again (though a lot of those jobs don't offer healthcare it's still an improvement), government costs go down, it's a start and we wouldn't say "good enough" and leave it alone. There's a lot more to be done. Cutting dependency on trade with China and foreign oil dependency, and NAFTA would be the key to really fixing things.

I will give the Chicano movement credit in that the majority of Americans are incapable jobs where one has to work outside in extremely hot weather for hours. This is more often as a strawberry picker or a harvester of some type of hand-picked crop. Also, a lot of gardening work and grounds keeping work which is outside.

People who are white, asian, or people with pale swarthy skin will be burnt to a crisp where I live. They lack the natural protection. We had some who tried but employers will refuse to hire a white person, pale person, or asian person because that person is a liability. They are almost guaranteed to get heat stroke with the hours required in the hot sun.

So who do the illegal immigrants compete for these jobs? I saw the illegals compete actively for these outside, harvesting jobs with people who come from a poor background and have very dark skin; people who identify as African American. The competition of even the most difficult jobs for African Americans of low socioeconomic status and Chicanos cements a heavy, toxic relationship.

This relationship is even more toxic since these are native Americans do want these jobs and the Chicanos keep up the illusion that they do jobs no one else wants to do. The "poor black" knows by experience that this is not the case.

Janitorial work for inside conditions which are kept cooler is desired by many native born Americans. I applied for one of those when I was in high school for some extra money, and I never heard back. So there is demand and competition for those types of jobs.

Anyone who thinks a decrease to the consumer population will help the economy
does not do much thinking.

If your grocery store is "over run" my meskins don't you think it would prolly be closed
if we sent them packing?

Illegals buy stuff they have to eat right?
And guess what clever clever anti-intellectuals.
Undocumented workers pay taxes.

WHAT!?!?!

Undocumented workers pay taxes!?!?

Yes Payroll taxes if using "stolen" SS ids (They do not get returns so we pocket that.)
Property taxes through their rent and mortgages and such.
But most importantly and you would have to be real macaroon to deny this
Sales taxes.

If your argument were true, California would not be in the deep financial mess its mired in. Think again...illegals have cost this state billions of dollars. They don't pay into healthcare, they get it for free since they have no money. That is one of the biggest messes this state has ever seen. The only real taxes they pay is when they purchase something. Big whoop!

You are making intuitive leaps about both the cost of benefits paid out and the revenues remitted.

The population of undocumented aliens is estimated to be about 11 million, and it is estimated that they generate about $150billion in economic activity. That's about $13,600 per person (including adults and children). Given that almost every dollar earned by an undocumented alien is spent almost immediately, that's direct economic stimulus, that probably creates about 8 million jobs. (US average wage is just over $10, and the average work week is about 34 hours. That works out to $18,166 per worker, exclusive of benefits.)

According to the IRS, about 6 million undocumented aliens submit tax returns (better than 50%). CBO figures suggest that between 50 and 75 percent of undocumented aliens remit federal, state and local taxes, and their contributions to social security amounted to $7 bn. (For which, incidentally, they are not eligible to receive any benfits. So they pay into a system from which they will see no recovery. Think about that when someone in your family receives a Social Security cheque).

Even significant supporters of aggressive immigration enforcement have only been able to peg the net cost for the presence of undocumented aliens at $2,700 per household--a figure which relies on conservative assumptions about costs and consumption, and which does not take into account the depressive effect of undocument aliens on labour costs and resulting consumer price impacts.

So by all means, expell the 11 million. Then put 8 million more Americans out of work. And when that dust settles, see what happens to prices when employers have to provide real wages for the work that needs to be done.

I see you're in BC. A report just came out here in California stating facts that over $44 million dollars has been lost due to illegal immigration. I'm so sorry you don't like facts, but times are what they are, & when one sector tends to bleeds a state over time, this is what happens. Since you don't seem to see the issue, maybe you'd like to have the thousands of illegals sucking up BC's resources? Let's see what you have to say when that happens.

You are not correct about the causes of California's current crisis. If you're actually a Californian, you have to be deliberately blinding yourself to be missing some of the major problems in this state - very few of which have to do with immigrants, legal or otherwise.
http://www.time.com/time/nation/article ... 38,00.html
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/24/us/24calprisons.html