Police

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I didn't say hatred...I said standing up against the abuses committed by police and police corruption, I do not encourage 'hate' towards every police officer across the board as that doesn't help anything. And kinda got lost as to where you were going with the rest of that....

Basically the way I see it getting the populace nice and divided, makes perfect opportunity to instate martial law or instate a full on police state...since if people are two busy fighting among themselves they are distracted. Its especially good if you can get people to rationalize that police brutality is ok so long as its not happening to them specifically...and I have seen plenty of comments all over the internet indicating there are people who think like that. Not saying its for sure going to happen or trying to pretend I can give actual 'prophetic' warnings but based on various things going on now as well as looking at history its certainly not improbable.

Well how else are Librarians and teachers and public transit workers going to afford their comfortable retirement salaries? You take the moral high ground and oppose this use of police to benefit all public servants, why don't you offer up a tax hike you'd like to see replace it.

You're acting like these cops knew of this guy's health issues. Taking down a big person, who resisted arrest, normally never ends in death, and you're blaming the cops for not reading this dude's mind and body vitals lol and you're acting as if he's the only one breaking the law selling loose cigs. If he never died and went in to jail to serve his time and came back out to continue doing the same he was doing before, you wouldn't have an excuse to hate on the police.

Maybe the police should avoid lethally shooting people where its not necessary than....like the cops in my city who shot a teenage girl to death for being in an allegedly stolen car, autopsy implies the car could not have been driving 'at' the cops at the time appears more as though they approached the vehicle and open fired...maybe the panicked teens tried to drive away when the shooting started. And guess what no criminal charges for them even though evidence points to dishonesty and excessive force on their part....and I am supposed to feel sorry for the poor cops who do things like this getting their feelings hurt?

Taxes and utility rate increases are the only justifiable way to cover those things.

Politicians at the local level don't have the backbone to do it.



No I'm acting like arresting him at all was not justifiable.

And without his death the NYPD has committed innumerable sins that make them worthy of hate.

Its purely the 'left' that upholds the cigarette tax to encourage less smoking?....I am quite certain I have heard plenty of people/politicians on the right that believe there ought to be legislation to decrease smoking. I think it more depends on the individuals view on personal freedom not so much if they are 'right' or 'left'.

even if the guy was told not to sell cigarettes.....6 cops? ....and pretty sure capital punishment is not a valid punishment for such a crime. If you prevent someone from being able to breath you can kill them regardless of their size, if this is about the guy who basically got strangled in a choke hold....or is this another one that just got shot to death? Either way excessive force is not justified. I mean how would they not notice if the suspect in the choke hold starts flailing around or going limp or things that happen when you cannot breath either too stupid to be a cop or knew what they were doing.

Last edited by Sweetleaf on 23 Aug 2015, 11:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Yes but the police don't commit anywhere near the amount of corruption that the non-police public engage in yet you choose to take a huge moral stand against police corruption, so there must be even more evils being committed by police then anyone else. That, or you're expecting of cops an angelic standard that you would never speak out on against those who cops arrest.

I'm not rationalizing police brutality. I'm saying it doesn't exist to the level that makes it worth devoting as much time as police-haters do, to protest it. Yeah it exists, but does it exist to the extant that you want to wage war on their corruption? Why don't you wage war on corrupt poor people lol, or corrupt members of the middle class. In other words, your politics is defining who you vilify, and who you give a pass to.

The greater evils in your eyes are the ones you devote the most time to... if you(or the Left) talk more about global warming and Monsanto and Police brutality, then violence in black America or the Christians and Yazidis being killed by Muslims, then that means you think global warming and monsanto and police brutality is a greater evil... And when you only do nothing but talk about what police do wrong, it's hard not to get an impression that - in your eyes - police never do anything right.

That having been said, it's good to know where you're coming from.

