Islam & the Future of Tolerance - Maajid Nawaz & Sam Harris

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While I'm glad my weirdo stalker weighed in but hundreds of years in the future in Europe is an oversimplification of "taking over" when that to me implies an immediate threat and is more of a twisting of words to fit this situation, this long term view is not uncommon and it is something Muamar Gaddafi echoed before he was killed. Projections 20-30 or however many years down the road really mean nothing nor does it take into account the uptick from these "refugees" which could be in the tens of millions when it is all said over with if the tide is not stopped. It is a very dangerous time in the middle east right now with the makings of a world war, Africa's population is exploding, if our borders and immigration policies put in check then in the long run it is inevitable given the fact that Europeans aren't even reproducing at replacement rate. Things are going to get a lot worse, you're from Denmark right and your people are pretty cognizant of this aren't they? They don't seem to be in love with the multiculti to the same degree as your neighbors but it is tiny country, smaller than even Wisconsin so I would be very concerned if I were you about demographic shock that the EU wants to inflict on your country. This is just the beginning, this flow will not stop for decades. Japan's population will decline by a third in the next 50 years but they will still have a country and a culture, in the west we've married ourselves this idea of perpetual growth and massive entitlements and the elites in this country do not have any sensitivity to our culture or quality of life. It's not good, look at the Balkans, things are going to get much worse if we do not come to our senses. This is not a take over, it's suicide.

Both books with lots of chapters and contradictory statements. All horribly immoral.

so not only do you not have any proof, you tried to stir the pot by inferring that i'm part of your conspiracy.

the irony of you calling me a dullard is the funniest thing i've seen all week.

and there are christians, jews and secular folks that are just as bad. you're singling out islam and ignoring everything else

Why not look at actual numbers instead of useless anecdotal claims. Look at the percentage of Muslims who want sharia law. Besides, I can't think of a single example of "secular folks" calling for the deaths of people who insult them.

Islam is uniquely bad. Because it's holy book is shockingly violent, even compared to others, and it maintains its hegemony by violently suppressing dissent. Certainly you could find some historical parallels, but precious few in modern times.

can you define what you mean by 'want sharia law'? does this mean that sharia law should be replacing the law system entirely?
source: http://www.pewforum.org/2013/04/30/the- ... -overview/



because there isn't any muslim majority in europe that believes the same.


unsurprisingly, there's a correlation between support for sharia and islam being the state religion


but most european muslims don't agree with sharia either, and even those who support it don't agree it should be universal

Last edited by Fugu on 19 Feb 2016, 4:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

how is it worse than the others? also how does islam 'maintain its hegemony' when there's no pyramid power structure. there's no such thing as a head imam/cleric

let's compare the quran to the bible on blasphemy punishments for example.

https://www.openbible.info/topics/blasphemy
http://quranindex.net/search.php?w=blasphemy

One does not have to ignore everything else to say it's more than just a minuscule few. If one deems it an inherent feature of Islam, then it isn't something that can simply be dismissed as such. And as far as secular folks go, I have no clue how you would even figure that it is just as problematic when secularism is neither an organized religion nor an organized ideology.

Fugu

My point was the numbers (that want theocracy-based law) are bigger for Islam than they are for Christianity or other religions. I'm happy they don't represent the majority of Muslim viewpoints in western countries, but the numbers are still concerning high. People who claim Christians are pro-theocracy always cite common Christian views on abortion, but that just isn't comparable in my mind to say - advocating for the stoning of adulterers or cutting off the hands and feet of thieves. Also, although many Christians still oppose gay marriage, only an extremely small minority are still supportive of anti-sodomy laws (and you can't say the same for Muslims).

In summary, I just can't be honest with myself and claim that all religions are "equally bad". In this day and age it seems Islam is lagging behind, unfortunately. I'm not saying this because I'm racist against Arabs, or afraid of average Muslims living in my country. Not at all. I'm not even anti-immigration. I think the anti-immigration hysteria on the right is a bit overblown. But in the end I have to look at the facts and be honest with myself. It seems like a lot of other people on the political left can't do this. They want to wish away certain facts to preserve "civil discourse and harmony", but it just doesn't work to deny certain realities.

I'm comparing Islam to other religions, not the Quran to other holy books.