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Dox47
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02 Jan 2015, 12:13 am

cathylynn wrote:
reality has a well-known liberal bias. stephen colbert



Clever...


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Dox47
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02 Jan 2015, 12:15 am

cathylynn wrote:
one simple example of bias: the only women it quotes are pro-gamergaters.


And? IIRC, the articles (there are 3, not sure which one you're talking about) were primarily about exploring the Gamergater's side of things, so absent something more obvious...


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cathylynn
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02 Jan 2015, 12:34 am

Dox47 wrote:
cathylynn wrote:
one simple example of bias: the only women it quotes are pro-gamergaters.


And? IIRC, the articles (there are 3, not sure which one you're talking about) were primarily about exploring the Gamergater's side of things, so absent something more obvious...



and choosing to explore that side of things is not biased how?



Dox47
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02 Jan 2015, 12:46 am

cathylynn wrote:
and choosing to explore that side of things is not biased how?


So you define "bias" as "exploring the side of things you disagree with"? Thanks for clearing that up, it explains a lot.

Also, I believe that's check and mate, thanks for playing.


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02 Jan 2015, 2:37 am

I cannot comprehend why so many people here care about it...sounds like a drama filled, useless website one of those sites that could be described as the a**hole of the internet except probably even less useful than that particular body part actually.


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Dox47
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02 Jan 2015, 3:27 am

Sweetleaf wrote:
I cannot comprehend why so many people here care about it...sounds like a drama filled, useless website one of those sites that could be described as the a**hole of the internet except probably even less useful than that particular body part actually.


I wouldn't even have known about it if I hadn't seen the whole thing being weaponized by people I don't particularly like anyway, causing me to take a look and realize that, like most things, it's more complex than was being advertised.

The whole Zoe Quinn thing really was BS, but you have to look at it sorta like the Mike Brown shooting in Ferguson; tensions had already been running high in the gaming community, and where some people saw a smoking gun confirming all their worst fears about the industry, others saw a non-story being hyped up to push an agenda (please, audience, spare me the overheated rhetoric about comparing a online drama to a shooting, it's an analogy). Like I said earlier, I could care less about the sexual escapades of game developers and the journalists who cover them (though it would be amusingly hypocritical if Quinn really did consider infidelity rape, than go on to serially engage in it), but I do care about the injection of politics into game development, since I don't want the industry to go the way of the famously mono-political movie industry, or certain segments of the publishing industry.


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02 Jan 2015, 10:37 am

andrethemoogle wrote:
Except these immature little s**ts are focusing ALL of their attacks on women in gaming and technology. If you're defending their vile threats, you're no better than them.


andrethemoogle wrote:
So you're defending these fuckwits that threaten to murder and rape women? If you are, you're in the same boat of vileness that they are.


andrethemoogle wrote:
Also, don't you ever f*****g dare accuse me of supporting rape ever again, do I make myself clear?


Because it's only noble and just when you do it, right? You embody everything that is wrong with liberal extremism. In the words of the immortal Walrus of Love, "practice what you preach".

Dox47 wrote:
I do care about the injection of politics into game development, since I don't want the industry to go the way of the famously mono-political movie industry, or certain segments of the publishing industry.


This and then some. Though the growth of the independent scene will likely stifle any effects of political leaning on the industry as a whole.



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02 Jan 2015, 3:57 pm

adifferentname wrote:
In the words of the immortal Walrus of Love, "practice what you preach".

I don't remember saying that!



cathylynn
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02 Jan 2015, 4:03 pm

Dox47 wrote:
cathylynn wrote:
and choosing to explore that side of things is not biased how?


So you define "bias" as "exploring the side of things you disagree with"? Thanks for clearing that up, it explains a lot.

Also, I believe that's check and mate, thanks for playing.



choosing to cover only one side of a story invites claims of bias. no reputable news organization does this.



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02 Jan 2015, 4:22 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
I cannot comprehend why so many people here care about it...sounds like a drama filled, useless website one of those sites that could be described as the a**hole of the internet except probably even less useful than that particular body part actually.


It is rather apathy-inspiring.



adifferentname
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02 Jan 2015, 9:46 pm

The_Walrus wrote:
I don't remember saying that!


You must have been drunk!

cathylynn wrote:
choosing to cover only one side of a story invites claims of bias. no reputable news organization does this.


:lol:

Which reputable news organisations do you suggest then?



mr_bigmouth_502
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03 Jan 2015, 1:13 am

Gamergate is stupid; it's a whole bunch of mudslinging over something that doesn't even matter in the big picture. So a female game developer slept with a game reviewer to get a good score on her game. Big f*****g deal, video game reviews have always been questionable, especially when it comes to AAA games and first-party releases.

