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Fnord
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21 Aug 2018, 12:57 pm

thinkinginpictures wrote:
Fnord wrote:
thinkinginpictures wrote:
I don't care what they call themselves. North Korea's official name is "Democratic People's Republic of Korea". Well, its neither a people's republic, nor democratic.
Oh, I agree with that -- because forced conformity is certainly evil (seen or read "Wrinkle In Time" yet?), while voluntary conformity is not.
That's another way to describe it. Finally something we can agree on!
The first sign of the Apocalypse... ;)



The_Walrus
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21 Aug 2018, 1:36 pm

thinkinginpictures wrote:
Fnord wrote:
"Individuality is fine, as long as we all do it together." -- Larry Linville, as Frank Burns, on the TV series M*A*S*H.


Whoever said so is an idiot, a ret*d nobody.

Conformists should at least be deprived the right to vote.

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Please avoid the use of dehumanising language, and particularly ableist terms like the r-word. Thanks :)



jatok2013
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22 Aug 2018, 12:47 am

I don't conform either, nor do I try. If they want to call me evil, I'll tell them to go F*** off and in some cases literally when dealing with SJWs. Stop caring what people think and go with what is actually the right way. SJWs are mostly self centered jerks thinking of nothing about the logic of how the world actually works. The best advice is to ignore them, they will never be your friend, so forget them and move on to someone you can agree with that is a potential friend. You can't make friends with an enemy that wants to hate. Even if you change, they will find something new to hate you for. They feed on hate like demons and I bet holy water burns them.


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Conner42
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22 Aug 2018, 1:07 am

I remember a group project where we were working on something and I mentioned something that we might need to do but the other two people were dead set on doing it another way. So, I complied and finally did it their way until we presented it to the teacher and he said the same exact ****ing thing I was trying to say.

But, hey, don't listen to me because I obviously have no idea what I'm talking about -_-

It sucks but it's somewhat comforting to know that this also happens to other people.



jatok2013
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22 Aug 2018, 3:20 am

I'm sure when people don;t listen, in the end, we end up being right, because we saw something they couldn't. Personally I think Neurotipical is a limited view on reality since we experience such a wide range of senses all at once. When I go to the woods with my dad, he only sees the forest while I smell the horses and the trees on the trail, I hear the birds and animals around me and then after all that is done processing then I see the forest with my eyes. My think of neurotipicals as blind, deaf, and nose blind since we have no word for that yet. If that project is out in the world, we're going to experience such a wide range of sensory data that no one outside our autism can ever know. That data stream offers us a much richer view on the world we live in.


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techstepgenr8tion
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22 Aug 2018, 8:25 am

I was listening to a recent Stefan Molyneux podcast where he was talking to a guy about his recent Aus/NZ trip with Lauren and the guest, I believe an Australian living in NZ, was marveling at the strangeness of the medias behavior. Stefan actually pulled out a very interesting concept, something that I've observed a lot myself but never heard a proper name for in the past. He brought it from Objectivism, the term is 'social metaphysician'. These are people who judge the value of things based on how popular the belief is, whether the person next to them believes it, and they largely go through their lives orienting to reality by licking their finger and sticking it in the air to see how many people believe what, how popular or non-controversial the belief is, etc.

It seems like a large minority of people do this and another large majority (both adding to I think better than half the people out there) have one foot in each world - ie. some first-principle thinking and some licking their finger and sticking it in the air to see which way the wind of opinion is blowing. I don't know if I'm just enjoying the fruits and silver linings of a difficult life where I wasn't going to be accepted no matter what I did but I can't imagine surviving in such a state. It would be like standing on a large cloud in the sky, staking your foundations on it, and constantly needing to move your whole structure from cloud to cloud and hope you don't end up in the middle of a blue sky while it evaporates to nothing. In fact, I don't know how borderline personality disorder isn't a lot more common because I tend to think of these people who could be described as social metaphysicians as some variant or subclinical case of borderline PD.


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techstepgenr8tion
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22 Aug 2018, 8:31 am

The other thing I might address real quick is oppression. It is an intensely jaded feeling you get when you feel like your life has been wasted or taken from you (especially when it's almost too late for it to turn around or is in fact too late). What's far worse is when that oppression wasn't a legitimate challenge to rise to, or when the most accurate way of describing the essence of that oppression is mumumumumumumummumumu pthphtphtphtphtphtphtphtpht pTHPTHPTHPTHPHTPHTPHTPHTPHTPHTPHTTTT! I had some really difficult years realizing that there was no hope - that it was invincible, that it's invulnerability to reason is only surpassed by its omnipresence and trying to defeat it in any way makes you feel like Caligula asking Roman soldiers to whip, stab, and smite the sea to punish Poseidon.

