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what do you think about militaries using killer robots?

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Texasmoneyman300
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21 Dec 2021, 5:16 pm

naturalplastic wrote:
Texasmoneyman300 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
Texasmoneyman300 wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
Texasmoneyman300 wrote:
Fnord wrote:
What do you think about children using assault weapons?

I think they are likely to go on killing sprees due to faulty information they find on-line.

Define assault weapons.Do you mean assault rifles or modern sporting rifles?


If he said "assault rifles" then he probably means "assault rifles".

Military type automatic capable rifles that fire heavy bullets like the M16, and the AK 47, but also the consumer civilian version of the M16 (the AR 15). And not hunting rifles that fire one shot at a time.

Oh okay well actually the M16 shoots a very small and light bullet and M16 and AK 47 are very weak guns compared to even a .243.Oh i thought he said assault weapon.Like the 5.56 NATO is not even that good of a round for deer in my opinion.Also a AK-47 bullet is light compared to battle rifle ammo such as the 7.92x57 Mauser.


You make a good point why people insisting those rifles are suitable for hunting deer shouldn't be taken at face value.

All I know is that I would much rather be hit with a AK-47 than even a kid's deer rifle.


Well..I meant "heavy" as opposed to pistol bullets. Traditional First World War type infantry rifles had heavier bullets than modern assault rifles, but machine guns of the interwar era fired pistol bullets. But first the Germans, and then the Soviets, and finally the Americans invented rapid fire guns that fired intermediate sized rounds that combined the rapid fire of tommy guns with the hard hit (but only at the close ranges in which actual combat occurs) of the old long slow firing infantry rifles.

Those were the "assault rifles". They did not invent them to kill deer. They invented them to kill large numbers of smaller game- namely human enemy soldiers.

The AR 15 is just a civilian version of the M16 as I understand it. So it is great at mowing down large number of humans at close range (like in a school corridor) but sucks at killing deer in the woods.

Okay I think a AR-15 could kill from 300 to 600 yards reliably but the bullet would not have much knockdown power.Also I think that M16s and AR-15 are deadlier than your standard AK-47 wound.However God help you if you go up against someone with battle rifle ammo like with a AR-10 shooting 7.62 x 51 NATO because if you get hit you prolly wont make it.Like most people shot with battle rifle ammo like the .30-06 and the 7.92x57 Mauser in the torso did not make it but you can survive with a AK-47 hit much easier than even my deer rifle which is just .243 Winchester.In Texas civilians can legally get fully automatic assault rifles but they are like 30-50 grand a piece but it has to be registered with the ATF.I would think a AK-47 would be better out to 100 to 300 yards than a AR-15 and the AK-47 would be better at close range.



Texasmoneyman300
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21 Dec 2021, 5:20 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
Texasmoneyman300 wrote:
Fnord wrote:
What do you think about children using assault weapons?

I think they are likely to go on killing sprees due to faulty information they find on-line.

Define assault weapons.Do you mean assault rifles or modern sporting rifles?


If he said "assault rifles" then he probably means "assault rifles".

Military type automatic capable rifles that fire heavy bullets like the M16, and the AK 47, but also the consumer civilian version of the M16 (the AR 15). And not hunting rifles that fire one shot at a time.


Assault rifles are defined by firing relatively light bullets compared to a battle rifle.

A modern sporting rifle is the weapon of choice for many mass shooters and is what the media refers to as an assault weapon. A modern sporting rifle isn't granddad's bolt action 30-06, it's a sporterized assault rifle derivative.

Ya True but I dont think the general public knows how scary a bolt action .308 deer rifle could be.



funeralxempire
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21 Dec 2021, 5:32 pm

Texasmoneyman300 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
Texasmoneyman300 wrote:
Fnord wrote:
What do you think about children using assault weapons?

I think they are likely to go on killing sprees due to faulty information they find on-line.

Define assault weapons.Do you mean assault rifles or modern sporting rifles?


If he said "assault rifles" then he probably means "assault rifles".

Military type automatic capable rifles that fire heavy bullets like the M16, and the AK 47, but also the consumer civilian version of the M16 (the AR 15). And not hunting rifles that fire one shot at a time.


Assault rifles are defined by firing relatively light bullets compared to a battle rifle.

A modern sporting rifle is the weapon of choice for many mass shooters and is what the media refers to as an assault weapon. A modern sporting rifle isn't granddad's bolt action 30-06, it's a sporterized assault rifle derivative.

