The_Walrus wrote:
Feminism is not built on any individual's principles.
That's right, the syllabus taught in gender studies classes is based on the principles of multiple bigots.
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Find something hateful on Everyday Feminism, for example. That has as many contributors in a week as the few scare quotes you picked out.
Everyday Feminism has 268k followers, Gearhart's teaching has informed the ideology of ALL gender and women's studies students.
Nevertheless, challenge accepted.
http://everydayfeminism.com/2015/01/mal ... to-follow/ - that one is on the first page.
In which a man lays out the ground rules for how other men should behave if they want to be accepted into the club.
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1. Understand that women are leading the way and affirm their capable leadership. Don’t assert yourself at the forefront.
Feminism has primarily been a movement for women, led by women. Although bell hooks wrote the iconic Feminism Is for Everybody to encourage all people to become invested in the struggle for gender equality, maleness is still privileged in a society that promotes male perspectives and experiences at the expense of women’s."
Under feminism, men cannot be leaders. This is based entirely on our perception that all men, everywhere, are better off than all women by nature of existing.
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"2. When it comes to issues that directly pertain to women’s bodies and experiences, be quiet and listen.
For people who have penises and a male reproductive system, they will never know what it’s like to have a period, go through menopause, or bear children.
If a man is conventionally masculine, straight, and not transgender, he is much less likely to encounter street harassment and sexual assault or be told that his gender innately makes him unfit to fully participate in various aspects of the workplace.
And should he dare to speak up in favor of gender equality, he likely won’t face online harassment, including death and rape threats, as was recently the case for feminist gaming critic Anita Sarkeesian.
Instead of talking over women or worse, making unfounded assumptions about what they experience on a daily basis, be quiet and listen to what women have to say, and redirect other men to their voices."
Men should shut up and not contribute to any conversation involving women's experiences.
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"3. Men don’t get to determine if they are “allies” to the feminist movement. Women do.
As a man, being a feminist isn’t some special badge you earn after going to a rally, speaking out for gender equality, or holding another man accountable for sexist behavior.
It’s not about getting “ally cookies” or a pat on the back every time you do something that’s considered pro-feminism.
Rather, it’s about making sure your actions aren’t sexist, transphobic, or reinforcements of gender-based bigotry. It is not going above and beyond to act respectfully and in solidarity with women working towards gender equality."
Men can't choose to be feminists, they need the approval of a woman to join the cult.
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"4. Take responsibility for addressing men’s issues with other men, rather than expecting women in feminism to do all of the work.
Men who are ignorant about feminism — and even so-called Men’s Rights Activists — often critique feminists for not addressing what they describe as men’s struggles.
Some of these issues include the disproportionately high male suicide rate, how the court system regards fathers in custody battles, and the perceived abandonment of survivors of sexual violence.
On the one hand, these criticisms miss a pretty large point: Feminism can, and already has, helped men as well as women.
Additionally, men, especially white men, are already positioned to work towards resolutions, since institutional sexism gives them a disproportionate hold on the levers of power.
Instead of railing against the women in feminism, it’s important that men take steps to work with each other, as well as with feminist leaders, to recognize how the struggle for gender equality plays a key role in many of these efforts."
Men should form their own groups to deal with the problems that men face, but feminists get to decide which men's groups are valid and which are not. White men (literally all white men) are dehumanised by their reduction to a collective here too.
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5. Use your male privilege to encourage other men to work towards gender equality under women’s leadership.
Once you feel that you have a stable understanding of what it means to be a feminist, motivate other men you know to join in the push for gender equality.
Being a feminist shouldn’t be seen as a chore, a job, or a simple label, but rather as a lifelong commitment to ensuring that institutional sexism comes to an end.
But, as the CEO of Microsoft recently learned, that commitment should run deeper than tokenization, or telling women, from a position of privilege, how they should approach key issues such as the gender pay gap.
As a man, you should abuse your manly powers of mind control over other males, then step aside and let us take the lead.
