Florida, where murder is legal

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I'm absolutely not interested in debating the crime rates of different countries. Every country reports crime statistics with (sometimes wildly) different criteria - so without spending quite a lot of time researching the differences in reporting methods and correcting for bias, you don't get a "clean" comparison.

Lets keep the discussion relevant to this particular case, and the applicable law.

Probably second degree murder, at most. The people who set up Neighborhood Watch particularly in a state like Florida where the dangers are really real, ought to have an air tight method of vetting the the participants and operative. People have a right to self defense, they have no right to be irresponsible.

ruveyn

The simple answer is, in the end, I don't think he will.

However, the situation is complicated by the fact police noted that Mr. Zimmerman was bleeding, and had grass stains on his back - that coupled with the witness interviews the police conducted, back up Mr. Zimmerman's statement that he and Trayvon were in a fist fight, Mr. Zimmerman was on his back, and had to shoot Trayvon to stop the attack. I believe all of that but the last bit.

He was absolutely justified, assuming those facts are true, to break concealment and draw his weapon - however he was not justified to point his weapon at Trayvon, or fire, unless Trayvon kept coming at him - which by all accounts doesn't appear to be the case.

Assuming that your post is in reply to mine, I was replying to Paulie_C's little rant about what a lawless country the U.S. is and how outdated our constitution is.
Whatever, though........

At this point I don't trust that the police wouldn't make false claims to protect their own asses.

Even if Zimmerman's story is correct, he was searching for Trayvon, attacked, and a 200+lb adult was losing a fight to a 140lb teenager. That's just sad. Then, half-man that he is, he killed someone rather than just have a fight that he went looking for. His ego couldnt handle a loss. And that's even assuming his version is correct. That's his best story.

They often sell these laws by describing cases where a weak woman has to defend herself but then you have men using it to justify shooting unarmed men. These guys are trying to prove something with a gun that they could never prove in the bedroom or with their fists.

according to wikipedia, Trayvon was 6'3" so he wasn't that small, Zimmerman is only 5'9". Zimmerman also claims that Martin attacked him from behind. I think if it went down the way Zimmerman said it did then he was justified in acting in self-defense.

I think Zimmerman should probably face trial since there is some evidence to suggest that he initiated the confrontation but I'm not sure he'd be convicted. Honestly the whole thing comes down to who was the person to scream out for help imo. Hopefully science or something can figure that out.

I find it pretty disturbing that people are acting like they know what happened that night to the point where they're advocating violence as well as the people that are trying to inflame racial tensions.

I'm sure that is your opinion. Yes. Sounds about right.

That response isn't condescending at all. You're such a contributor to this forum, what would we do without you.

If you have a problem with what I said, which quite frankly was pretty neutral on the matter, then post it. If not, shut up.

I gave my opinion.

Probably second degree murder, at most. The people who set up Neighborhood Watch particularly in a state like Florida where the dangers are really real, ought to have an air tight method of vetting the the participants and operative. People have a right to self defense, they have no right to be irresponsible.

ruveyn

New Jersey Self Defense Law

New Jersey Self defense exists when the defendant reasonably believes that such force is immediately necessary to protect himself against the use of unlawful force by another person on the present occasion.

The defendant’s honest belief in the necessity of using force is a requirement for the justification of self defense.

New Jersey self defense requires the defendant to have a reasonable belief about three subjects:

The force defendant is using must be immediately necessary – in other words the defendant must believe that the unlawful force will be used against him at the time that he acts;

the force used against the defendant must be unlawful – this defense is not available to the aggressor;

the amount of force which the defendant uses must be necessary – this defense is unavailable if the actor is unreasonable in his belief about the amount of force necessary and if acting on this unreasonable belief the actor uses an excessive amount of force.

The defense is unavailable if the defendant’s belief about any of these three subjects is unreasonable.

In determining whether the belief is unreasonable the trier of fact - Judge or Jury - must consider the particular facts of the case.

These would include the age, size and physical condition of the parties.

Other facts to be considered are threats made or prior altercations between the parties.

The trier of the fact can also consider the reputation for violence of the other party as it was known to the defendant.

The reasonableness of a defendant's belief is to be determined by the jury and not the defendant in light of the circumstance existing at the time of the offense.

If the defendants belief about the need to use force to protect himself is unreasonable then the defense of self defense is unavailable.

A victim's character is admissible to prove that the victim was the aggressor, so a victim's conviction of a violent crime may be admitted to establish that he or she was the aggressor.

Deadly force is justifiable only if the actor believes it to be necessary to protect himself against death or serious bodily injury.

There is a duty to retreat first.

New Jersey Self defense will be allowed as an excuse to a charge of unlawful possession of a firearm only in those circumstances where an individual arms himself to meet an “immediate” danger.

This guy wasn't part of any official neighborhood watch. He was acting on his own.

In Florida you can shoot someone because you feel threatened, even if they did nothing threatening, in other words, just because you feel like it.

So let me get this straight.

In Florida you can shoot someone because you feel threatened, even if they did nothing threatening, in other words, just because you feel like it. I can feel threatened by all sorts of stuff on a bad day. I guess you could expand that and say you feel threatened by rising taxes or disappearing healthcare, who do you get to shoot then?

I think if it went down the way Zimmerman said it did then he was justified in acting in self-defense.