This is sort of where an old playground graffiti proverb from my childhood comes to mind - 'if at first you don't succeed f--- the world and smoke some weed'. To agree I think you're forced, if the world is batisht crazy and you can't do anything about it, to just go within and make as much of your life as you can, and then come to acceptance that the rest of the world likely won't reciprocate much at all. It not just won't reciprocate, it probably can't. Past that one's really picking a fight with nature, which is about as fun and rewarding as picking a fight with gravity.


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thinkinginpictures
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22 Aug 2018, 9:02 am

The_Walrus wrote:
Please avoid the use of dehumanising language, and particularly ableist terms like the r-word. Thanks :)


I am sorry. I just got angry, and out of control. I don't mean what I wrote.
Nor do I mean to abolish the vote for the conformists.

I am sorry, and thank you for correcting me!



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22 Aug 2018, 9:54 am

True non-conformity is not caring what others think. You can follow norms and be non-conformist if you still would do those things if they stopped being the norm (and weren't replaced by something better.)



rick42
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22 Aug 2018, 10:35 am

Conformist are very bland people.They don't think for themselves and they follow the crowd.I believe in individuality and not follow the crowd .



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22 Aug 2018, 10:54 am

NTs are never truly happy unless they are copying each other

Wanting to be a clone usually becomes most prominent in the teenage years, although these days it can be younger school-aged kids. They want to wear what all their "friends" are wearing or they will be a complete and utter outcast from society. But don't don't even think of suggesting the public school supply uniforms to solve this problem, because the young ones will whine in their shrill voices, "BUT THEN WE'LL ALL LOOK THE SAAAAAME!!" :roll:



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23 Aug 2018, 2:31 am

often its just lazyness



cubedemon6073
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23 Aug 2018, 2:42 am

http://archive.boston.com/bostonglobe/i ... onformity/

check this out and tell me what you all think. It explains a lot.



Conner42
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23 Aug 2018, 10:58 am

lostonearth35 wrote:
NTs are never truly happy unless they are copying each other like mindless clones to be part of a "group". It's in their genes.

Wanting to be a mindless clone usually becomes most prominent in the teenage years, although these days it can be younger school-aged kids. They want to wear what all their "friends" are wearing or they will be a complete and utter outcast from society. But don't don't even think of suggesting the public school supply uniforms to solve this problem, because the young ones will whine in their shrill voices, "BUT THEN WE'LL ALL LOOK THE SAAAAAME!!" :roll:
I actually did go to a school that has uniforms. That didn't prevent cliques from forming or people from being alienated. Also, outside of school, anything goes when clothes are concerned, so it still didn't stop clothing trends.

Also, the uniforms were uncomfortable, haha!



Conner42
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23 Aug 2018, 11:18 am

cubedemon6073 wrote:
http://archive.boston.com/bostonglobe/ideas/articles/2010/06/06/sweet_land_of_conformity/

check this out and tell me what you all think. It explains a lot.
This was an interesting read. One question that has been on my mind on is if conformity is a conscious decision because I kind of think it isn't. I don't think a lot of people realize when they are or not conforming to a certain idea, but I don't have any hard evidence to support this and it doesn't look like anyone has researched this as well. But the article kind of suggests my hypothesis might be true.

It's incredibly hilarious that the article talks about how Americans conform to every other kind of authority except for the government. I guess it kind of makes sense because our culture comes from breaking away from a totalitarian regime, so there's the inherent distrust of government but that seems to be where "nonconformity" ends because they still have a lot of ideas that they conform to due religion, family, or even just group identity. They're critical on the government but not towards anything else in their life.



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23 Aug 2018, 8:50 pm

Overall, Humans Make Rules to establish Order in what otherWise Might Terrify Them as the Order of Life that is Actually
Change that tends to Scare some Folks; and even Disgust them when Different from the Rules and the Norm come into View and Life starts to Seem more Chaotic, too; oh no, as 'they' say. Meanwhile, Nature Spirals as Rhyme in Peace and Harmony of Balance while Humans make Buildings that/who Edge the Sky in Angles and Straight Lines to calm their Fears of Spirals and other stuff that doesn't Follow Linear Thinking Rules, as such still now, too, Across the Entire Page of Life now too.