This one also links to the following article - pay special attention to employee data chart:
http://mic.com/articles/101052/microsof ... sm-problem
We have 71:29 ratio of males to females at Microsoft. This is attributed to sexism, despite the fact that women hold less than 20% of Computer Science degrees.
Then we come to ethnicity. Caucasians make up 60.6% of all Microsoft employees, whilst Asians account for 28.9%. Sounds horribly skewed in favour of white people, right? Well, no. Not when you consider that 72% of US citizens are caucasian. If anything, the data shows that it pays to be Asian rather than Caucasian, as Asians make up around 4.75% of the US population.
But let's not allow things like facts and data get in the way of uninformed opinion, right?
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6. Don’t use the label of ‘feminist’ as a way to try to get women to like you — that’s disingenuous and counterproductive.
We’ve all heard the horror stories of men using feminism to get dates or new woman friends, thinking the label may prove they are somehow “softer” and not as ignorant as more conventionally masculine “bro” types.
However, this “nice guy” approach can backfire. Beware of the male feminist who behaves as though his feminist sympathizing makes him more entitled to sexual attention from women, even when he shows little to no understanding of his privilege.
Instead, this logic objectifies and belittles women with the assumption that they can be manipulated into liking someone who really doesn’t care about their position in society.
Even we feminists think that men only choose to be feminists because we think they're ruled by their penises.
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7. When given opportunities to execute professional tasks related to feminist issues, consider referring other women instead.
Women have been at the forefront of feminism and civil rights efforts for more than 100 years. But by and large, institutional sexism often renders women and their experiences invisible because male needs, thoughts, and opinions are usually elevated above their counterparts’.
So when organizations or news outlets ask for a “male perspective” on issues such as feminism and gender equality, ask what the needs and goals of the conversation are in order to discern whether or not you can truly speak from a place of experience, education, and expertise, especially if the topics are related to issues that mostly affect women.
Don’t be afraid to suggest a woman peer if you’re not the best suited for the event or discourse.
Should anyone ask for a male perspective on feminism, you should immediately seek out the nearest woman and allow her to speak on your behalf because, although men cannot possibly understand a woman's perspective due to not being one, women have all got a perfect knowledge of the male perspective.
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8. Educate yourself about the history of feminism and how women of different backgrounds have approached the movement.
Feminism means different things depending on the country, its laws, racial and ethnic groups, class stratification, and the prevailing world religion, among other factors.
In the United States, feminism encompasses enslaved women writing about their struggle for both their womanhood and for their full humanity to be recognized and respected. It includes the fight for suffrage, reproductive justice, access to education, and equal employment opportunities.
Often, those struggles have privileged the perspectives of mainstream white women at the expense of women of color who endure universal, but differing struggles, given disparities along the lines of race and class.
It’s all the more important, especially in a “post-racial” society, to make sure the history of feminism isn’t whitewashed.
Women in the US are "enslaved" - presumably by men, though he doesn't actually specify. He then mentions those things that feminism encompasses in the US:
Suffrage: hardly relevant in modern America
Reproductive Justice: an issue that's primarily contested across political lines rather than gender lines
Access to Education: in a US where women outnumber men in colleges
Equal Employment Opportunities: in a country where 30% of Microsoft employees are women, despite less than 20% of Computer Science degrees being held by women
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9. Ensure your feminism is intersectional.
Not much to comment on here - he basically gives us his vague opinion of some stuff.
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10. Acknowledge that sometimes, women need opportunities to discuss feminist issues without the presence of men. And that’s okay.
When hashing out difficult conversations, ideas and questions about women’s issues, and the direction of the movement, it can be challenging to deal with interjections from men who derail the conversation due to their relative lack of understanding.
In addition, some women may feel more comfortable discussing their bodies and their experiences absent the gaze and presence of men, whose thoughts, needs, and desires are privileged in virtually all sectors of society.