Ya True but I dont think the general public knows how scary a bolt action .270 Winchester deer rifle could be.


Indeed.

Beyond that it's a topic where often people get distracted by arguing over jargon or using trivial distinctions to avoid certain realizations.

Whether or not one believes this is a valid reason to restrict access, it's fair to say that the average sporterized AR-15 or AR-10 or SKS or AK would make a better infantry weapon than anything given out as standard issue in WWII.


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Just a reminder: under international law, an occupying power has no right of self-defense, and those who are occupied have the right and duty to liberate themselves by any means possible.


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21 Dec 2021, 5:39 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
Texasmoneyman300 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
Texasmoneyman300 wrote:
Fnord wrote:
What do you think about children using assault weapons?

I think they are likely to go on killing sprees due to faulty information they find on-line.

Define assault weapons.Do you mean assault rifles or modern sporting rifles?


If he said "assault rifles" then he probably means "assault rifles".

Military type automatic capable rifles that fire heavy bullets like the M16, and the AK 47, but also the consumer civilian version of the M16 (the AR 15). And not hunting rifles that fire one shot at a time.


Assault rifles are defined by firing relatively light bullets compared to a battle rifle.

A modern sporting rifle is the weapon of choice for many mass shooters and is what the media refers to as an assault weapon. A modern sporting rifle isn't granddad's bolt action 30-06, it's a sporterized assault rifle derivative.

Ya True but I dont think the general public knows how scary a bolt action .270 Winchester deer rifle could be.


Indeed.

Beyond that it's a topic where often people get distracted by arguing over jargon or using trivial distinctions to avoid certain realizations.

Whether or not one believes this is a valid reason to restrict access, it's fair to say that the average sporterized AR-15 or AR-10 or SKS or AK would make a better infantry weapon than anything given out as standard issue in WWII.

And its fair to say that that group of guns all suck for bringing down a buck off in the woods. Which brings us back to Fnord's question ...which is..."what do you think about teenagers carrying guns that are useless for hunting because their only purpose is to mow down human beings on the battlefield?".



Texasmoneyman300
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21 Dec 2021, 5:48 pm

naturalplastic wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
Texasmoneyman300 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
Texasmoneyman300 wrote:
Fnord wrote:
What do you think about children using assault weapons?

I think they are likely to go on killing sprees due to faulty information they find on-line.

Define assault weapons.Do you mean assault rifles or modern sporting rifles?


If he said "assault rifles" then he probably means "assault rifles".

Military type automatic capable rifles that fire heavy bullets like the M16, and the AK 47, but also the consumer civilian version of the M16 (the AR 15). And not hunting rifles that fire one shot at a time.


Assault rifles are defined by firing relatively light bullets compared to a battle rifle.

A modern sporting rifle is the weapon of choice for many mass shooters and is what the media refers to as an assault weapon. A modern sporting rifle isn't granddad's bolt action 30-06, it's a sporterized assault rifle derivative.

Ya True but I dont think the general public knows how scary a bolt action .270 Winchester deer rifle could be.


Indeed.

Beyond that it's a topic where often people get distracted by arguing over jargon or using trivial distinctions to avoid certain realizations.

Whether or not one believes this is a valid reason to restrict access, it's fair to say that the average sporterized AR-15 or AR-10 or SKS or AK would make a better infantry weapon than anything given out as standard issue in WWII.

And its fair to say that that group of guns all suck for bringing down a buck off in the woods. Which brings us back to Fnord's question ...which is..."what do you think about teenagers carrying guns that are useless for hunting because their only purpose is to mow down human beings on the battlefield?".

AK-47s and AR-15s can make great deer and hog rifles and varmint out to 500 to 600 yards which is all most hunters would need since most deer rifle shots are within 100 to 150 yards.The AR-15 when in the hands of a good shot using premium ammo is a good deer rifle where i live in Texas.AR-15s are not military-grade so they would really stink if you were going up against a AK-47 in war and a AR-15 would get you killed in war most likely or if you went up against someone with a M16 or M4 Carbine.



Last edited by Texasmoneyman300 on 21 Dec 2021, 5:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Texasmoneyman300
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21 Dec 2021, 5:51 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
Texasmoneyman300 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
Texasmoneyman300 wrote:
Fnord wrote:
What do you think about children using assault weapons?

