"Flatten Gaza like Hiroshima"Israeli public figure

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While emotions are probably running high among the Israelis, I don't think they have anywhere near the same level of hate towards the Arabs.

If Israel did have that level of hatred, they wouldn't be trying to use smart munitions as much as they do in an attempt to minimize collateral damage (unfortunately when groups like Hamas deliberately put missile launchers where children are present, there are going to be child fatalities, which the blame should be placed on Hamas, not Israel).

In all honesty, I think the best way to end the Israeli/Palestinian conflict is for a third party to tick them both off to the point that they decide to both go after said third party. Probably would have to be Iran firing nukes which land in West Bank instead of Israel or alien invasion though. Other than that I don't see anything as far as peace happening anytime soon.

Israel Wants Peace
With the exception of a few extremists, the overwhelming majority of Israeli's would give back most of the land to the Palestinians for peace. Israel has even offered to give back 90% of the land, and twice, the Palestinians would accept nothing short of the full expulsion of the Jews from the holy land, despite never having owned a country in that area -- they've been ruled by the Romans, the Egyptians, the Ottomans, etc, but there has never ever been a Palestinian nation.

Israeli's would do anything for peace. Most of Israel is secular and non-religious, and the country as a whole is far more left of center then most European nations. So most of the Israeli population is not always on board with the whole situation that they have, but they have no choice considering the immense hate that exists in the middle east towards the Jews.


Arab Hate
The hate is not mutual. Palestine is not Israel's moral equivalent. All palestinians want the Jews dead. With the exception of a few racist and hateful Jews who make up 5% of the population? Israeli's don't want anyone dead, because they are a culture of Life. Arab hatred towards the Jews is even theological. They accept Christians, but feel that Jews corrupted the text. They say Ishmael is Abraham's rightful heir despite being a late(r) bloomer to the religious scene by almost 4000 years? They don't acknowledge that they came from us, through Isaac. That and religious beliefs regarding the Jews, paired with taking muslim holy land and giving it to a non-muslim entity helps fuel a lot of this, and this doesn't even scratch the surface of their anti-semitism.


What Could Be...
If it were up to the Jews, the Middle East would be a thriving intellectual force not seen since the heydays of the Ottomans, and Egyptians. Islam will not only again have a relevant say in the human conversation, but will again pioneer the sciences, the arts, culture, and so on. In addition to the Emirates, the great cities of Alexandria, Damascus, Cairo, and Istanbul can be amazing engines of growth for the world, and a place where Christians and atheists would feel at home in. That is what could be and a beautiful vision that will never come to fruition if the Left continues to tolerate the primitive state of the Middle East. We have to support the westernization of the middle east if we believe that any of our accomplishments have any meaning, be it womens rights to a secular state, or not stoning gays.

Genius!

not to shat on your point or anything -- I have entertained that myself, I personally think it would solve a lot of things too, my only fear is that the only thing it would do is give them appreciation of the herb, while keeping all of their views much like the Ethiopian Zion Coptic Church US sect of the 70's.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHIyjfXVWnc[/youtube]

I tried to ready the Cambridge History of Islam once, but it was all about disputes and factions with regard to the descendants of Abraham. I'm not a big believer in defining your life by religious teachings, so I gave it up.


I hate my brother, but my brother's enemy is my enemy. This could work. But who will be the unfortunate third party?



I think you are right here, but I don't think Israel is going about it the right way. You have to respect your opponent even if you find his ways distasteful.


Thank you!

@MarketAndChurch
Loved the vintage Dan Rather (especially the guy blowing smoke in his face.) I think Brother Gordon is a poor representative of marijuana consumers. He seems to be more interested in securing his own status as leader and making a profit from it. And I found the tenets he extolled to be completely contrary to my own beliefs.

I know where you are coming from Ann2011, but the honest truth is that I only respect an opponent who I consider an equal. The left-winger to me is an equal, a KKK'er or a hispanic gang banger I do not hold as an equal and wish jailed or shot.

I do not respect those who stone gays, or stone "disobedient" women, or stone whores who were deemed whores because they were raped. I do not respect people who cannot respect that others may disagree with them, or people who do not extend rights to those who do not belong to their own group. If we are to progress as a species, we must fight this hate, by violence if necessary, because it is too deeply rooted to simply wish away with logic and reason. Talking to them won't do a thing.

The problems with the middle east is much deeper then Israel... the hatred of Israel is just the physical manifestation of their clanism, familism, and blood-based society. If we cannot deal with those three impediments to leaving the stone age, there is no hope for this part of the world.

It depends though. I don't think you can really change anyone's opinions by simply beating them up, and I don't advocate any sort of violence on people who haven't threatened any in return. For those people like Hamas, though, you'll never ever get peace with people like that. They want victory and destruction and they will kill themselves (and glory in it) and kill others mercilessly until they are wiped out. Much like Hitler would have done. These sorts of people you cannot reason with, so the only option is destroying them.

Thats because with the exception of Egypt, the 'first wave' was mainly pro American. Any revolutions provoked by Israeli activities will go the other way.

Have you played Conflict: Middle East Politics Simulator?

I don't respect those acts either.



It is a tricky situation. It seems that the people in question are living with beliefs that would be more appropriate to an earlier time. But still, they exist in our time and can't be dismissed. They may not have the modern weaponry of Israel, but they are still a force. If the region is to move forward, then their claims need to be respected. Israel finds itself thrown into the lion's den. This is a lot to ask of a newly formed nation. Patience and respect are crucial to move forward. Israel has the bigger stick; how it uses it will define how the nation is viewed by the international community.

Unfortunately, we have a nation of people who celebrate the act, and glorify martyr's as an example for their children to follow.

I do have great sympathy for palestinians who did not choose this existence, and want nothing to do with Hamas, but I also do believe in collective guilt. Having a nation of mothers and fathers who tolerate children being brainwashed with hate to be sent to blow up as many people, indiscriminately, all share a sense of collective guilt. The deaths of innocents only applies to children, but if you tolerate evil and are consumed by it, that is no one else's fault but your own.

I am reminded of the story of Lot in the bible. It is the Lot syndrome and it is in all of us to tolerate a bad situation and not want to leave it. You can either vote with your feet, or die in the name of liberty, but Palestinians for the most part are perfectly comfortable with doing neither.

Hitler also believed in collective guilt.

I remember one of my early int'l relations professor describing the islamic nations as being 'stuck in the middle ages yet armed with modern weaponry'. The sad thing is that every piece of news that comes out of said region just keeps proving him right.

Personally I do not see why Israel bothers to try diplomatic solutions. Its the same travesty as dealing with north korea.

Id say nuke Gaza with about 10 nukes that should shut them up and if the rest of the hostile middle eastern countries have a problem like Palistine and Iran nuke them as well and make them glow in the dark theres nothing but sand and goat droppings there anyway!

Because otherwise the Western media holds them up to be the epitome of modern evil. They don't want to give themselves any excuses to be portrayed like that if they can possibly help it, whilst taking care of their security objectives.

What Israel needs to do is invest in genetic research. If they could create a camel-immunovirus and a goat-immunovirus that can be transmitted back and forth between humans and livestock, then Israel's most immediate problem would solve itself in a couple decades!