Is Wicca/Neopaganism ruined?

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More "abrasive and elitist/exclusive/snobby" -- or otherwise obnoxious -- than most teenagers in general?

In my experience, many teenagers in general tend to be obnoxious in one way or another.

If you experience goth/emo kids as being more "abrasive and elitist/exclusive/snobby" than teenagers in general, I wonder if this might be -- in at least some cases, at least in part -- because they first detect hostile or contemptuous vibes coming from you. So perhaps a self-fulfilling prophecy, at least to some extent?

Also, oddball subcultures of all kinds are likely to attract more than their share of autistic and other neurodivergent people. And this might be another reason why these subcultures might have more than their share of people who come across as "abrasive and elitist/exclusive/snobby" -- or, at least, not the friendliest or most outgoing. So I wonder if, in at least a few cases, you might be mistaking autistic traits for snobbishness.

Last edited by Mona Pereth on 24 Jun 2025, 12:31 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Every religion is commercialized all to hell. American Evangelicals have their big corporate megachurches, Mecca has a booming hotel industry, I've seen Buddhist monks with cell-phones and driving fancy cars. Nothing holy or sacred can coexist with capitalism

Hmmm no, I was a loner in highschool and the goth/emo groups were equally condescending to me as my other arch enemies. the only difference between them and my occasional bullies is they played dress up.

I can't speak for all goths and emos or wiccans/pagans but the people I came across who followed these groups were popular, good looking, fashionable outgoing neurotypicals who enjoyed the attention. Sure a few individuals were not that bad and you could have a conversation but like extreme vegans (another group I know well) they had lifestyles that meant they excluded mere mortals from their social circles, something they wore like a badge of honour.

One example was in my early days working in a lab. One of the dudes who worked in the chemical store room was a paganist. He was covered from head to toe in pagan tattoos and piercings. In my occasional work interactions with him I asked him the religious reason he got all the tattoos and what the tattoos meant? He was initially shocked I asked (I was always curious like Dora the explorer) but laughed and said "it's just body art", it has no meaning. I asked him again..and he came up with "i like it". But aren't you a neo-pagan? and he said "yeah and the body art is just something that's me. And there you have it...elaborate cosplay.

Perhaps individual oddballs yes. But certainly not groups. Groupthink is neuroetypical > neurodivergents. I think you would know that...

Ain't that the truth...even the Jedi couldn't stave off corruption.

And those Catholic, Protestant, and puritan cults are themselves nothing like what Jesus was up to as presented in the bible, assuming that book is in any way an accurate portrayal of the man and his mission. Yet here we are. They have one and a half billion adherents. Not to mention Tibetan Buddhism that looks nothing like what that dude from 500 bce was up to.

The early Victorian revival was nothing more than a gasp of fresh air as people were finally free from the church's stranglehold on religion and spirituality. It's the time that gave us various Mutual Aid groups like the Freemasons, Buffalos, and 'Druids'. Pretty sure those Druids were Christians.

But it got the ball rolling on exploring. Then the West got occultists, Theosophists, Buddhists, Hindus and Hari Krshnas, Wiccans, and on and on. They were inspired by the past, but they weren't recreating. They were just creating.

"Pagan"? Depends. Define the word. Fit the definition, then ... Agreed though that maybe the term 'neo-pagan' might be more accurate. But then again, how long does it need to last to stop being neo?

Anyhoo. Since the 1970s, there has been an effort to formulate various neo-paganisms along more scholarly lines. They call themselves Reconstructionists. A phase I went through. I dropped it about a decade ago after coming to similar conclusions. We're not part of ancient tribes doing it ancient ways. So I asked myself, what do you call a modern polytheist in a modern cultural setting, speaking a modern language, seeking to connect with those old Gods?

I came up with the term 'Reconnectionist'. All the reading of the Reconstructionists, but none of the anachronisms

A good summary of the history...reconstruction is what these are...

Most people naturally gravitate towards other people who share their interests and values. In and of itself, this isn't necessarily snobbery, but just birds of a feather flocking together. Do you resent them for the mere fact that they aren't equally interested in talking to everybody? Or are they actually nasty and insulting about it?


It does not follow that his entire religious practices is just "elaborate cosplay." By denying the religious significance of his body art, it seems to me that he was just saying he did not regard body art as a religious practice. But he would likely have given you a different answer had you asked him about something he DID regard as a religious practice.