I think they are likely to go on killing sprees due to faulty information they find on-line.

Define assault weapons.Do you mean assault rifles or modern sporting rifles?


If he said "assault rifles" then he probably means "assault rifles".

Military type automatic capable rifles that fire heavy bullets like the M16, and the AK 47, but also the consumer civilian version of the M16 (the AR 15). And not hunting rifles that fire one shot at a time.


Assault rifles are defined by firing relatively light bullets compared to a battle rifle.

A modern sporting rifle is the weapon of choice for many mass shooters and is what the media refers to as an assault weapon. A modern sporting rifle isn't granddad's bolt action 30-06, it's a sporterized assault rifle derivative.

Ya True but I dont think the general public knows how scary a bolt action .270 Winchester deer rifle could be.


Indeed.

Beyond that it's a topic where often people get distracted by arguing over jargon or using trivial distinctions to avoid certain realizations.

Whether or not one believes this is a valid reason to restrict access, it's fair to say that the average sporterized AR-15 or AR-10 or SKS or AK would make a better infantry weapon than anything given out as standard issue in WWII.

I would agree because I would rather have AR-15 or semi-automatic AK-47 in combat than a M1 Garand in .30-06 or the K98 in 8mm Mauser if i was in WW2.



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21 Dec 2021, 5:52 pm

Texasmoneyman300 wrote:
AR-15s are not military-grade so they would really stink if you were going up against a AK-47 in war and a AR-15 would get you killed in war most likely.


Training would probably be a bigger factor than whether you can switch your rifle into burst or full-auto or only have semi-auto.


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If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing. —Malcolm X
Just a reminder: under international law, an occupying power has no right of self-defense, and those who are occupied have the right and duty to liberate themselves by any means possible.


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21 Dec 2021, 5:54 pm

It boggles my mind why science fiction has humans hundreds of years in the future fighting each other in hand-to-hand combat. It's so obvious robots and remote controlled drones would be more efficient.



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21 Dec 2021, 5:55 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
Texasmoneyman300 wrote:
AR-15s are not military-grade so they would really stink if you were going up against a AK-47 in war and a AR-15 would get you killed in war most likely.


Training would probably be a bigger factor than whether you can switch your rifle into burst or full-auto or only have semi-auto.

Maybe if I was limited to that I would choose a semi-automatic AK-47.



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21 Dec 2021, 5:55 pm

Texasmoneyman300 wrote:
I would agree because I would rather have AR-15 or semi-automatic AK-47 in combat than a M1 Garand in .30-06 or the K98 in 8mm Mauser if i was in WW2.


Same, if only because I can carry more intermediate cartridges compared to full-sized ones, because the box mag allows for quicker reloading (even if I only get a 10 round one) and because most combat doesn't require more than half the range those battle rifles possess.


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The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.
If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing. —Malcolm X
Just a reminder: under international law, an occupying power has no right of self-defense, and those who are occupied have the right and duty to liberate themselves by any means possible.


Texasmoneyman300
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21 Dec 2021, 6:01 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
Texasmoneyman300 wrote:
I would agree because I would rather have AR-15 or semi-automatic AK-47 in combat than a M1 Garand in .30-06 or the K98 in 8mm Mauser if i was in WW2.


Same, if only because I can carry more intermediate cartridges compared to full-sized ones, because the box mag allows for quicker reloading (even if I only get a 10 round one) and because most combat doesn't require more than half the range those battle rifles possess.

ya the Germans figured most combat happened within 100 to 300 yards but if given a choice of a AR-15 or AK or AR-10 or I might choose the AR-10 in the .308 if I had to engage German soldiers at 500 yards and also the .308 and AK are much better for stopping power and blowing through cover than a .223 Remington.I would choose a AR-10 with a 20 to 30 round magazine semi-automatic in WW2 because the German rounds could shoot out past 1000 yards.But Ideally I would have AR-15 with 30 to 100 round magizine.



