07 Jun 2019, 10:50 am
07 Jun 2019, 10:50 am
07 Jun 2019, 11:05 am
Twilightprincess wrote:
TheRevengeofTW1ZTY wrote:
I despise both the elephant and the jackass.
I like both elephants and donkeys unless they are stampeding on me or biting.
Right now the elephant is trampling over Georgia's peaches.
07 Jun 2019, 5:11 pm
Pepe wrote:
tooyoungforthis wrote:
I have noticed those who are autistic tend to be more moderate than neurotypicals (I would assume this is due to less emotional/irrational thinking). Personally, I am a centrist, leaning liberal socially and conservative economically. My own observations may be skewed as I am quite young and have not met a large number of people with the same diagnosis (Aspergers). What are your own political opinions? I am curious to see if my experience is aligned with yours.
There are a lot of left-wingers here.
Many more than I would have imagined when I first joined WP in 2013.
It seems most here who identify as embracing liberal politics are affected by poverty.
I have suggested recently that if those people didn't have financial problems, they too would be leaning more to a centralist political POV.
None commented on my hypothesis.
To make my political position clear:
While I am obviously much more conservative, I am non-partisan, meaning I am an individualist like you.
I watch political commentary by both sides of the political divide and engage my critical thinking skills to sort what is reasonable and what is BS.
In theory, based on what I have discovered many years ago via Tony Attwood predominately, those on the autistic spectrum tend to be more rational in their thinking despite our emotional turmoil. We generally have a higher than average intellectual quotient while our EQ, Emotional Quotient tends to be below average.
Just the nature of the beast.
What can you do? <shrug>
My pet hates:
-Sanctimony.
-Self-righteousness.
-Virtue-signalling.
-Emotionalism.
Hence, my lack of affinity with liberal politics in general.
Pax.
Your post contains all four of your pet hates, two of them in the sentence after you list them.
In general I think there's a pretty high degree of self-righteousness around here. I am certainly one of the worst offenders!
I would call myself a centre-right liberal, but that's largely a rhetorical exercise in order to throw the identitarians describing themselves as "centre-left" or "classic liberals" off guard. Realistically I'm a figure of the centre-left but I am very much in favour of capitalism, big businesses, and low taxes.
My priorities are prosperity for all, individual and social liberty, equality, globalism, and environmentalism. I think those all complement each other pretty well. A society cannot be equal unless it is prosperous, cannot be prosperous unless it is free, cannot be free unless it is global, and isn't going to last very long unless it is sustainable. It also can't afford sustainable technology unless it is rich but that's more debatable because obviously total poverty is pretty environmentally stable, just not desirable in any other way.
07 Jun 2019, 6:55 pm
07 Jun 2019, 7:15 pm
07 Jun 2019, 8:38 pm
The_Walrus wrote:
Pepe wrote:
tooyoungforthis wrote:
I have noticed those who are autistic tend to be more moderate than neurotypicals (I would assume this is due to less emotional/irrational thinking). Personally, I am a centrist, leaning liberal socially and conservative economically. My own observations may be skewed as I am quite young and have not met a large number of people with the same diagnosis (Aspergers). What are your own political opinions? I am curious to see if my experience is aligned with yours.
There are a lot of left-wingers here.
Many more than I would have imagined when I first joined WP in 2013.
It seems most here who identify as embracing liberal politics are affected by poverty.
I have suggested recently that if those people didn't have financial problems, they too would be leaning more to a centralist political POV.
None commented on my hypothesis.
To make my political position clear:
While I am obviously much more conservative, I am non-partisan, meaning I am an individualist like you.
I watch political commentary by both sides of the political divide and engage my critical thinking skills to sort what is reasonable and what is BS.
In theory, based on what I have discovered many years ago via Tony Attwood predominately, those on the autistic spectrum tend to be more rational in their thinking despite our emotional turmoil. We generally have a higher than average intellectual quotient while our EQ, Emotional Quotient tends to be below average.
Just the nature of the beast.
What can you do? <shrug>
My pet hates:
-Sanctimony.
