The woke right

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13 Jun 2025, 12:27 am

Likewise, so that I'm clear, my primary argument is over the label and the political biases that inform how that label is used.

funeralxempire wrote:

Society has always had standards of decency, with the potential for negative backlash when those standards are violated. Apparently this is only became a problem when social conservatives lost the clout to be the ones imposing those standards, now they hypocritically sob that society still imposes standards of decency and now sometimes they're the ones facing backlash.

Clearly it was much more fair when the reactionaries were in charge, those were the good ol' days, according to reactionaries who often still call for boycotts or other consequences for those who violate their (increasingly irrelevant, double) standards.

Somehow, it wasn't a problem until conservatives started experiencing the effects of falling outside the Overton window, then it immediately became a moral panic with a catchy name "cancel culture".

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13 Jun 2025, 12:29 am

CherokeeDeathRose13 wrote:

funeralxempire wrote:

CherokeeDeathRose13 wrote:

How is cancel culture not a real thing?

Because it was a moral panic, no more real than "the war on Christmas".

I agree about the War on Christmas being BS but cancel culture sure wasn't.

How not? How was cancel culture less of a moral panic and actually a real issue, unlike the moral panic behind the war on Christmas?

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13 Jun 2025, 12:35 am

funeralxempire wrote:

How not? How was cancel culture less of a moral panic and actually a real issue, unlike the moral panic behind the war on Christmas?

Because for one thing it created a culture of censorship where people could lose their jobs for having said or done anything offensive in the past. And they get subjected to a lot of online hate like the lady who wrote the Harry Potter books did. (not that I'm a fan of her books or anything)

The Far Left likes to censor, then punish, then gaslight everyone they hold "accountable" for bigotry. It's a fact.

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13 Jun 2025, 12:38 am

CherokeeDeathRose13 wrote:

funeralxempire wrote:

How not? How was cancel culture less of a moral panic and actually a real issue, unlike the moral panic behind the war on Christmas?

Maybe you're unaware, but JK Rowling has certainly put a lion's share of hate on others herself.

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13 Jun 2025, 12:41 am

10Lubak wrote:

CherokeeDeathRose13 wrote:

funeralxempire wrote:

How not? How was cancel culture less of a moral panic and actually a real issue, unlike the moral panic behind the war on Christmas?

Maybe you're unaware, but JK Rowling has certainly put a lion's share of hate on others herself.

Yes Im aware she's a transphobe, but does that justify people making death threats towards the woman? I'm more concerned about that than I am her being booted out of her own franchises. Although I've always thought Harry Potter was overrated.

But regardless.

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13 Jun 2025, 12:42 am

CherokeeDeathRose13 wrote:

funeralxempire wrote:

How not? How was cancel culture less of a moral panic and actually a real issue, unlike the moral panic behind the war on Christmas?

Where's this culture of censorship? If it existed certainly there'd be examples, meanwhile most people who claim to have been cancelled are basically just grifting off of that claim and never go away.

I mean if cancel culture was a real problem, why is Kanye still in the news regularly?

Basically, you're acting like it's a new phenomenon that the left invented when the issue of facing backlash for violating social norms has existed for ages and largely hasn't been driven by the left, but instead by conservatives.

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13 Jun 2025, 12:45 am

CherokeeDeathRose13 wrote:

10Lubak wrote:

[/quote]

(No, it does not justify that, and I believe that the people doing that are wrong. However using her as an example of someone being unfairly canceled is not the best option considering this has not been a momentary or learned from thing)

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13 Jun 2025, 12:51 am

I'm just saying regardless if someone truly is a bigot or not we shouldnt be creating an evironment where it's ok to ruin lives and make death threats to people who say or do the wrong thing. It feels to me like our society today is on a puritan witch hunt for every single bigot in the world. That's probably whar has contributed to all the MAGA crap growing so strong.

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13 Jun 2025, 12:56 am

This seems like complaining that people who do wrong are punished for doing so.

If someone behaves in a contemptible manner, people will dislike them and not want to support them. If they're famous, more people will care about the scandal that results.

The problem isn't cancel culture, it's people acting like a**holes and assuming they'll never face consequences, and then acting like the consequences of their actions are somehow unreasonable.

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13 Jun 2025, 1:01 am

funeralxempire wrote:

I fail to see how online death threats towards anybody are "reasonable" consequences for anything. :roll:

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13 Jun 2025, 1:49 am

funeralxempire wrote:

Mona Pereth wrote:

ASPartOfMe wrote:

Now that the term is starting to be applied to the right are most of the people who claimed woke is an illegitimate term for a whole host of reasons going to object when it is applied to Trump supporters or zionists? Rhetorical question.

It remains to be seen whether this attempted weaponization of the term "woke" by libertarians and center-right folks against the extreme right turns out to be effective. It could very easily backfire, it seems to me.

I still think it's not a productive term in the context of general political dialogue, at least where mutual understanding is the aim.

I'd agree. It's essentially taking an already largely useless term and making it entirely meaningless in this new application.

The only positive is that calling right-wing extremists woke might upset them, but I wouldn't even count on that actually working.

The main point is to call out their hypocrisy. If it upsets them to be told they are like the people they call woke, that is an added benefit.

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13 Jun 2025, 1:53 am

ASPartOfMe wrote:

The main point is to call out their hypocrisy. If it upsets them to be told they are like the people they call woke, that is an added benefit.

I'm not sure they can effectively be shamed for hypocrisy.
They'd need to possess a sense of shame for that tactic to work, but instead they genuinely don't seem to even understand the concept of hypocrisy.

Remember, these are the same people who whinge about government deficits only to expand them even more rapidly every time they hold power.

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13 Jun 2025, 2:13 am

funeralxempire wrote:

I mean if cancel culture was a real problem, why is Kanye still in the news regularly?

Basically, you're acting like it's a new phenomenon that the left invented when the issue of facing backlash for violating social norms has existed for ages and largely hasn't been driven by the left, but instead by conservatives.

What was new when the censorious left came into prominence was technology. This made it easier to discover what somebody said in the past that is now not as accepted, and to find out where they live. It added cyber harassment as a tool.

As far as Kanye is concerned, the most obvious reason is that what he says repeatedly goes so far beyond what is acceptable that it is newsworthy.

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13 Jun 2025, 2:17 am

ASPartOfMe wrote:

funeralxempire wrote:

I believe that change was largely inevitable, as a result of technological change rather than anything unique about the left, or due to the left being overly censorious.

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13 Jun 2025, 2:23 am

funeralxempire wrote:

ASPartOfMe wrote:

The main point is to call out their hypocrisy. If it upsets them to be told they are like the people they call woke, that is an added benefit.

They probably can't be shamed, but it might help the anti MAGA cause by making some non-MAGA Trump voters who voted for him because they perceive the Democrats as too censorious realize the people they voted for are just the same if not worse.

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13 Jun 2025, 2:28 am

funeralxempire wrote:

ASPartOfMe wrote:

funeralxempire wrote:

I believe that change was largely inevitable, as a result of technological change rather than anything unique about the left, or due to the left being overly censorious.

The left seemed more censorious because they were literally more censorious because they understood how to use technology first. That is over.

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