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The defence of marriage issue: my take

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Inuyasha
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15 Aug 2011, 9:06 pm

pandabear wrote:
simon_says wrote:
Polygamy is fine with me but it will take another generation or three to legalize it.

But with 70% of the under 35 crowd in favor of gay marriage, that debate is all but won. It's been decoupled from the other social issues and won over the Independents and the young.


Reminds me of a quote from the iconic 1967 movie Guess Who's Coming to Dinner?


Who conducted the poll?

pandabear wrote:
Quote:
You listen to me. You say you don't want to tell me how to live my life. So what do you think you've been doing? You tell me what rights I've got or haven't got, and what I owe to you for what you've done for me. Let me tell you something. I owe you nothing! If you carried that bag a million miles, you did what you're supposed to do! Because you brought me into this world. And from that day you owed me everything you could ever do for me like I will owe my son if I ever have another. But you don't own me! You can't tell me when or where I'm out of line, or try to get me to live my life according to your rules. You don't even know what I am, Dad, you don't know who I am. You don't know how I feel, what I think. And if I tried to explain it the rest of your life you will never understand. You are 30 years older than I am. You and your whole lousy generation believes the way it was for you is the way it's got to be. And not until your whole generation has lain down and died will the dead weight of you be off our backs! You understand, you've got to get off my back! Dad... Dad, you're my father. I'm your son. I love you. I always have and I always will. But you think of yourself as a colored man. I think of myself as a man.


Maybe it is time for a remake of this movie, but this time with homosexual marriage as the theme.


Maybe it is time we start filming (and I don't mean a fictional story line) a documentary how gay groups are advocating discrimination towards Christians.



pandabear
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15 Aug 2011, 9:15 pm

Inuyasha wrote:
pandabear wrote:
Reminds me of a quote from the iconic 1967 movie Guess Who's Coming to Dinner?


Who conducted the poll?

What poll?


Inuyasha wrote:
Maybe it is time we start filming (and I don't mean a fictional story line) a documentary how gay groups are advocating discrimination towards Christians.


I look forward to watching it. Are you going to play the role of the drag queen?

What type of discrimination are gay groups advocating towards Christians?



ValentineWiggin
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15 Aug 2011, 9:19 pm

simon_says wrote:
Polygamy is fine with me but it will take another generation or three to legalize it.

But with 70% of the under 35 crowd in favor of gay marriage, that debate is all but won. It's been decoupled from the other social issues and won over the Independents and the young.


Exactly. For several years if not decades, it was, in American political discourse at least, always coupled with other issues, and referred to by social neo-conservatives as abortionandgaymarriage.


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Kraichgauer
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15 Aug 2011, 9:20 pm

pandabear wrote:
Inuyasha wrote:
pandabear wrote:
Reminds me of a quote from the iconic 1967 movie Guess Who's Coming to Dinner?


Who conducted the poll?

What poll?


Inuyasha wrote:
Maybe it is time we start filming (and I don't mean a fictional story line) a documentary how gay groups are advocating discrimination towards Christians.


I look forward to watching it. Are you going to play the role of the drag queen?

What type of discrimination are gay groups advocating towards Christians?


Oh, probably those gays who won't roll over and die for the religious right. You know, really terrible discrimination.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



Inuyasha
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15 Aug 2011, 9:22 pm

pandabear wrote:
Inuyasha wrote:
pandabear wrote:
Reminds me of a quote from the iconic 1967 movie Guess Who's Coming to Dinner?


Who conducted the poll?

What poll?


The one simon_says is apparently quoting...

pandabear wrote:
Inuyasha wrote:
Maybe it is time we start filming (and I don't mean a fictional story line) a documentary how gay groups are advocating discrimination towards Christians.


I look forward to watching it. Are you going to play the role of the drag queen?

What type of discrimination are gay groups advocating towards Christians?


Any other stupid statements...

