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Master_Pedant
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21 Apr 2011, 5:25 pm

As for Jesus's pathological flip-flopping...

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GsZBVII-sJ0[/youtube]

As a matter of fact, you could say that the Biblical Jesus is just like '08 Barack Obama - different things to different people.

Personally, I do think there was a historical Jesus. He was just a very confused and very emblished (by later gospels) man.


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number5
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21 Apr 2011, 6:54 pm

iamnotaparakeet wrote:
However Democrat stances on moral issues, although just in general terms, would run counter to Christ and Christ would run counter to them.


I strongly disagree with this. Jesus would be supporting ideas like Universal Healthcare, and end to war, and support for the needy. I doubt he'd be shutting off grandma's heat to give Bill Gates yet another tax cut. I think he'd be appalled by the FYIGM (eff you, I got mine) attitude of the republicans.

The religious right are neither.



DW_a_mom
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21 Apr 2011, 8:12 pm

I guess I should rephrase, "unless *my version* of Jesus" was suddenly on the ballot ;)


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iamnotaparakeet
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21 Apr 2011, 11:50 pm

DW_a_mom wrote:
I guess I should rephrase, "unless *my version* of Jesus" was suddenly on the ballot ;)


Your "version" of Jesus?



Bethie
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22 Apr 2011, 4:45 am

iamnotaparakeet wrote:
DW_a_mom wrote:
I guess I should rephrase, "unless *my version* of Jesus" was suddenly on the ballot ;)


Your "version" of Jesus?


Yes. I don't know how you could possibly assert Jesus wouldn't be a social liberal,
or at the very least not a conservative.

Since you evidently disagree, this would rationally imply that the character of Jesus is subjectively-interpreted.


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iamnotaparakeet
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22 Apr 2011, 9:18 am

Bethie wrote:
iamnotaparakeet wrote:
DW_a_mom wrote:
I guess I should rephrase, "unless *my version* of Jesus" was suddenly on the ballot ;)


Your "version" of Jesus?


Yes. I don't know how you could possibly assert Jesus wouldn't be a social liberal,
or at the very least not a conservative.

Since you evidently disagree, this would rationally imply that the character of Jesus is subjectively-interpreted.


There are no "versions" of Jesus, nor are there "versions" of anyone else. My disagreement is part of argumentation, not a statement about the nature of reality. There is only one Jesus, not an infinite number of "versions" to cater to the whims of each individual.



skafather84
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22 Apr 2011, 10:48 am

iamnotaparakeet wrote:
DW_a_mom wrote:
I guess I should rephrase, "unless *my version* of Jesus" was suddenly on the ballot ;)


Your "version" of Jesus?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uS5DaTIF1a0

There's some obscene words but outside of that, he makes some good points. "You make your own Christianity."


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Bethie
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22 Apr 2011, 11:01 am

iamnotaparakeet wrote:
Bethie wrote:
iamnotaparakeet wrote:
DW_a_mom wrote:
I guess I should rephrase, "unless *my version* of Jesus" was suddenly on the ballot ;)


Your "version" of Jesus?


Yes. I don't know how you could possibly assert Jesus wouldn't be a social liberal,
or at the very least not a conservative.

Since you evidently disagree, this would rationally imply that the character of Jesus is subjectively-interpreted.


There are no "versions" of Jesus, nor are there "versions" of anyone else.

If that was the case, we wouldn't be engaged in disagreement about which political figures he is like or not like, based on personal VERSIONS as we personally understand the character.

iamnotaparakeet wrote:
There is only one Jesus, not an infinite number of "versions" to cater to the whims of each individual.

It would seem that this is so obviously-false as to be comical- people whoring out Jesus in support of their political/cultural objectives is nothing new- a casual discussion on the subject should be comparably less-offensive to you.


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The_Face_of_Boo
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22 Apr 2011, 11:04 am

If there aren't many versions of jesus then why there are many versions (sects) of Christianity?



iamnotaparakeet
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22 Apr 2011, 11:34 am

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
If there aren't many versions of jesus then why there are many versions (sects) of Christianity?


I'm not claiming that people don't twist words or interpret everything to their liking, but such does not matter.



Master_Pedant
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22 Apr 2011, 11:41 am

Bethie wrote:
Yes. I don't know how you could possibly assert Jesus wouldn't be a social liberal,
or at the very least not a conservative


On sexual issues, (in some of the Gospels) Jesus Christ was socially conservative. While it's really hard to extract a consistent, stable Jesus from the Gospels (in part because the Gospel writers had different agendas and in part because the historical Jesus was probably borderline schizophrenic), the best "composite" of what Jesus was would probably be someone who valued socioeconomic egalitarianism, pacifism, and social conservatism on sexual matters. So, in America today, he'd be a left-libertarian on foreign and domestic economic policy while a conservative on "social" issues*.

*I know, it's pretty stupid to seperate social equality from "social issues", but that's an artifact of the labeling system used in America.


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Inuyasha
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22 Apr 2011, 11:46 am

Bethie wrote:
iamnotaparakeet wrote:
DW_a_mom wrote:
I guess I should rephrase, "unless *my version* of Jesus" was suddenly on the ballot ;)


Your "version" of Jesus?


Yes. I don't know how you could possibly assert Jesus wouldn't be a social liberal,
or at the very least not a conservative.

Since you evidently disagree, this would rationally imply that the character of Jesus is subjectively-interpreted.


I sincerely doubt Jesus would be a liberal, for the simple reason that Jesus believed that there was such a thing as write and wrong. While he believed in forgiveness, that is not the same thing as moral relativism.



Master_Pedant
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22 Apr 2011, 11:48 am

iamnotaparakeet wrote:
There are no "versions" of Jesus, nor are there "versions" of anyone else. My disagreement is part of argumentation, not a statement about the nature of reality. There is only one Jesus, not an infinite number of "versions" to cater to the whims of each individual.


Since the Gospels are inconsistent, there are already multiple versions of the "Biblical Jesus" in the source material. Furthermore, the historical Jesus was probably a very confused, flip-flopping individuals who went into bipolar swings (telling people to love their enemies one moment while blasting the infidels the next), so it's clear that he didn't have a stable theology or personality.


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Master_Pedant
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22 Apr 2011, 11:50 am

Inuyasha wrote:
I sincerely doubt Jesus would be a liberal, for the simple reason that Jesus believed that there was such a thing as write and wrong. While he believed in forgiveness, that is not the same thing as moral relativism.


So, Inuyasha, which is it? Are liberals driven by a rigid, doctrinaire, morally absolutist fanaticism or are they moral relativists? Because your varying posts seem to rely on the first stereotype.


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Inuyasha
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22 Apr 2011, 11:51 am

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
If there aren't many versions of jesus then why there are many versions (sects) of Christianity?


Does the Protestant Reformation and Martin Luther ring any bells to you?



Master_Pedant
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22 Apr 2011, 11:54 am

Inuyasha wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
If there aren't many versions of jesus then why there are many versions (sects) of Christianity?


Does the Protestant Reformation and Martin Luther ring any bells to you?


What the hell does that have to do with anything? If anything, it strengthens his point, because the Protestant Reformation didn't produce one "rectified" account of Jesus, but rather slintered into dozens of different sub-sects like Calvinism, Anglicanism, Lutheranism, etc.


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