Are Autistics whom are Pro-Abortion hypocrits?
Bethie
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I used to volunteer at a Planned Parenthood.
Most abortions = a woman taking a pill and having a heavy period.
The hysterics over it are the hallmark of people wholly uneducated about the actual SUFFERING occurring in the world.
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For there is another kind of violence, slower but just as deadly, destructive as the shot or the bomb in the night. This is the violence of institutions; indifference and inaction and slow decay.
Most abortions = a woman taking a pill and having a heavy period.
The hysterics over it are the hallmark of people wholly uneducated about the actual SUFFERING occurring in the world.
Are you referring to any specific suffering?
Many women take the birth control now, and not just for having sex without pregnancy risk. I'm pretty sure it also helps them with 'that time of the month'. I wonder when a male birth control pill would become available, if possible. Condoms aren't a perfect guarantee
When will a male birth control pill be available? Probably never. I can't imagine there would be a market for it. Birth control pills for women work by altering hormonal balance so ovulation is prevented. Somehow I have the feeling that if a pharma company actually came up with a pill that altered men's hormonal balance enough to prevent sperm from being created, no (or very few) men would take it. Would you? Preventing the production of sperm would require some fairly serious hormonal alteration. Thus the mechanical methods of preventing normally created sperm from reaching its destination will prevail.
you say that like it's a bad thing.

And the truth comes out...

I pointed this out something like 20 pages ago as a completely consistent stance to take.
There are some conditions that make sense to abort, eg Patau Syndrome. Whether Down Syndrome is one of those can be debated, and yes, whether autism is one of those can also be debated.
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WAR IS PEACE
FREEDOM IS SLAVERY
IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH
you say that like it's a bad thing.

And the truth comes out...

I pointed this out something like 20 pages ago as a completely consistent stance to take.
There are some conditions that make sense to abort, eg Patau Syndrome. Whether Down Syndrome is one of those can be debated, and yes, whether autism is one of those can also be debated.
Agreed.
Also, why is it such a shocking thing to imagine people would not want a child with DS? It wasn't that long ago that it was common place to leave unwanted children (DS, deformed, female, etc.) in the outskirts of cities to die (or were killed) because they were considered a drain on the family and/or the community. The technology to determine whether or not a child has a genetic disorder prior to birth is new, and so the phenomenon of aborting zef's for such reasons is new as well. The overall phenomenon of choosing not to raise such children, however, is not.
Mammals kill their offspring - I'll bet you the nice neighbourhood cat would kill one of its kittens if it had something aking to DS. I've seen mice eat some of their pups because of deformities. In the animal kingdom, it would be a waste of resources to raise such offspring.
And, like it or not, we're all animals. And, like it or not, we do have instincts.
Asides the issues of economic dependence or ability to contribute, DS is also very associated with bad physical manifestations of the syndrome. There are many health risks. The truth is DS is a vulgarization of Human genetic code, and no individual deserves to be born that way. It is unfair to them, more so though in addition to the burden on others who have to care for them.
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Opportunities multiply as they are seized. -Sun Tzu
Nature creates few men brave, industry and training makes many -Machiavelli
You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do
The problem is not the threat of having a whole population of super humans or geniuses. The issue is that humans have been historically very bad at deciding what trait is better than another. Our metrics are pretty ret*d already. I am not against a world completely inhabited by geniuses, I am against a world full of people with 150 IQ that turn out to be ineffective at creativity, thinking for themselves or solving problems, but we call them an army of geniuses because they do well in IQ tests. And that's just the beginning of it.
And .. . genetic diversity, it is a useful resource because even now we cannot predict for sure what will happen to the environment in which we live. Imagine that we actually did succeed in having a society of geniuses that are very good problem solvers and stuff. Then, I don't know... A supernova explodes and its radiation is directed exactly against earth, destroying all of civilization and only leaving some few human survivor out there. Super geniuses which are for some reason not suitable to making fire with their own hands or hunting and die.
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The problem is not the threat of having a whole population of super humans or geniuses. The issue is that humans have been historically very bad at deciding what trait is better than another. Our metrics are pretty ret*d already. I am not against a world completely inhabited by geniuses, I am against a world full of people with 150 IQ that turn out to be ineffective at creativity, thinking for themselves or solving problems, but we call them an army of geniuses because they do well in IQ tests. And that's just the beginning of it.
And .. . genetic diversity, it is a useful resource because even now we cannot predict for sure what will happen to the environment in which we live. Imagine that we actually did succeed in having a society of geniuses that are very good problem solvers and stuff. Then, I don't know... A supernova explodes and its radiation is directed exactly against earth, destroying all of civilization and only leaving some few human survivor out there. Super geniuses which are for some reason not suitable to making fire with their own hands or hunting and die.
Many of us survive today because of advancements in material comfort and technology. Proper sewage and sanitation above and beyond all other variables. As a result of this we are a weaker species as a whole in our ability to survive as other animals do in the wild. It won't take a Super Nova to make it apparent the extent to which we depend on the infrastructure of culture that we have accumulated over thousands of years.
Whatever man made or natural disaster that might precede chaos and the law of the jungle, genius may not be the valued trait for survival.
you say that like it's a bad thing.