In all seriousness, most supporters of the defense of marriage act, are doing so because they are fed up with the homosexual community trampling on their rights. Marriage is a religious issue, not a secular one. If you want to call something between two people a civil union fine, but to call it marriage is essentially mocking the religious community. While I know you don't take issue with that, because you seem to act as though you think discrimination towards Christians is okay, you are effectively trampling over people's rights as badly or worse than you are accusing religious people of doing.



AceOfSpades
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15 Aug 2011, 9:22 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:
pandabear wrote:
Inuyasha wrote:
pandabear wrote:
Reminds me of a quote from the iconic 1967 movie Guess Who's Coming to Dinner?


Who conducted the poll?

What poll?


Inuyasha wrote:
Maybe it is time we start filming (and I don't mean a fictional story line) a documentary how gay groups are advocating discrimination towards Christians.


I look forward to watching it. Are you going to play the role of the drag queen?

What type of discrimination are gay groups advocating towards Christians?


Oh, probably those gays who won't roll over and die for the religious right. You know, really terrible discrimination.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
How dare those fags demand equal rights and recognition of said rights.



simon_says
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15 Aug 2011, 9:24 pm

Gallup. I posted it earlier.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/147662/first ... riage.aspx



pandabear
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15 Aug 2011, 9:25 pm

The abortion issue was decided over a generation ago.

There is actually a negative relationship between homosexuality and abortion. If everyone were to take up homosexuality, then there would be no more abortions.

It is rather silly to be both anti-gay and anti-abortion.



Inuyasha
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15 Aug 2011, 9:25 pm

AceOfSpades wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
pandabear wrote:
Inuyasha wrote:
pandabear wrote:
Reminds me of a quote from the iconic 1967 movie Guess Who's Coming to Dinner?


Who conducted the poll?

What poll?


Inuyasha wrote:
Maybe it is time we start filming (and I don't mean a fictional story line) a documentary how gay groups are advocating discrimination towards Christians.


I look forward to watching it. Are you going to play the role of the drag queen?

What type of discrimination are gay groups advocating towards Christians?


Oh, probably those gays who won't roll over and die for the religious right. You know, really terrible discrimination.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
How dare those fags demand equal rights and recognition of said rights.


Last I checked Marriage was not simply a secular issue, it is a religious one. What's next force churches to marry gay couples in violation of the core principles of their religion. You can't start persecuting another group and call it equality.



AceOfSpades
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15 Aug 2011, 9:27 pm

Inuyasha wrote:
AceOfSpades wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
pandabear wrote:
Inuyasha wrote:
pandabear wrote:
Reminds me of a quote from the iconic 1967 movie Guess Who's Coming to Dinner?


Who conducted the poll?

What poll?


Inuyasha wrote:
Maybe it is time we start filming (and I don't mean a fictional story line) a documentary how gay groups are advocating discrimination towards Christians.


I look forward to watching it. Are you going to play the role of the drag queen?

What type of discrimination are gay groups advocating towards Christians?


Oh, probably those gays who won't roll over and die for the religious right. You know, really terrible discrimination.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
How dare those fags demand equal rights and recognition of said rights.


Last I checked Marriage was not simply a secular issue, it is a religious one. What's next force churches to marry gay couples in violation of the core principles of their religion. You can't start persecuting another group and call it equality.
I don't care about what Churches recognize as marriages within their own Churches, but outside of those institutions homosexuals should not have to settle for being separate but equal since that itself isn't equal. Quit strawmanning, I've already made this clear in my previous posts in this thread. They persecute against gays by forcing their institutional practices onto legislature.



Last edited by AceOfSpades on 15 Aug 2011, 9:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Inuyasha
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15 Aug 2011, 9:31 pm

AceOfSpades wrote:
Inuyasha wrote:
AceOfSpades wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
pandabear wrote:
Inuyasha wrote:
pandabear wrote:
Reminds me of a quote from the iconic 1967 movie Guess Who's Coming to Dinner?


Who conducted the poll?

What poll?


Inuyasha wrote:
Maybe it is time we start filming (and I don't mean a fictional story line) a documentary how gay groups are advocating discrimination towards Christians.