Yes but it's mostly a left-of-center cause, since, well, forever. It isn't necessarily a left-right issue, but unfortunately, it's become that. It's certainly a secular issue, because it's unhealthy, and unhealthy attitudes strain healthcare resources that burden the state, which is why you have bans on smoking in most left-leaning institutions, cities, and countries. Religious Christians also join in on opposing smoking, but they never lead most efforts to ban smoking, nor constitute a majority of its supporters. From Canada to New Zealand to Paris and New York, the Left has all sorts of regulations on smoking to curtail its use and profit off of its misuse, a profit that has become addicting.

He's a huge guy and he resisted arrest. Had he just gotten down on the ground, they wouldn't have had to try and wrestle him down. I think his asthma killed him, from panic. Not the choking. Had he not had his health issues, he would have been wrestled to the ground with the same amount of force, and you wouldn't be using his death to libel systemic evil on the part of cops.

How is it libel when we're well aware systemic evel can exist?

Yes. Mistakes happen. But how often does this happen? Millions of Americans are dying a year from excessive police force? Hundreds of thousands suffer through police brutality every year? This is what you and the entire Left are preoccupied with? If only you had the same passion against murderers and rapists. It's fine if it were just you by the way, who was against police brutality. But sadly, there are tens upon tens of millions of Americans, who also hold your obsession with bringing cops to justice(and fighting global warming, and destroying Monsanto and Walmart).

I admire that you want to fight corruption, but if you wanted to do so on a more fairer basis that is proportional to the amount that actually exists in the world today, then I'd be more sympthetic to your cop-obsession. For example, I have the feeling that I'm never going to hear you being upset about a time when noncops shot up a car full of teens that was driving away. And you can't tell me that that's never happened. But you choose to amplify it when cops do it, and, well, maybe for you at least, such incidents probably don't happen in the real world between non-cop members of the public.

I don't know if its systemic. Just because something is likely, doesn't mean that the institution it belongs to is infected with a mindset favoring excessive force.

I don't think cops are any more corrupt then other public servants, from district attorneys to governors, to the people who clean the streets and collect your trash(if that isn't privatized), to your mailmen or bus driver.

What corruption do the non-police public engage in....or do you mean like the government aside from police? And where is the evidence the police have committed less crimes or are involved in less corruption? Sure you can say that...but I question how true it is...especially since much of the time police are not held responsible for any criminal actions they take or abuse of power so much of their corruption/crimes don't ever end up on record. And yeah there is a major problem with police abusing their power and using excessive force, never said they commit more evils than anyone else...but they should be held responsible for the evils they do commit.

Id say police brutality certainly exists to the extent protest and anger is reasonable...again I don't think hate solves much. And I never mentioned waging any war, but standing up against abuse and exposing it in my opinion is a good thing. Also pretty sure corrupt police who supposedly enforce laws and serve the public are more of a threat than middle class or poor citizens that may be described as corrupt...those aren't the people running things, making arrests or enforcing laws/regulations so yeah to me the police corruption is more directly problematic. Do not see who I have vilified or who I've given a pass to....police brutality and abuse of power just disturbs me, that doesn't mean I 'vilify' all cops I know they don't all abuse power or use excessive force, still doesn't negate the problem.

Also I don't only do nothing but talk about how police are wrong..Monsanto is just a big ugly corporation, some of the violence in 'black america' is actually perpetuated by the police corruption and use of excessive force so to be upset about police corruption hardly negates caring about that issue. I admit I don't know a lot about the christians being killed by muslims that certainly isn't right....though I imagine this is taking place in other countries, what am I personally going to do about that? With police corruption and abuse of power I could get involved in some kind of activism to help address it within my community and in turn the nation as a whole, or as I pointed out before if I saw something I could get a video....there isn't a lot of christians getting killed by muslims around here, but there certainly is police corruption and abuse of power. I don't think you really get where I am coming from at all.

Well if that really is the case, that it was the asthma and the choke hold was not at all the cause, then I suppose that one is more of an unfortunate accidental killing. I admit I'd have to do more in depth reading up on that to really determine which I think it was for sure. I do however think my example of the teenage girl getting shot and the cops lying about how it happened is a pretty good example of excessive force/abuse of power on the part of the cops.

