Victims of pedophile priests and imams help create more vict

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Just briefly a crime is not just against a victim, it is law of the land and all of the subject. So the guilty is violating the law of the land, not law of the victim. Make sense?

I'll keep this simple here by answering a question that was posed.

If I was victim #9 I would not blame victim #8 for not coming forward. I would place the blame squarely where it belongs - on the actual perpepatror.

Having said that I would do everything in my power to report if I thought that I could so without risking my own life or my family's life.

If I thought someone was simply taking a bribe I would place some level of guilt on that person but it's difficult to prove that the person is simply taking a bribe and is not doing so in part out of fear. So I would reserve judgement.

I agree. I think the whole religious institutions that allow this to continue, whether it's the hierarchy who protects pedophile clerics, right down to the laity who not only remain silent, but who tell the rest of the world to keep their noses out of their business, are all complicit.

Yes and no.

A charge of this type cannot be laid if there is no victim to testify to it or if the victim refuses to testify.

Now I do not know if a charge could be laid without the cooperation of the victim if the offence would be caught on camera somehow. If the film or video could be authenticated, and I was a judge, I think I would convict on such evidence alone. The camera becomes the witness.

Regards
DL

I hear you but FMPOV, if victim 8 or those before him would have stepped up, you would no have been assaulted.
Their silence allowed the predator to be able to get to you.

IMO, asking for or offering a bribe or payoff should be just as illegal as the assault.

Those bastards operate for decades because people take the money and run.

Justice demands better of us all.

Regards
DL

No, those bastards operate for decades because they prey on vulnerable children and the churches often knowingly pass them around and help cover for them. It has nothing to do with the behaviour of the victims and everything to do with the behaviour of the perpetrators and those responsible for the perpetrators (higher ups in their church).

Many people who have never been victims of crimes like this hold this idea that victims have some sort of responsibility to anyone but themselves and that responsibility for the abuse lies elsewhere than with the predators. It comes from ignorance and lack of compassion as well as a lack of understanding of how pedophiles exploit the system they function in (their communities) and it's most vulnerable members; they often specifically and intentionally target children who have no support system at home, come from abusive homes themselves or extreme poverty (and therefore few resources to cope with anything), children that they know are less likely to come forward for a variety of reasons and are less likely to be believed if they do come forward.

I forgive those who hold this belief because it comes from a place of ignorance, and they are lucky if they are ignorant of the intricacies of child sexual abuse. I just wish they would keep their ignorant judgement of victims of things they don't understand to themselves, because it is hurtful to people (children, especially) who have already been seriously harmed by sexual abuse. I also wish they would be more willing to direct their attention and go after the sources of the abuse (the predators and the churches that hide and cover for them and support them) rather than wasting their time telling victims that they aren't being victims in the right way. It doesn't help anyone, in fact it is counterproductive to solving the problem (ending child sexual abuse) because it shames victims and draws attention and blame away from the predators and those who protect them.

I feel like you're going to extremes to try to make a point. Life isn't always so black and white. If I used my imagination I could come up with some scenarios where I would take the bribe (reluctantly).

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... light.html

Take a look at this article. What strikes me is that his own lawyer even encourages him to take the money to settle out of court. Interesting... When the whole world is telling you just shut up and keep quiet, it's easy to see why victims don't come forward.

Blaming the victims?

Lovely.

Underage children who knew no better than to trust adult authority figures and get victimized are to blame?

That's beyond asinine.

We both recognize that we should be compassionate towards the victims.

That compassion should not push us to not advise the victims to take the best moral position and action.

Many see the Golden Rule as our number one rule for life and following that says that a victim should warn his community of the predator in their midst.

Warning is doing the best unto others so not warning others cannot be seen as moral.

Regards
DL

Yes but what if the victim is too young to even fully understand the sexual nature of the abuse which seems to be the case in a lot of these priests abusing kids cases. It's just not so simple, also there is usually shame associated with coming forward or the risk of not being believed or even accused of outright lying...ideally they should come forward, realistically though human psychology is a lot more complex than that. Also when one victim comes out it can encourage others to do the same.

Of course society should always encourage people to come forward when facing that kind of abuse, but somehow stigma exists which would imply society hasn't done a great job of it.

The movie I linked to in the O.P. includes the person your article speaks of.

My bottom line on the morality of this is in the post just above. Please have a look.

Do you think doing unto others is best served by a victim taking a payoff, or do you think warning others in the community is the best of doing unto others?

Regards
DL

I agree. That is why that is not something I indicated.

It is what happens after the assault that I am dealing with.

Regards
DL

It is a huge societal problem for sure. Stats show that about 40% of all men will abuse a child at some point time.

Sweeping such a situation under the carpet means that society does not want to face it and that means that we do not even want to try to improve on things.

Changing that mind set is a part of why I promote openness and the laying of charges instead of taking payoffs that lift the carpet for the perpetrators to hide under.

regards
DL

Wait a minute... 40%????? I don't doubt that you saw that figure, I just can't believe that it's accurate.

When the victims are small children, this is not always advisable. You are not actually expressing compassion towards victims when you tell them they are responsible for stopping predators. You don't seem to understand what compassion is. We, as a community, are responsible for stopping predators by punishing them when we find them and severely punishing people who protect and hide them, and by teaching ALL children about healthy boundaries and what to do if someone tries to overstep their boundaries. Focusing on victims and what they should do or not do after the fact is just wrong-headed and wrong-hearted, as well as pointless and damaging. We are talking about traumatised children here. Seriously, pull your head out. If you keep insisting on putting responsibility on abused children to stop their abuse in the face of all rational arguments to the contrary, I will find it increasing difficult to forgive you your ignorance because then it begins to look willfull.

It is impossible to know r sure because as you can see from the link I gave that most go unreported.

This link gives a reasonable overview and the 40% is my best guess.

http://arkofhopeforchildren.org/child-a ... stics-info

•Approximately 20% of women and 5–10% of men report being sexually abused as children, while 25–50% of all children report being physically abused.

Regards
DL