I look forward to watching it. Are you going to play the role of the drag queen?

What type of discrimination are gay groups advocating towards Christians?


Oh, probably those gays who won't roll over and die for the religious right. You know, really terrible discrimination.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
How dare those fags demand equal rights and recognition of said rights.


Last I checked Marriage was not simply a secular issue, it is a religious one. What's next force churches to marry gay couples in violation of the core principles of their religion. You can't start persecuting another group and call it equality.
I don't care about what Churches recognize as marriages within their own Churches, but outside of those Churches homosexuals should not have to settle for being separate but equal since that itself isn't equal. Quit strawmanning, I've already made this clear in my previous posts in this thread.


It's simple actually, call it a civil union from a secular standpoint as far as the state is concerned for both heterosexual and homosexual couples, and the term "marriage" refers to having undergone the church wedding.



pandabear
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15 Aug 2011, 9:34 pm

Inuyasha wrote:
pandabear wrote:
What type of discrimination are gay groups advocating towards Christians?


Any other stupid statements...

In all seriousness, most supporters of the defense of marriage act, are doing so because they are fed up with the homosexual community trampling on their rights. Marriage is a religious issue, not a secular one. If you want to call something between two people a civil union fine, but to call it marriage is essentially mocking the religious community. While I know you don't take issue with that, because you seem to act as though you think discrimination towards Christians is okay, you are effectively trampling over people's rights as badly or worse than you are accusing religious people of doing.


You never heard of the Bill of Rights?

If some people wish to mock a "religious community", they may. It is called "Freedom of Speech."

Marriage is not a "religious issue." Even atheists marry. Hindus, Mohammedans and Mormons also marry.

The Bill of Rights guarantees separation between Church and State.

You have yet to identify any instance of discrimination against Christians.



Inuyasha
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15 Aug 2011, 9:36 pm

pandabear wrote:
Inuyasha wrote:
pandabear wrote:
What type of discrimination are gay groups advocating towards Christians?


Any other stupid statements...

In all seriousness, most supporters of the defense of marriage act, are doing so because they are fed up with the homosexual community trampling on their rights. Marriage is a religious issue, not a secular one. If you want to call something between two people a civil union fine, but to call it marriage is essentially mocking the religious community. While I know you don't take issue with that, because you seem to act as though you think discrimination towards Christians is okay, you are effectively trampling over people's rights as badly or worse than you are accusing religious people of doing.


You never heard of the Bill of Rights?

If some people wish to mock a "religious community", they may. It is called "Freedom of Speech."

Marriage is not a "religious issue." Even atheists marry. Hindus, Mohammedans and Mormons also marry.

The Bill of Rights guarantees separation between Church and State.

You have yet to identify any instance of discrimination against Christians.


Bill of Rights works both ways, you do not have the right to order someone to marry a homosexual couple if they have religious objections over it.



Kraichgauer
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15 Aug 2011, 9:36 pm

Speaking as one who is married; the actual marriage is the legal marriage certificate from the courthouse. The member of the clergy who performs the marriage is actually just a witness who signs off on the document. So yes, marriage is actually a legal, civil contract, which can be incorporated with religion if the participants so choose it to be.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



AceOfSpades
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15 Aug 2011, 9:37 pm

Inuyasha wrote:
It's simple actually, call it a civil union from a secular standpoint as far as the state is concerned for both heterosexual and homosexual couples, and the term "marriage" refers to having undergone the church wedding.
A marriage between atheists isn't called a civil union, so why should homosexuals be separate but equal? And why should the institutional practices of Churches be forced onto legislature? Marriage in the eyes of the law is a legal contract.



simon_says
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15 Aug 2011, 9:48 pm

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Bill of Rights works both ways, you do not have the right to order someone to marry a homosexual couple if they have religious objections over it.


Some churches are already marrying gay couples. Wake up and smell the 21st century. You seem to be the one that wants to force people to follow your views.