-Self-righteousness.
-Virtue-signalling.
-Emotionalism.
Hence, my lack of affinity with liberal politics in general.
Pax.
Your post contains all four of your pet hates, two of them in the sentence after you list them.
OK.
I'll play.
It is up to you whether or not detente will continue.
No, once again you have misread me.
You do that a lot.
Hence, my boycotting most of your posts.
So I am "virtue signalling" and emotionalistic by pointing out my personal problem with those two anti-qualities. <chuckle>
You do understand that I am entitled to defend myself when I am attacked?
And to do so is at the miscreant's peril since my arguments involve considerable autistic detail.
The_Walrus wrote:
In general I think there's a pretty high degree of self-righteousness around here. I am certainly one of the worst offenders!
In total agreement.
See.
We can both see eye-to-eye on certain points.
In summary:
Your assertions against me have no substance.
auntblabby
Veteran
Joined: 12 Feb 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 115,260
Location: the island of defective toy santas
07 Jun 2019, 10:51 pm
08 Jun 2019, 5:10 am
08 Jun 2019, 12:19 pm
08 Jun 2019, 2:30 pm
Pepe wrote:
The_Walrus wrote:
Pepe wrote:
tooyoungforthis wrote:
I have noticed those who are autistic tend to be more moderate than neurotypicals (I would assume this is due to less emotional/irrational thinking). Personally, I am a centrist, leaning liberal socially and conservative economically. My own observations may be skewed as I am quite young and have not met a large number of people with the same diagnosis (Aspergers). What are your own political opinions? I am curious to see if my experience is aligned with yours.
There are a lot of left-wingers here.
Many more than I would have imagined when I first joined WP in 2013.
It seems most here who identify as embracing liberal politics are affected by poverty.
I have suggested recently that if those people didn't have financial problems, they too would be leaning more to a centralist political POV.
None commented on my hypothesis.
To make my political position clear:
While I am obviously much more conservative, I am non-partisan, meaning I am an individualist like you.
I watch political commentary by both sides of the political divide and engage my critical thinking skills to sort what is reasonable and what is BS.
In theory, based on what I have discovered many years ago via Tony Attwood predominately, those on the autistic spectrum tend to be more rational in their thinking despite our emotional turmoil. We generally have a higher than average intellectual quotient while our EQ, Emotional Quotient tends to be below average.
Just the nature of the beast.
What can you do? <shrug>
My pet hates:
-Sanctimony.
-Self-righteousness.
-Virtue-signalling.
-Emotionalism.
Hence, my lack of affinity with liberal politics in general.
Pax.
Your post contains all four of your pet hates, two of them in the sentence after you list them.
OK.
I'll play.
It is up to you whether or not detente will continue.
No, once again you have misread me.
You do that a lot.
Hence, my boycotting most of your posts.
So I am "virtue signalling" and emotionalistic by pointing out my personal problem with those two anti-qualities.
No, actually, I was accusing that particular line of being sanctimonious and self-righteous. Although accusing others of virtue signalling is usually also a case of virtue signalling. I refer you, for example, to the works of Shariatmadari and Coaston. I think Bowman is also interesting but not particularly relevant here. (Names are links)
I believe the best example of you virtue signalling within that post is when you describe yourself as a non-partisan individualist who applies critical thinking skills to determine their opinions. Regardless of whether it is true or not, it's virtue signalling, it's sanctimonious, and it is self-righteous. It also tells us absolutely nothing about your views. Very few people ever think "I don't care whether it is true, I'm going to follow the party line no matter what". Even people who seem to slovenishly repeat party lines are saying them because they think that they have evaluated them critically and "sorted them from the BS".
Of course, every single person is still susceptible to cognitive biases. Which cognitive biases would you consider most relevant here, and how do you attempt to combat them when coming to your own decisions?
dyadiccounterpoint
Velociraptor
Joined: 31 Jan 2019
Age: 35
Gender: Female
Posts: 464
Location: Nashville
08 Jun 2019, 7:06 pm
08 Jun 2019, 9:41 pm
The_Walrus wrote:
No, actually, I was accusing that particular line of being sanctimonious and self-righteous. Although accusing others of virtue signalling is usually also a case of virtue signalling.