And the truth comes out...

I pointed this out something like 20 pages ago as a completely consistent stance to take.
There are some conditions that make sense to abort, eg Patau Syndrome. Whether Down Syndrome is one of those can be debated, and yes, whether autism is one of those can also be debated.
I also said, I think in my first post in this thread, that I personally would abort my zef if I found out that it had Down syndrome. How is this new statment worse (or more truthful) than that?
I can see your point. I don't think it to be of extreme power. It works somewhat, but I think that even with ret*d metrics, there are a lot of ways to work things around.
Well, the issue is that genius isn't a trait incompatible with those features either. The "suitability" issues really go back more to learned characteristics. I think the real fear is that a lack of variation can increase the problems due to disease. If some bug comes out, and all people have the same vulnerabilities, then this could be a problem. The issue is whether variability would be that greatly suppressed, and whether a loss in variability is likely to wipe us out.
Nature isn't that uncertain. There is some variability, even destructive variation, but certain things are just of benefit, and certain elements of our environment are not likely to change, especially given that we are in control over much of our environment.
I mean, the only thing off the top of my head that really seems to fit into what you talk about would be personality characteristics, but I think that talents are good traits, and I think it is reasonable to say that talents do not seem to compete with one another for space, in as much as a person could be both mathematical and artistic, creative and logical, and so on and so forth.
you say that like it's a bad thing.

And the truth comes out...

I pointed this out something like 20 pages ago as a completely consistent stance to take.
There are some conditions that make sense to abort, eg Patau Syndrome. Whether Down Syndrome is one of those can be debated, and yes, whether autism is one of those can also be debated.
I also said, I think in my first post in this thread, that I personally would abort my zef if I found out that it had Down syndrome. How is this new statment worse (or more truthful) than that?
Then why is it not okay for people to simply abort the child because tests show they have Autism. Or maybe their IQ may be below 130?
Seriously, this is turning into a rationalization for eugenics.
you say that like it's a bad thing.

And the truth comes out...

I pointed this out something like 20 pages ago as a completely consistent stance to take.
There are some conditions that make sense to abort, eg Patau Syndrome. Whether Down Syndrome is one of those can be debated, and yes, whether autism is one of those can also be debated.
I also said, I think in my first post in this thread, that I personally would abort my zef if I found out that it had Down syndrome. How is this new statment worse (or more truthful) than that?
Then why is it not okay for people to simply abort the child because tests show they have Autism. Or maybe their IQ may be below 130?
Seriously, this is turning into a rationalization for eugenics.
No its not. DS is a vulgarization that no individual should be cursed with. Autism is not nearly as well understood and finding it in the womb seems unlikely for the time being, in addition to the fact that it is more of a 'difference' in function. Look at people with DS, outside of the mental disabilities they often have other physical deformities that are often debilitating, in addition to risks later in their life from things associated with DS. It is a big difference, it is not eugenics, it is the preservation of dignity
My hope is someday they will simply be able to do gene therapy in utero to repair damaged code that could lead to DS or other serious malformations. As is there is only one humane thing to do
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Opportunities multiply as they are seized. -Sun Tzu
Nature creates few men brave, industry and training makes many -Machiavelli
You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do