Jihad is it right or wrong?

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Jihad merely means struggle. Greenspan, the Republican who chaired the US money system for decades, just made it clear that the real struggle is over oil. Fundamentalists of all religions are being manipulated by the people that are locked in an East-West battle for oil. Inciting their passion and intolerance is a small price to pay if it means possession of more black goo. People are not so willing to die for corporate profits or meglomaniac princes, but convince them that God, Country and Honor are at stake, and they willingly sacrifice themselves.

The attacks on New York and DC were quite effective - they made the American public so angry and afraid that they lost their ability to think rationally, so desperate to affirm their group identity that they stopped questioning their own leaders and democracy was paralyzed. Which led to the imperial (vice) presidency and ...

The US invasion of Iraq, which has done more to benefit the recruiting capabilities of the violent fundamentalists than they could have hoped from the 9-11 attacks. Formerly secular Sunnis have embraced 'Al Qaeda in Iraq.' Shiites have created militias and are inspired by Khomeni styled fundamentalist nonsense. The average person in the Middle East that used to look somewhat favorably at the US now sees it as a source of deception, violence and incompetence.

And the spiral of stupidity and violence will probably continue downward, because the prize is so great. We can't break out of this dynamic if we buy into the "We are good, they are evil" BS that some people on both sides are pushing. Most people are reasonable and decent regardless of what day of the week they worship.

Your mis-characterization of what jihad is doesn't help anyone understand the world. The idea that all Muslims are religiously bound to wear suicide belts is about as accurate as the old stereotypes that all Jews are Christ-killers and well poisoners.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kVXJaqcoC7k[/youtube]

Yeah, seen it, I don't think that your repeated invoking of the video counters what I said. Our situation is better described as a struggle between Islamofascism and Petrofascism, not as Islamofascism against the world. I also think that the jingoistic use of words like jihad and the statements against all Islam seen in this thread also do a disservice to anyone that wants to understand what is really going on.

I think if you actually read the Quran, which format itself is a WAR POEM, you might change your tune.

I've never heard of that. What is the format of a "War poem?" Verses arranged from longest to shortest?

Sorry, Penguin, you are the one that should change your tune. I have read both the Old Testament and Koran, and can tell you that both glorify war in various passages and have God smoting the enemies of the righteous. But there is no ignoring the fact that both books are considerably more complex - they lay out religious laws, prescribe rituals for worship, describe the attributes of God, etc. etc.

People that are haters can latch on to passages in any of the world's scriptures and use them to justify their hate. Doesn't mean that all followers of that religion are haters.

Jews and Christians are considered 'people of the book' in the Koran ... part of the covenant between God and Abraham. They are not marked for slaughter, but for protection.

And whose scripture says "Suffer not a witch to live"? Isn't that sanctioning the murder of people who choose another religion??

Last edited by monty on 18 Sep 2007, 1:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Judaism isn't fundamentally about conversion by the sword though. Most of the conflict was done in Joshua's day and the rest was just retaking their land from the Moabites, Philistines, and Etc. not about global conquest for Allah.

Yeah, and most of the passages that supposedly allow all Muslims to kill non-believers refer to a specific period when Muhmanned was driven out of and reconquering Mecca from the evil unbelievers, who weren't Christian or Jewish.

Suffer Not a Witch To Live!

Show the references that show their genocide is suppose to stop at some point in time. Also show how the Iranian, Palestinian, Arabian, Iraqi, and so forth television station that are sponsored by their respective governments promote Jihad against Israel, Europe, America, Africa, Asia, etc. How come those government run stations don't have your same view of Jihad?

Well, it seems to say a lot of contridictory things, making it easy to pick and choose to support one's position.

Surah 2, 256 reads: "There is no compulsion in religion".

Clearly, this states a principle against forced conversion. Which isn't to say that some Muslims (or Christians, or Hindus, etc) haven't resorted to the practice from time to time to win converts.

[2.62] Surely those who believe, and those who are Jews, and the Christians, and the Sabians, whoever believes in Allah and the Last day and does good, they shall have their reward from their Lord, and there is no fear for them, nor shall they grieve.

Muslims, Jews and Christians are recognized as worshiping the same God of Abraham (different spelling, but even the Jews use different terms to refer to god depending on circumstances/linguistics - Yahweh, Jehovah, Ha-Shem, etc while Christians dropped the name of god and call god by his function, not name). It also recognizes that Christians and Jews that lead a good life will be judged favorably by God.

Wrong, like all religiously fuelled violence.

Glad to know that.

Why you are so glad?

If the original meaning of Jihad was that, then is wrong, if that was not, then it would have been misused. Although I don't know much of it, I don't want to make a judgement without knowing enough of it.

Last edited by greenblue on 18 Sep 2007, 3:37 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Should someone be killed for voicing their opinion and what they think of a religion? NO.
They have their right to voice their own opinion and beliefs, in the same way that religious people should be able to voice their opinions without being harmed.

However, inciting religious, racial, or political hatred from any side should result in a prison sentence. It disturbs the peace and stirrs up hatred, which may result in violence.