Is being gay wrong?

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If we could choose to be gay or straight no one would choose to be gay.

Why? Becuase why would someone choose to be gay when they're going to be hated against all their life?

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There are Conservative Christians also who do not choose to be gay, yet they have to struggle with their sexuality too.

First off, I thank the moderators for moving this to a different forum.
Second of all, I tried really hard to express my point this time and am somewhat satisfied with the response I posted above. As many of you pointed out, alot of my other former posts were judgemental and arguementative. In changing them and responding to them, I was also called a hypocrite which is well founded since it certainly appeared that way. When writing them, it wasn't my intention to make them so bold and rigid since I don't believe the subject is very concrete. There is admittedly more research to be done, more talking to be done and opinions can change. My words often don't match the jumble of information that spews out of my head so take that into consideration too.

Nayashi, I couldn't vote because the questions are choices between "too radical for", "too radical against" and "I don't care". Like I said, I believe this is a topic with alot of unfinished research and dialogue of morals. I think there's a scale of activists and opinions that are mild to severe on both sides. Severe being extremely rigid ideas that allow little or no room for adjustment. Mild being allowable to change based on future knowledge and information. And the "it's none of my business" would reflect a passive and neutral stance.

Absolute_Zero, although the "it's none of my bussiness" stance may have sounded "I don't care" ish, it wasn't meant to. What I meant was "I'm not gay, so I have no right to say anything about it." That's how a lot of people seem to feel about the subject.

I should have been thinking better when I posted this poll because I should have known it would start a war. I didn't want anyone to argue, I was just curious how how everyone thought on this site.

I apologize to anyone who was offended by this, and if the majority of the members of this forum think that it would be best if this poll was taken off, I will gladly delete this post (if at all possible).

I have many, many gay friends and two gay family members. I myself am bisexual, and I wanted to know if I was safe on this site.

Being gay is just as bad as being Autistic. Both of them inspire the same revulsion from right-wingers who want people to change what they can't change about themselves.

could we swap the word "bad" for "difficult", tom? then i'll be completely delirious about your post

Whatever word he uses, he's still right.

Although "difficult" does sound better...

I like "difficult" better as well. Being autistic isn't necessarily bad. But other than that, I have similar sentiments.

There had been statistical research done that indicates there is very probably a biological basis for homosexuality. This would imply that it is not a "choice." Let me post some stuff from my biopsychology textbook:

Genetics:

Homosexuality is 2-7 times higher among the siblings of homosexuals than it is in the population. Identical twins are more concordant for homosexuality than fraternal twins or non-twin siblings. The heritability (percentage of the variation among individuals in a characteristic that can be attributed to heredity) estimates of homosexuality range from 31-74%. (This is accounting for adoption, by the way, or else it would not even be mentioned.)

It was noticed that gay men have more gay relatives on the mother's side than on the father's side. Following up on this, researchers checked the X chromosome (the one paired with Y) in these men, looking at the genes of gay brothers. In 64% of the pairs, the brotherhood shared the same genetic material on one end of the chromosome. A further study supported this. Although this does not mean that they found a "gay gene," (and in fact there would have to be other places that effected sexual orientation as well), there is really no question (statistically) that homosexuality does have some heritable basis.

Hormones:

Doctors have tried giving gay men testosterone to "make" them heterosexual. It didn't work; all it did was increase sexual activity. Studies have since been done comparing hormone levels on homosexuals and heterosexuals, and the hypothesis that hormones are lacking or in excess has not been supported. If hormones are to blame, it's prenatal exposure. Hormonal manipulation has caused some animals to have same-sex sex preferences, but this is controversial and not supported very well.

The question of animals, however, raises an interesting point: There are homosexual animals. 10% of male sheep prefer other males as sex partners. Some female gulls on Santa Barbara Island have been observed in "lesbian" pairs. The gulls perform normal courtship and maintaining rituals.

Brain Structures:

There are three main brain structures which have thus far been identified as having different sizes in homosexuals and heterosexuals. The third intersisital nucleus of the anterior hypothalamus was found in a study to be half the size in gay men and heterosexual women as in heterosexual men. This structure is involved in sexual activity in animals but its role in humans is unknown.

The suprachiasmatic nucleus was found in a study to be larger in gay men than in heterosexual men and contained almost twice as many cells which secrete the hormone vasopressin. This structure regulates the female reproductive cycle in rats and controls daily cycles in rats and humans. Back to the hormones, when male rats were treated prenatally with a chemical that blocks the effects of testosterone, the number of vasopressin-secreting cells in this area increased.

The anterior commisure was found to be larger on another study in gay man and heterosexual women than in heterosexual men. This is one of the structures connecting the two hemispheres of the brain.

Other differences worth noting:

Gay men and heterosexual women score lower on spatial tasks and higher on verbal ability than heterosexual men.

Although little studies have been done on lesbians, two physical characteristics have been found to distinguish heterosexual women from lesbians, which would support a biological basis in women for homosexuality despite seeming somewhat trivial. In men, the ring finger is usually longer, in women, they are about the same length. The index-to-ring-finger ratio in homosexual women is the same as in men, on average. There is a faint sound given off by the inner ear when it is stimulated, called click-evolved otoacoustic emissions. The response is weaker in lesbians and men (heterosexual and gay) than in heterosexual women.

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Having posted all that, I don't think it's "abnormal" and that it's a biological deviation; I'm putting this up, as I said, to help support the idea that it is NOT a choice.

My opinion: I don't think it's morally wrong.

Last edited by Serissa on 19 Jul 2005, 9:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Firstly let me say that I screwed up on that poll, and voted for punishment by accident. Sorry

I really feel it's none of my business, but I do find it intriguing.
I thought some of you might find this perspective interesting, it had never occured to me before. In a Carl Sagan book on evolution, he points out that when rats are packed together in an overcrowded space, homosexual activity increases. This could be a mechanism that has helped control overpopulation in the past. He does of course go on to say that people are not rats. Still I thought it an interesting idea considering our population expansion and metropolitan areas.

Another thing I find interesting is the way some folks seem genuinely threatened by this behaviour. More men than women, I think. The only explanation I can come up with is that it has something to do with undermining the social hierarchy.
In chimpanzee society, sex is a sort of social currency.
Once again I feel compelled to state that humans are not chimpanzees.

Just some thoughts.

Well who doesn't?

Before I go into my argument about a biological cause behind homosexuality, can anyone guess what this is?

The ruins of Sodom?

Sodom ?
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All right I cheated
Right click save as

Nayashi, and everyone else... Please take into consideration that alot of us can't accurately post exactly what we feel into words all the time. I don't take your 3 point poll as serious as it sounds. If you look at it and blindly took it for face value then yes, it could be viewed as "either you are with us or against us" type of deal. But of course...I don't think most of us are perfect writers!

This is good, I like all the ideas flowing here without the attacks and pointless argueing.