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21 Dec 2021, 6:03 pm

Y'all need to be reminded that the AR15 is a platform and not just a specific rifle, that while the majority of them come in 5.56mm, which is indeed on the weak side for deer hunting though just fine for smaller game, a huge draw of the platform is its modularity, that you can pop out two pins and change the upper to a different barrel length or caliber, many of which are perfectly suitable for deer hunting. I've got one in .300 Blackout, which in the supersonic loading can get up into 30-30 territory, likely the most common deer hunting cartridge of the 20th century, and a simple swap of the upper can get me .350 Legend, .45 Bushmaster, .458 Socom, .50 AE, or any number of other cartridges capable of taking any game on earth, to say nothing of stepping up to a large frame AR that allows the .308 family of rounds and more. IIRC, the whole AR project stemmed from Stoner's desire to build a lightweight rifle for his wife to hunt with using modern materials, it just so happened that a light and modular rifle caught the eye of the air force as a survival rifle for air crews, then special forces guys looking for something lighter than the wood and steel M14s of the era, then the general military, it was a sporting gun first.


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21 Dec 2021, 6:10 pm

naturalplastic wrote:
And its fair to say that that group of guns all suck for bringing down a buck off in the woods. Which brings us back to Fnord's question ...which is..."what do you think about teenagers carrying guns that are useless for hunting because their only purpose is to mow down human beings on the battlefield?".


Actually, they all make fine hunting guns, with the added versatility of pulling double duty for home defense.


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21 Dec 2021, 6:14 pm

Dox47 wrote:
Y'all need to be reminded that the AR15 is a platform and not just a specific rifle, that while the majority of them come in 5.56mm, which is indeed on the weak side for deer hunting though just fine for smaller game, a huge draw of the platform is its modularity, that you can pop out two pins and change the upper to a different barrel length or caliber, many of which are perfectly suitable for deer hunting. I've got one in .300 Blackout, which in the supersonic loading can get up into 30-30 territory, likely the most common deer hunting cartridge of the 20th century, and a simple swap of the upper can get me .350 Legend, .45 Bushmaster, .458 Socom, .50 AE, or any number of other cartridges capable of taking any game on earth, to say nothing of stepping up to a large frame AR that allows the .308 family of rounds and more. IIRC, the whole AR project stemmed from Stoner's desire to build a lightweight rifle for his wife to hunt with using modern materials, it just so happened that a light and modular rifle caught the eye of the air force as a survival rifle for air crews, then special forces guys looking for something lighter than the wood and steel M14s of the era, then the general military, it was a sporting gun first.

I never did get the point of the .300 blackout because I would just get a Ruger Mini-30 in 7.62x39mm or a AK-47 because the 7.62x39mm is about powerful as a .30-30 or a .300 Blackout roughly and alot easier to find ammo for and is cheaper and a AK would prolly be more dependable than a AR platform.But your right AR-15s can come in many different loadings.I would choose the 6.5 Grendel or 6.8 Remington SPC
to use over a .223 or 7.62x39mm if I could.



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21 Dec 2021, 6:15 pm

Dox47 wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
And its fair to say that that group of guns all suck for bringing down a buck off in the woods. Which brings us back to Fnord's question ...which is..."what do you think about teenagers carrying guns that are useless for hunting because their only purpose is to mow down human beings on the battlefield?".


Actually, they all make fine hunting guns, with the added versatility of pulling double duty for home defense.

Perfectly said.



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21 Dec 2021, 6:26 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
Texasmoneyman300 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
Texasmoneyman300 wrote:
Fnord wrote:
What do you think about children using assault weapons?

I think they are likely to go on killing sprees due to faulty information they find on-line.

Define assault weapons.Do you mean assault rifles or modern sporting rifles?


If he said "assault rifles" then he probably means "assault rifles".

Military type automatic capable rifles that fire heavy bullets like the M16, and the AK 47, but also the consumer civilian version of the M16 (the AR 15). And not hunting rifles that fire one shot at a time.


Assault rifles are defined by firing relatively light bullets compared to a battle rifle.

A modern sporting rifle is the weapon of choice for many mass shooters and is what the media refers to as an assault weapon. A modern sporting rifle isn't granddad's bolt action 30-06, it's a sporterized assault rifle derivative.

Ya True but I dont think the general public knows how scary a bolt action .270 Winchester deer rifle could be.


Indeed.

Beyond that it's a topic where often people get distracted by arguing over jargon or using trivial distinctions to avoid certain realizations.

Whether or not one believes this is a valid reason to restrict access, it's fair to say that the average sporterized AR-15 or AR-10 or SKS or AK would make a better infantry weapon than anything given out as standard issue in WWII.

Personally if I had to restrict access to any class of guns it would semi-automatic handguns because those are the most common type used in homicides in the US.