Whether or not cops are more or less corrupt than other public servants is immaterial.

When a mailman steals your mail, it's a federal offense just like if anyone else stole it. The scope of responsibility extended to carriers of mail extends to . . . the mail.

Cops have a great deal more entrusted to them, and more than none of them betray that trust.

And get their asses covered.

Take for example officer Kelley Stewart of Durham NC, where i have some family, who shot himself and then decided to blame it on the guy he was hassling for driving while black:

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_ ... ewart.html

Yes mistakes happen? I have a hard time seeing going up to a vehicle from the side and open firing as an 'accident' and then deliberately lying about that and claiming they shot because the car was driving 'at' them when evidence points to shots being fired before the car was moving, and from the side not the front where it would have happned if the drive was trying to run them over.

Millions of americans do not have to die from police brutality for it to be a serious issue, and I am certain thousands of americans at the very least feel threatned by the police and distrustful of them.....go take a poll and see. And I cannot speak for the entire left....but police brutality and abuse of power is one of many issues I care about and feel strongly about its not the singular thing I constantly pre-occupy myself with, I mean so I post in a thread about police my opinion about the police and suddenly this is the only issue I care about according to you? what the hell.

Where do you get that I think police brutality is worse than murder and rape, I mean sure its right up there with it and could potentially even include murder and rape...but no I would not claim rape or murder to be lessor crimes than police corruption.

Also are you suggesting people should support and be ok with police brutality and abuse of power? I mean you act like its a bad thing people oppose police brutality....so tell me why should people support police brutality? I mean you've already berated me for not supporting it so now I want to know why I should? Why is it sad people want cops who commit crimes, use excessive force, abuse their power and such brought to justice....Is it also sad when people want murderers and rapists brought to justice?

I also don't have any obsession with cops, I once again simply see police brutality and abuse of power as an important issue along with many other issues. Also I imagine if someone posted that a bunch of teenagers got shot by non-cop citizens I'd certainly be disturbed and angered about it you think I only think something is wrong if cops do it? but if its not a cop its ok.........well you're dead wrong there. You are very good at cramming tons and tons of words in my mouth I never said and making countless inaccurate assumptions about me I will give you that. How do I choose to amplify things cops do over things anyone else does? By posting about examples of police brutality in a thread on that topic? I thought I was just discussing the topic at hand but whatever you say.

But most importantly why should police brutality be supported rather than opposed?

Police are privileged in being able to do violence unto others with the State's sanction; therefore the corruption of a police officer is vastly more costly to the body politic than the corruption of other public servants not thus privileged. I wholeheartedly support extending the same unflinching standard of brutal, immediate, and total punishment for any failings to fishing and game wardens, park rangers, correctional officers, federal agents, and any and all other persons entrusted with the responsibility of committing socially-permitted violence.



Let me see if I can make that any clearer for you. Law enforcement officers are the absolute scum of the earth. There is nothing that they can do to ever elevate themselves to the status of decent human beings. I would feel worse after swatting a fly than I would after removing police filth from the world. And as I indicated upthread, I come from a family with a long tradition of serving in law enforcement, so I know very well of what I speak.

Well the larger public is your answer. They still view police very favorably, and this is across ages, ethnicity's, and income. http://www.gallup.com/poll/183704/confi ... years.aspx It's mostly Democrats and the Left who have turned on police, in order to advance their race agenda, and as of late, their attempt to pacify America both abroad and domestically. If there were such widespread corruption, and I mean... sex trafficking, drug trading, rapes, murders, extortion's, assassinations, money laundering, etc, the public wouldn't view cops so favorably.

The poor people I describe kill tens of thousands of innocent people every year. How many people do cops kill a year and do you think that warrants your preoccupation?

How many young blacks have to be killed by other young blacks, in order for you to devote as much of a preoccupation to the toxic breakdown in black life, as you do to "corrupt" cops?