Controversial Topic: Gun Control in the US

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Sorry but I grow tired of people telling me that I hate guns. The first display of "emotion" I showed in my reply was responding to your trolling me. I respect guns. I don't hate them. I could enjoy going to a range and shooting but I have no reason to own one. Also, I know too many people who drive around with multiple guns in their vehicles and on their person who carry all of these guns because they are paranoid reactionists. These are irrational gun owners. The same as the people who go out and buy craploads of guns as a statement of defiance against whatever entity they perceive as oppressing them in their delusional minds.

none of the proposed gun laws will do anything about caring about other humans. taking stuff away isn't caring, hanging out and getting the person help is caring about other humans.

you can't really prevent most suicides, if they want to die they'll just find another way. as I stated in my other post.

reality is people don't care about other people. they care about themselves, their family and close friends. human are a eat or be eaten species, our society is all about one upping each other. companies cheat and hurt millions in the name of making a little more money. so this is why when someone wants to kill themselves most people don't give one rates ass unless they know the person or can make money off them. so I guess the drug companies care so they can attempt to get that person to pay them thousands of dollars a month for their drugs with huge side effects.

if you know someone with guns who wants to kill themselves, go to them be like hey why don't you let me hold on to these for you until you feel better. and also talk to them about why they feel that way, then when they feel better they get their guns back instead of saying hey gov go take their property and never give it back and better yet make it so they can never buy them again for the rest of their life, even 50 years from now when they've gone 49 years without depression.

anyways most anti gun people only talk about how guns are bad and cause mass shootings. probably cause they know banning guns won't prevent suicides, people who commit suicides either had the guns long before they wanted to kill them selves , b never got treatment so not barred from buying guns, or c used someone elses.

with no way to scan babies to know if they going a. grow up to be murder, b. grow up to kill themselves, how do you stop a person who makes a split second decision who up until that second was completely ok to own and buy guns?

you can't not unless they were committed, broke a law, showed to others they were violent, or went to a therapist for help. so unless they have a record for such things, you can't know they are going do it so you can't preemptive bar them from owning guns without baring everyone from owning guns. as for those with records, well we have system in place for that but its broken and no one wants to fix it instead they want to add onto the broken system. expanding its brokenness. if a metal is rusting and you just paint over it i'ts still going rust through, you have to remove the rust then paint. though in this case expanding the system is wrong, if you just fixed it then you'd catch most the people the others have no record.

Personally, I have no use for a gun, therefore, I don't own one.

Granted, there are people out there that own and use guns that DON'T deserve them.

I have said this in the past, and I usually get my fat arse kicked when I do say it, but if you purchase a firearm of any kind, whether it is for self-defense, for hunting or competitive sport, it should be mandatory that the purchaser take a training course or courses on the SAFE use and handling of said firearms. It should be mandatory also that in order to keep continual use of this weapon, they go through mandatory retraining every few years, else they lose the privilege of using a gun. There should be a law that, if you fail to go through retraining, then those guns in the ownser's possession be made inoperable.

i think recommended.

why would you need to go again. oh hey in case you forget bullet comes out this end, always rack slide/bolt back to check if loaded when holding a gun,etc really only need taught once, those that follow will, those that don;t care won't care, telling them this every 10 years won't effect them.

as for tactical training its nice but expensive and most gun owners don't need it, we won't be in firefights in iraq.
cops don't even do it they just go in yearly shoot 5 rounds into a human target. security has to do practical training if they are going to carry a rifle and employee requires training, armed security have to do training every two years which is kinda similar to cops but bit more tactical and shot placement.

so if you're talking requiring them to make super hard shots to be able to own/carry a gun like some states do, i'll consider it when cops are required to too.

I'll use the same excuse cops do to. too expensive. ammo cost money, most cops aren't goo shots. they get few boxes a year for their carry gun. do some go out and train yes, but for fun and wanting to be good, just like a lot of gun owners do.

i think we should go back to offering gun safety classes in high school and having target shooting clubs.
maybe then less people would fear guns.

So we should all be made to suffer because of some people’s carelessness and that some of chosen to off themselves is what you’re saying. There have been an awful lot of firearms going to the public in the past five years. Do you even have anything that indicates an increase in accidents and suicides in that time period?


For the sake of argument, let’s say I’m careless and/or suicidal. I already have lots of guns so it’s kind of pointless to try to prevent me from getting what I already have. I could go on and on about the constitutional issue here but I have a feeling this thread will go on for a while. Yep, the same constitution that allows you to speak on matters that you know little to nothing about.



Are you trying to say “ASSAULT WEAPONS”?


I know more about gun safety and regulation than you or just about any other anti ever will.


Grow up.


Again, the amendment that recognizes my right to bear arms is part of the same constitution that allows some people to make spectacles of themselves on message boards.



We’ve been over and over this topic for the seven years that I’ve been on WP.
Your side has never been able to come to the table with anything any more meaningful than “I don’t like gunz”. I double-dog dare you to go back through all those years of gunz-r-bad threads and find something that proves me wrong.


Shout you down? We don’t need to since you sink your own ship just be talking about a topic which you have nothing but emotion to go on.



If it was legal to carry a loaded weapon, openly or concealed, to a public discussion relating to any topic then it’s a non-issue.
Um, what was that you were saying about “supportable evidence”?


More bashing of the constitution.
Doesn’t it ever get old?