"Usually".
That is an important qualifier which does not apply to me.
The most important element of the type of virtue-signalling I am referring to is: a "look at me, look at me attitude.
It is dependent on a desire of social importance/recognition, something that I have no interested in.
I would have thought it obvious that my focus has always been on self-actualisation rather than becoming the Messiah. <sigh>
Let me see.
Ah yes.
Read my signature where it indicates my dominant attitude: "I'm not here to change the world...There isn't a big enough soiled nappy bin...
"I am a "proper" high functioning autistic.
Here is a list which defines some of the characteristics of the "ideal" aspie, imo.
I agree with most, but not all of them, which makes me a super-duper individualistic autist.
I suggest you take a good look at them and adjust your attitude accordingly...err...
Quote:
Most Aspies:
are able to easily forgive others
are conscientious, reliable, and honest
are enthusiastic and have a propensity for obsessive research, thus developing a broad and deep base of knowledge in subjects of interest
are free of prejudice
are intelligent and talented
are less inclined to be fickle or bitchy than their neurotypical counterparts
are more likely than those of the general population to pursue a university education
are not inclined to lie to others
are not inclined to steal from others
are not likely to be bullies, con artists, or social manipulators
are not motivated by an intense social drive to spend time with whoever happens to be available
are persistent, and when they set their minds to something or make a promise, they can usually be trusted to follow through
are unlikely to launch unprovoked attacks, verbal or otherwise
are untainted by the judgments that people often make regarding one another's social position or social skills
are very accepting of the quirks and idiosyncrasies of others
bring a highly original perspective to problem solving
can be selective, choosing honest, genuine, dependable people who share their interests
can bring up a variety of interesting facts
can listen to people’s problems and provide a fresh perspective, offering pure assessments based on the information provided
can recall fine details that others miss
can relax and be themselves without fearing social censure
don’t attack the reputations of those around them
don’t discriminate against anyone based on race, gender, age, or any other surface criteria
don’t force others to live up to demanding social expectations
don't have hidden agendas
don’t play head games
don’t take advantage of other’s weaknesses
don't usually recognize hierarchies, and so are unlikely to give someone superior status simply because that person is wealthy or has attained a high position in an organization
have a good work ethic
have a lot of passion when engaging in activities they like, which may translate into a talent for certain athletic pursuits
have a tendency to adhere to routines
have above-average intelligence
have an acute sensitivity that supports creative talents
have exceptional memories
have extreme endurance
have high integrity
have no interest in harming others
have one or more highly developed talents
have talents for swimming, rowing, running, bodybuilding, or other activities that require sustained physical effort
have values that aren't shaped by financial, social, or political influences
judge people based on their behavior – not the color of their skin or socioeconomic status
like to spend time alone and are perfectly capable of entertaining themselves
loathe small talk and trivialities, preferring instead to talk about significant things that will enhance their knowledge base
make very good employees if able to control their pace and work within either a solitary or socially supportive environment
pay attention to detail
stick to their positions, even in the face of intense social pressure
tend to become proficient in the technological media required for lucrative employment in the “information age”
tend to prefer individual sports to team sports, as there are no social demands and they can exercise complete control over the activity
who develop an interest in sport or fitness are likely to work at it every day, often for long periods of time
will not go along with the crowd if they know that something is wrong
http://www.myaspergerschild.com/2010/12 ... cs-of.html
are able to easily forgive others
are conscientious, reliable, and honest
are enthusiastic and have a propensity for obsessive research, thus developing a broad and deep base of knowledge in subjects of interest
are free of prejudice
are intelligent and talented
are less inclined to be fickle or bitchy than their neurotypical counterparts
are more likely than those of the general population to pursue a university education
are not inclined to lie to others
are not inclined to steal from others
are not likely to be bullies, con artists, or social manipulators
are not motivated by an intense social drive to spend time with whoever happens to be available