The real issue is that a bunch of idiots decided to post rape and death threats to this developer's Twitter page. That's just not cool. People need to realize that what they say online CAN actually have real world implications, and that sending someone threats over the internet is just as bad as screaming those same threats in their face. It wouldn't matter if this person was male or female, no one deserves to be harassed constantly like what some of the Gamergaters did with Zoe Quinn.

As well, I hate how all of the rabid SJWs decided to use this as an excuse to bash gamers and gaming culture as a whole. Most gamers don't harass people online. Some of the a**holes that harassed this person were gamers, but they didn't harass her because they were gamers, they harassed her because they were a bunch of a**holes.

TL;DR: Gaming journalism has been corrupt for years, and I don't give a s**t about it. I just think the SJWs and Gamergaters are making fools of themselves.



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04 Jan 2015, 9:43 am

Dox47 wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
I cannot comprehend why so many people here care about it...sounds like a drama filled, useless website one of those sites that could be described as the a**hole of the internet except probably even less useful than that particular body part actually.


I wouldn't even have known about it if I hadn't seen the whole thing being weaponized by people I don't particularly like anyway, causing me to take a look and realize that, like most things, it's more complex than was being advertised.

The whole Zoe Quinn thing really was BS, but you have to look at it sorta like the Mike Brown shooting in Ferguson; tensions had already been running high in the gaming community, and where some people saw a smoking gun confirming all their worst fears about the industry, others saw a non-story being hyped up to push an agenda (please, audience, spare me the overheated rhetoric about comparing a online drama to a shooting, it's an analogy). Like I said earlier, I could care less about the sexual escapades of game developers and the journalists who cover them (though it would be amusingly hypocritical if Quinn really did consider infidelity rape, than go on to serially engage in it), but I do care about the injection of politics into game development, since I don't want the industry to go the way of the famously mono-political movie industry, or certain segments of the publishing industry.


What tensions have been going on before the Zoe Quinn issue?



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04 Jan 2015, 12:04 pm

Jono wrote:
What tensions have been going on before the Zoe Quinn issue?


Injection of politics into the review process mostly, plus anger at people like Sarkeesian who misrepresent the gaming community in order to push their agenda. There's also the long standing suspicion that the review system is rigged, so you can see how the Quinn allegations pushed a lot of buttons at once, and brought a number of long standing grievances forward as well. Quinn may have been the spark that touched off the explosion, but the volatile atmosphere had been building for some time.


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Jono
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04 Jan 2015, 1:39 pm

Dox47 wrote:
Jono wrote:
What tensions have been going on before the Zoe Quinn issue?


Injection of politics into the review process mostly, plus anger at people like Sarkeesian who misrepresent the gaming community in order to push their agenda. There's also the long standing suspicion that the review system is rigged, so you can see how the Quinn allegations pushed a lot of buttons at once, and brought a number of long standing grievances forward as well. Quinn may have been the spark that touched off the explosion, but the volatile atmosphere had been building for some time.


Well, first of all, all types of media get similar types of criticism like the feminist criticism that Sarkeesian give. There is also feminist criticism of movies, TV shows etc, so why should games be different? From my perspective, I didn't see Sarkeesian as saying that games are all sexist nor is she really trying to censor anything in games as so many people suggested. As a gamer myself, I think that games can only get better if they became more inclusive towards women.

With regards to people giving bad reviews to games simply because one aspect of appeared sexist without giving a balanced review based on all other aspects, such as gameplay, story etc, yes I get irritated with that too. Then again, if they're doing that, they aren't very good reviewers anyway, are they?



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04 Jan 2015, 3:19 pm

Jono wrote:
Dox47 wrote:
Jono wrote:
What tensions have been going on before the Zoe Quinn issue?


Injection of politics into the review process mostly, plus anger at people like Sarkeesian who misrepresent the gaming community in order to push their agenda. There's also the long standing suspicion that the review system is rigged, so you can see how the Quinn allegations pushed a lot of buttons at once, and brought a number of long standing grievances forward as well. Quinn may have been the spark that touched off the explosion, but the volatile atmosphere had been building for some time.


Well, first of all, all types of media get similar types of criticism like the feminist criticism that Sarkeesian give. There is also feminist criticism of movies, TV shows etc, so why should games be different? From my perspective, I didn't see Sarkeesian as saying that games are all sexist nor is she really trying to censor anything in games as so many people suggested. As a gamer myself, I think that games can only get better if they became more inclusive towards women.

With regards to people giving bad reviews to games simply because one aspect of appeared sexist without giving a balanced review based on all other aspects, such as gameplay, story etc, yes I get irritated with that too. Then again, if they're doing that, they aren't very good reviewers anyway, are they?


Sarkeesian lies in her videos and makes up stuff about video games such as Hitman. She said that video games caused violence in one of her video claiming it as fact where as no studies have shown this.

Mobile games already carter to women is that not good enough? Why does everything have to be inclusive to someone? Can't games just focus on making the best game possible rather than being bogged down by focusing on irrelevant issues.