You'll love England.
Move there, please.

So what's wrong with taking a broad brush approach by teaching gun safety in public or even private schools? As far as suicide, people are going to do what they are going to do when it comes to that. I refuse to believe that someone bent on killing themselves would change their mind just because a gun wasn't handy at the moment.

Rather thin-skinned, aren't you?

If you want to pay my expenses for moving to the UK, I'll gladly do so.

As you posted previously, there should be this type of gun training in the high schools, along with rifle clubs. The local school districts had them, many years ago, especially around deer-hunting season. Why don't they have them now? Very simple: we live in a litigious society, where the slightest deviation from common sense can cost we the taxpayers millions of dollars. The only thing I ask about gun ownership is to take the time to use the damn weapon safely and properly. If you can't do that, according to quite a few hunters that I know personally, then you have no business owning a gun. I'm so much of a damn klutz that I would have shot myself. I also have poor eyesight. I can't even hit the broadside of a barn with a softball. Just what makes you think I can do so with a gun? Is that REALLY too much to ask? Apparently, by your smart-arsed response for me to move to the UK, it must be so.

End of rant. Send all replies to /dev/null.

Any evidence that such a scheme would actually do any good? John Lott did a study some years ago examining firearms misuse in states that required training to own or carry firearms vs those who did not, and found no statistical difference. This is a common problem I have with people proposing what they think sound like reasonable regulations, they haven't actually studied the issue and often propose solutions to non-existent problems or invasive/expensive proposals that have been show to not actually work. The Canadian long gun registry is an excellent example, a multi-billion dollar boondoggle that has been virtually useless except for allowing the RCMP to confiscate firearms that they've retroactively decided to ban, which is incidentally the exact reasoning many gun people oppose registries of any kind, such as, say, the kind required to implement schemes like yours.

Same thing with magazine capacity limits, they almost never play any role in crime, and yet anti-gun types are obsessed with them, along with virtually never misused semi-auto rifles and large pistols, concealed carriers that are more law abiding than the police, flashy but harmless open carriers, impractical and expensive large caliber rifles, etc. Like I've been saying for years, I'd be a lot less hostile to people if they'd at least bother to educate themselves on the subject, even a little.

Meistersinger

i think i said that unless raptor said it earlier.

we don't have them anymore cause the left took over education, left hates guns, so left put end to it. theres still a few that go on. one was in the news last year, they won trophies that the school prized and keep in their trophy box with all the others from other sports, but they decided to leave the team picture out of the year book. so ashamed of the team but not of their awards o.O. with obama gun ownership is on the rise. but I can't help but wonder if it'd be higher if those people had been introduced to guns earlier through safe and sponsored sports. but the school system is more about brainwashing kids to follow the left blindly. they tell kids lies about the 2nd amendment, so why would they want to bring back shooting sports. though its a failed system cause people who like guns find a way to them, although through video games like call of duty which teaches nothing about gun safty. I had to learn via research. I'm a anxious aspie who has interest in guns, so I researched and researched, watch tons of videos, learn all I can. I am paranoid about safety with guns I've been told, but I really don't ever want a accident. can't say the same for some nt that learns about guns from games where they run around shooting blindly.

though I don't knock those who get into airsoft/real steel guns cause of games like others do. puts them at a disadvantage to those raised with them or taught from an earlier age. instead you get some drunk call of duty player with guns waving them around. let my younger sister see one of my pistols once, triple checked it was unloaded as always. she swung it around and pointed it at me. not too fun looking down the barrel of your own gun even if i know its unloaded, also made me crazy about not being safe. haven't let her see them sense not that she visits.

but maybe if they taught gun safety she'd known better.

dox, thought Canada got rid of that when the people refused to abide and the police said they wouldn't go enforce it?

According to this World Health Organization research paper ( http://www.who.int/bulletin/volumes/86/9/07-043489/en ) and its table ( http://www.who.int/bulletin/volumes/86/ ... e-T1.htmlv ), we can see that firearms as a method of suicide is, indeed, the preferred method in the United States (60.6 percent men, 35.7 percent women), Uruguay (47.8 percent men, 35.7 percent women), Colombia (37.0 percent men) and Switzerland (33.5 percent men), but, the preferred method in most other nations is hanging or the intentional ingestion of pesticides.

Should rope and bug spray be banned worldwide? No. Clearly, this research shows simply that affordability, availability and cultural norms decide what methods are preferred. So, about half of all suicidal Americans die from firearms. Many more suicidal citizens of other nations die from hanging or pesticides.

Dead is dead. And, while I am disturbed by anyone's intentional death, I don't get distracted by the methods used.

Thin skinned? No, I just think that a nanny state would be a better fit for you.


Some public schools do teach it and at least a few states are looking it making it statewide. Gun clubs usually offer gun safety training. Hunter safety classes are prerequisite to getting a hunting licence in most or all states.


Your method is quite invasive (not to mention unconstitutional) and gives the government yet another power to abuse with no evidence of the need for it.



I don't know or care what you can do with a gun.

Utah just failed to adopt a statewide bill to restore optional firearm-safety classes at its public schools for students at age 13 or older. Apart from a small budget expense to operate the classes, I can't figure out why the bill didn't pass.

It should start as early as kindergarten with material like this.

And you wonder why the pro-gun lobby has such a bad reputation...

My offer still stands: pay all my expenses to move to the UK, and I'll gladly move.