What Is Religion?

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do you have any stats for that or are your prejudices showing as much as the atheists you describe in your post?

I can only speak for myself, and there are definitely plenty of stupid self righteous atheist, just like there are stupid and self righteous people in all religions. Like, I thought it was ridiculously stupid when all that controversy over having "in god we trust" on our money and the pledge of allegiance occurred. Who gives a s**t what our money says, really? It's not like having "in god we trust" on our money is the same as having a government official come to your house and force you to read the bible or any other religious text, so who cares? And as for the pledge of allegiance, you don't even have to say it. They can't legally force you to say it, so again, who cares? I guess people want to be able to pledge allegiance to america without mentioning god, but I don't see why.

As for me, I don't want religion to only be behind closed doors, but I wish religious people would quit trying to shove it down my throat. I actually quite enjoy religious debate and discussion. It gives me a chance to better understand how people think, and I like that a lot. I've always had an interest in psychology.

I wish christians didn't claim there's a war on christmas going on when it takes up the calendar, sometimes from before halloween all the way thru half of january. And I hate how their reason for even suggesting there's a war on christmas is the fact that some stores have now chosen to say "happy holidays" instead of "merry christmas." It's as if christians think that their religion is the only one to be acknowledged, and I don't agree with that.

Now I know some people actually do get offended if you tell them, "merry christmas," and that's just stupid. Why? Because someone is wishing you a good day... Just f*****g take it for what it is. They might not know you're not christian... So what? At the same time, why should a christian be offended by "happy holidays," or even "happy chaunukkah?" First of all, "happy holidays" has been around since as long as I can remember, and I always took it as someone wishing you a happy thanksgiving, merry christmas, and happy new years all at the same time... or maybe just christmas and new years. Either way, saying "happy holidays" means that they're wishing you a happy day, regardless of which holiday you celebrate, and I fail to see the problem with that. I don't understand why people get offended so easily. Christians need to realize they're not alone in this country anymore. They need to be more tolerant, but I feel as they're so quick to preach damnation and complain whenever they're not specifically catered to. If you can understand not wanting to be left out/ignored, then you should understand why happy holidays is the best solution and NOT take it as a "war on christmas." Christmas is a HUGE cash cow. It's not going away anytime soon.

And that's not even touching on the subject that christmas has become nothing but a big consumer whore day, a day for which people will literally TRAMPLE EACH OTHER TO DEATH and SHOOT MACE/PEPPER SPRAY IN EACH OTHER'S FACES in order to buy presents. I realize some people view christmas as some sacred holiday when they do other things besides exchange presents, good things, but most people don't. To most, it's all about the stupid presents. Either way, I never understood why, if it's someone else's birthday, we get presents. Shouldn't JESUS get the presents if it's his birthday?

Basically, whatever you want to celebrate, fine... Just keep it away from me, please. I'll gladly sit and talk about your religion, but I'll mostly be questioning why you believe certain things. And that's not an attack against you or your beliefs; It comes from simple curiosity and nothing more. Sometimes I might have to laugh at some of it too, because it's silly to me. Again, that's not meant to offend or attack you.

I understand where you're coming from, blue max, but you have to acknowledge that there are equally ignorant and mean people in your religion too, and they're generally the reason why the atheists who act like them exist. I used to be like that, and I still can be sometimes, but I'm trying to learn not to be. And that's becoming a lot easier lately.

Anyway, I hope some day we can all get along and learn to love one another as we love ourselves. Namaste.

...And now for a totally unrelated video!
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YLO7tCdBVrA[/youtube]

Last edited by DerStadtschutz on 22 Oct 2012, 3:20 am, edited 2 times in total.

I think that with the discovery of ancient civilizations under the sea and the fact that MANY ancient texts talk about a bigass flood, it's hard to consider those stories mere allegory. I don't take them 100% literally either, of course. It's not so much that I read these texts looking for science, but rather I know of them, and then I later find out that science confirms certain parts of them.