And what is also 'Terribly Sad' is Folks Who are more Likely to Conform to the Rule of Order in Common Binds of Bonds That Make Them Feel More Comfortable When the Uncertainties of Life Come on More Strong; when Purpose and Meaning for Life that Folks can Count on For Making Subsistence together Becomes an Environment of Scarcity; They are Ripe for the 'true' and yes 'false' Leaders away from the Actual Conformity of Rules who Leads them into whatever Helps the Actual
Non-Conformist Leader who takes the Conformists on a Wild "Mr. Toad Wild Ride"; Wherever Mr. Toad with Just another Big T wants to Lead the Group Think People as Puppets on a String. In other Words, by Very Nature, Extreme Conformists Are Ripe to be Controlled for the More one Fears Chaos and Embraces Rules the Less Likely 'They' will able to Break Away from the Group Think of Common Rule; No Matter What Fresh Hell A Mr. 'T' Will take and make them next in Fresh T Hell.

I Live in a Locality, as assessed by Social Science, overall, as the Worst Place in the United States to attempt to be different; in other words, away from the Common Group Think that Permeates a Locality like mine with Several Military Bases and the Title once held in the Record Books as the Locality with the Most Churches Per Square Miles, too.

A Thing is, where there are Homogenous Groups of Humans that and who do the Group Think way of Life; Social Roles And Statuses are more Predictable; And Folks in General may be more Comforted this way and less likely to go a Societal Criminal Way of Life. This surely isn't, overall, an Evil way of Life, unless one is an Outlier of the Group in whatever Physical, Mental, or Emotional Attributes the Outcast this way is Flavored with as that is the Role of Outlier they come to be as Ouch, Outcast from the Group, which in Terms of Overall Human Ancestral ways means one is much more likely to Starve to Death without Being Part of the Group Think and Rules and Overall Ways of Doing Stuff together for Common Binds and Bonds Same for Hairless Apes Stronger together to get the Job of Life done for Survive and even God, Yes, Thrive, now.

In Modern Days, although Many of Us who are Outlier, Still Carry the Instinctual Fear of Being Outcast from the Group, Technological Advancement that Historical Loving Hairless Apes Bring as reality to us now by Working Hand in Hand
actually give the Outcasts A Huge; Yes, Huuuuge Advantage they did not have before; namely they can and will go mostly
their own way with Technologies like Groceries coming to one's Home from Super-Walmart; even if one doesn't care at all
to Mix with the Locals as such at a Huge Store Like that. And yes, there is Amazon and Stuff Like That as the Non-Conformist and Outcast more and more can and will Live without Mixing with the Rest. And Oh, God, Yes, Online
Brings Some Fish out to Bigger Sees Globally Who Will See some Other Fish at Least As Vaguely Similar to
Speak to, too, at least, even if, they don't get a reply.

Honestly, Given this and a Thousand More Other Advantages; these are the Best Days, I for one, have ever seen
as an Outcast, and yes, Financial Independence Helps for no Matter what the Written Rules are in the Work Place;
as if one Doesn't Follow the Implicit Social Order one may never get ahead And be Damned out of the Work Place too;
Yes, I Conformed a whole lot to Survive in the Work Place for 33 years and 19 Years in School; and I'm even Writing so-called 'Normal' to get the Privilege, Still, to Communicate here, Just for Fun with Never Any Real Chance of Reciprocal Social Communication, like when I Wrote like a Computer Robot, here before as assessed as such by some, at least too.

What I've come to Find in the Real Flesh and Blood World these days where I Naturally Express myself; as it is so
much easier to do in whatever role one is in life as Financially Independent in a World where let's Face it
the Real God is Money as far as what and who Folks Truly Serve; is yes, what I empirically Measure as Fact
is 'These Days' at least, amongst the Younger Freer Spirit Folks; someone as old at Me at 58 will be their
Folk Hero just for the Freedom of Going Life My Way with Nary a Care what anyone else thinks as
who else but me in this area I live, stretching at the Bottom of the Bible Belt from Biloxi to
Tallahassee will Public Dance 10K Miles in 5 Year as empirically measured by GPS Sports
Watch, every where they go; just as me; for I ain't Scared to Truly and Fully Enjoy Life as
Free as the lines now are moving away from the Edge of the
Page as i go on to enjoy a 225th Dance Week Night with
A Bunch of Folks, 3 to 4 Decades Younger than
me who don't Give an F what anyone
else thinks of them either to do
their own
Dance
of Life too.
Lots of People say They are Non-Conformists and Do The Exact Opposite in Most Behaviors They Do; True, Actions
Speak so
Much
Louder
Than Words
As Well as Words
That Who Dance and Sing
Rather than Head Down and Same.
When I Die, THeRE WiLL Be No Doubt, I Really Loved Lived Freely Uniquely By The Record of FActs And Behavior Who Spirals now
then now Out Of
Straight Line Life.
And With All That Said Song;
"Let's" Dance; not heAr; but somEwHere else.


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