Instead of taking offense, practice respect and compassion by minimizing yourself in the situation and by simply asking if there’s any way you can be helpful outside of the closed dialogue.
But any time we see a male-dominated sphere, we will scream and shout and jump up and down screaming misogyny until they let more women in. Special bonus points for use of the derogatory "male gaze" label which asserts that white, heterosexual men can be generalised based on the behaviour of a minority of their number.
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11. When women criticize your involvement in feminism, don’t talk over them or talk down to them. Actively listen and be accountable.
Sometimes, in doing the work or attempting to be helpful, people make mistakes, and that’s a human thing to do. But listening to constructive criticism and being accountable for missteps is what separates a responsible ally from someone who is clueless about their privilege.
Instead of talking over women or talking down to them, ask questions about how you can be most helpful.
This is just a re-affirmation of rule#1.
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Most feminists, myself included, are horrified by those statements.
Then where is all the condemnation of these women on Everyday Feminism?
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The people who said them are just as bad as you if they believe what they are saying, particularly Morgan and Solanas.
Keep sending that hate my way. You're making my argument for me splendidly.
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Although it is worth noting that the Miller Gearhart quote, at the very least, is not as bad in context (she is not advocating killing men, rather ovular merging).
Not as bad? She's an advocate for female supremacy and the only way to achieve her goal would be to subjugate or exterminate a majority of the population. You're literally defending a woman whose ideology is analogous to fascism.
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A few posts ago, you were calling out Jono for extrapolating from a few examples to a whole population, yet you yourself are perfectly happy to extrapolate from a few fringe lunatics when it suits you.
Miller Gearhart, Morgan, Brownmiller and Solanas are fringe lunatics? What were you saying earlier about having a tenuous grip on reality?
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Then again, it should be of little surprise to anyone when an anti-feminist possesses a tenuous grip on reality.
But we will all, of course, be shocked that someone posting in defence of feminism has resorted to ad hominem.
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That isn't an ad hominem.
Yes it is.
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An ad hominem would be saying that you are wrong because you are stupid or a terrible person.
Or mentally unsound.
I didn't say you were wrong because you are mentally unsound. You have it backwards. I said that your wrongness is evidence that you cannot tell what is real and correct. Consequently, it is not an ad hominem. You might claim that it is rude, but it is not fallacious.
The sad thing is, I actually think you believe that constitutes a logical argument.
"No I didn't say you're wrong because you have mental health problems, I said that your wrongness is proof that you have mental health problems.". Now there's a hole you won't be refilling in a hurry.
So I'm left with little choice but to choose between believing you're either an idiot or a delusional bigot by your own deeds. The difference being, I've demonstrated why such a conclusion is reasonable.
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It goes way beyond disingenuous, and is in fact a personal attack. Considering which website you're posting on, I would expect you to demonstrate at least a modicum of sensitivity when discussing matters of mental health. Do you genuinely expect anyone to accept your claim that "most feminists are nice people" when you personally set the bar so low?
I was not implying that you are mentally ill. I was implying you are incapable of telling what is real (as shown by you consistently failing to recall what you have just posted and getting definitions wrong). Plenty of mentally healthy people are just like you, such as many theists, naturopaths, and Torquay supporters. I am sorry if you misinterpreted that.
You most certainly did imply that I am mentally ill. You've since gone a step further. All of your assertions regarding my mental acuity (or lack thereof) have been unsupported by any evidence beyond your own opinion - one which evidently supports a world view along the lines of "anyone who doesn't see the true light of feminism must be mentally unsound".
I think I've adequately demonstrated bigotry, hatred and cult-like behaviour in this post. Thanks for providing such a wonderful object lesson.
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If you want people to be nice to you, I suggest you stop voicing your opposition to gender equality and calling those who support gender equality "fascists".
I have no beef with genuine egalitarians. When feminism manages to close the gap between actuality and its unfit for purpose dictionary definition, give me a call.
17 Jan 2015, 7:10 pm