One or many great imaginary friends that a bunch of people are brainwashed to obey and take seriously.

I don,t have any problem believing whatever they want. But in my mind evangelists are doing falls under what I would consider vice. Like gambling, drinking booze, or smoking weed. Its not exactly good for you. Just like the casino does not have whats best for your financial health in mind.
I am thinking of people that are listed in this list,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_sc ... Christians
These popular evangelist very clearly are involved in various confidence scams. A picture with some starving kids for Haiti with banner of your name does not make a charity. These ruthless hustlers make tens of millions, all tax free. And there are a lot more of them out there than what made that list. Like other vices it should not be tax exempt, they should pay taxes like the rest of us do. The taxation can be on a sliding scale so smaller groups could be taxed very little.

It seems like you're making a claim that all atheists attack people that are religious, which is not true. Most just attack the religion and not the believers, with the exception of those that think anyone that believes in gods are stupid. However, sometimes the intolerance has nothing to do with the fact that people believe in gods. The intolerance is of the specific beliefs, the specific gods.

When people are obviously believing in gods that resemble horrible tyrants, and having to lie to themselves to convince themselves that their gods are good, how can a person tolerate that? How can people just sit back and allow people to believe in religions that do more damage than good, whether it be physical, psychological, or emotional? The majority of atheists that are intolerant of religious beliefs are intolerant when it comes to religions that definitely do more damage than good. For instance, shouldn't it be a good thing to be intolerant of beliefs that force people not to think for themselves? Shouldn't people be intolerant of religions that use fear to get vulnerable people to believe and then to keep them from doubting?

I agree that people do have the right to believe in religions that fit into this category of "horrible religions" if they want to, but that does not mean that others who object to that religion should keep silent about it. People that see those horrible religions for what they are should attack those beliefs, even if people are unwilling to listen to or read what they have to say. The fact is, the religions that cause believers to be intolerant of those that do not believe or of people who live "sinful" lifestyles are religions that do not deserve tolerance.



The religions that most atheists consider to be "below them" are those dangerous and harmful religions I have already described. Those religions deserve to be insulted, although the believers don't, but unfortunately, it's nearly impossible to joke about the flaws of terrible religions without offending the believers of those religions.

No reasonable atheist is going to begin killing people who have religions, that would require some sort of other crazy belief along with the non-belief in gods. What I and many other reasonable atheists want is for the dangerous religions to disappear. Sure, some of these horrible religions will be fine for the believers, until they begin to question and doubt. Then they just try to suppress those doubts, because of a fear of Hell or something else terrible. Why should people be tolerant of religions that do this? Religions that make people afraid to doubt must disappear. If I had the courage to get on my rooftop, I would definitely shout out how terrible I think that type of religion is and how badly religions that fit the category need to disappear.

"Flags & creeds are parasites on humanity: parasites that cause derangement." --The Theory & Practice of Oligarchic Collectivism

i can imagine the early days when a person might feel especially reverent in a place that was sacred to them. maybe they might even make up stories about it. (Shintoism is sort of frozen at this stage.) once there are specialists to mediate between the gods & the public, they take it upon themselves as a full-time job & expect others to support them. i think this is a mistake. (it should be the provenance of amateurs only.) then they organize a hierarchy, which is a second mistake. next, they codify what it is you are supposed to think & feel; & persecute the dissenters.... (you see where this is leading.)

my special interests are my religions. i don't expect anyone else to appreciate any of it, though that would be nice.

i've been to Delphi. it's a magical place, still--though the priests have all gone now. i like the cathedrals of Europe better when hardly anybody but tourists uses them. (there are still magical places, far from roads, in the western United States; i'd be an idiot if i told you where they are.)

but the great church-buildings of America give me the willies. they don't try to persuade you with their beauty. they want to hustle you with their sheer empty volume. they want to drown out every other voice with their noise. this isn't about reverence. it is simply fascism in religious guise.

The only genuine part of religion is the still, small voice within.

Everything else are parasitic memes.

ruveyn