are persistent, and when they set their minds to something or make a promise, they can usually be trusted to follow through
are unlikely to launch unprovoked attacks, verbal or otherwise
are untainted by the judgments that people often make regarding one another's social position or social skills
are very accepting of the quirks and idiosyncrasies of others
bring a highly original perspective to problem solving
can be selective, choosing honest, genuine, dependable people who share their interests
can bring up a variety of interesting facts
can listen to people’s problems and provide a fresh perspective, offering pure assessments based on the information provided
can recall fine details that others miss
can relax and be themselves without fearing social censure
don’t attack the reputations of those around them
don’t discriminate against anyone based on race, gender, age, or any other surface criteria
don’t force others to live up to demanding social expectations
don't have hidden agendas
don’t play head games
don’t take advantage of other’s weaknesses
don't usually recognize hierarchies, and so are unlikely to give someone superior status simply because that person is wealthy or has attained a high position in an organization
have a good work ethic
have a lot of passion when engaging in activities they like, which may translate into a talent for certain athletic pursuits
have a tendency to adhere to routines
have above-average intelligence
have an acute sensitivity that supports creative talents
have exceptional memories
have extreme endurance
have high integrity
have no interest in harming others
have one or more highly developed talents
have talents for swimming, rowing, running, bodybuilding, or other activities that require sustained physical effort
have values that aren't shaped by financial, social, or political influences
judge people based on their behavior – not the color of their skin or socioeconomic status
like to spend time alone and are perfectly capable of entertaining themselves
loathe small talk and trivialities, preferring instead to talk about significant things that will enhance their knowledge base
make very good employees if able to control their pace and work within either a solitary or socially supportive environment
pay attention to detail
stick to their positions, even in the face of intense social pressure
tend to become proficient in the technological media required for lucrative employment in the “information age”
tend to prefer individual sports to team sports, as there are no social demands and they can exercise complete control over the activity
who develop an interest in sport or fitness are likely to work at it every day, often for long periods of time
will not go along with the crowd if they know that something is wrong
http://www.myaspergerschild.com/2010/12 ... cs-of.html
08 Jun 2019, 9:48 pm
dyadiccounterpoint wrote:
I am a certain kind of communist. I say "certain kind" because am liable to make positions and statements which those who carry the same banner might denounce. I fully support commerce and business, and I do not mind individual disparities in wealth, just not generational ones. I am fairly cynical about humanity. I don't believe everyone is equal. I don't believe in entitlement or fundamental human rights. I believe in managing human society in the most effective way possible to reduce suffering and to maximize the actualization of human capital to be tapped for technological and cultural progress.
Based on what you have written here, I am more than confident that you are no John F. Kennedy...errr...I mean no "certain kind of communist".
dyadiccounterpoint
Velociraptor
Joined: 31 Jan 2019
Age: 35
Gender: Female
Posts: 464
Location: Nashville
08 Jun 2019, 9:56 pm
Pepe wrote:
dyadiccounterpoint wrote:
I am a certain kind of communist. I say "certain kind" because am liable to make positions and statements which those who carry the same banner might denounce. I fully support commerce and business, and I do not mind individual disparities in wealth, just not generational ones. I am fairly cynical about humanity. I don't believe everyone is equal. I don't believe in entitlement or fundamental human rights. I believe in managing human society in the most effective way possible to reduce suffering and to maximize the actualization of human capital to be tapped for technological and cultural progress.
Based on what you have written here, I am more than confident that you are no John F. Kennedy...errr...I mean no "certain kind of communist".
I can't tell if you're insulting me considering the original context of that quote and how it was used against Dan Quayle, or whether you're insinuating that my position does not qualify as communism, in which case I wouldn't argue with you. These terms are nebulous and it's far better to discuss specific proposals.
Are you insulting me, though?
RushKing
Veteran
Joined: 16 Oct 2010
Age: 34
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,340
Location: Minnesota, United States
09 Jun 2019, 9:26 am
