Is there any proof God exists?

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The speech bubbles are Just ENHANCED free association IN A THETA BRAIN WAVE WAY TRANCE LIKE DANCE IN BETWEEN WAKING AND DREAM STATE to BLOOM overall creativity.

Interestingly, "The Beatles" use many kinds of random cultural artifacts in their creative free association process from circus flyers to occult leaning text and 'we' all Know NOW how that workS for them, OVERALL.. QUITE WELL.. i MIGHT ADD.

The thing about free association and metaphors, in general, is people, the consumers of the original free associated ART FORM FROM CREATION ACTIVITY IN CREATIVE ART MIND can AND DO find 'their' own meaning in the ART, whether or not intended by the creator of those FREE associations and metaphors in ART or not.

GOD is ART to me.

me to ART is GOD.



OH!.. and this is one of my favorites from the Beatles..



'Mr. KITE'...

And amusingly so.. i kinda look like the statue in the ground
of the funeral art on the Album cover..

Particularly when one magnifies it bigger...

JUST A random statue from the home of John Lennon..

IS all that IS...

Yes.. reality is

so much stranger

and mysterious...

than fiction alone..

as again all is ALLONE..

And as Mark Twain states..

IN PARAPHRASE HERE..

REALITY AIN'T GOTTA MAKE SENSE!

And OH god! I'm glad i am no longer

'made of stone' with no heArt..

sOul.. or spirIt flow....

stONe

or noT...

AND YES.. MY ULTIMATE 'DREAM
IN REALITY' IS TO BE COMPARED
TO THAT
STATUE....

BY someONE else...

A better compliment to me than the comparison of others to

GOD, Jesus, Buddha, Yoda, or Superman....

But perhaps i am the ONLY one WHO can make that comparison.....

AS although 'we' are ALLONE WE ARE ALL UNIQUE TOO.. ASonE..aLone...

So in other words, 'WE' ARE ALL THAT STATUE alone as ALLONE.

BUT not likely 'The BEATLES' PER metaphor intended that metaphor OR NOT..

"And of course Henry the Horse.. 'dances the walk'..."..

And yes.. there are a 'few' other folks who suggest 'The Beatles' are 'Prophets'.. as pArt of 'some' kind of 'Ultimate Truth'..

http://www.truthcontest.com/entries/the-present-with-religion/beatles-prophets.html

AS yes, 'we' 'Alone' are ALL in a realITy that is Tapestry ALLONE and NOT 'sense' alone...

I don't mind being the statue either.

I think prophet is a strong word, i don't know of any prophet.

I don't know what the ultimate truth is other than to try to be happy with oneself

Yes.. and that's precisely my interpretation of 'The Statue'..

A journey within... with or with out help from others..

Wow I think gods after me no lie there is some serious lighting outside my window, I'm not religious but that's just spooky, I take it back lol

SynchroniCiTy.. A LanguAge of GOD..

SoMe folKs cAll 'IT' 'GOD wInks'..

OtHer folks calL iT...

A perSonAl relaTionShip WitH


GOD.

Yes I understand, I'm willing to go along with it, lol that was so strange, I think I am going to stop talking about god for the time being. lol

!

So you are saying that every single one of us who is not choosing for God, wants to go to an eternity of pain? You believe that my disbelief means I want that unending torment?

I believe in judging a tree by its fruit.

But that's beside the point. Why do people choose immediate gratification over long-term benefits? I can understand people in chronic pain becoming addicted to prescription painkillers and narcotics. It's a little more difficult for me to comprehend how someone who knows what meth or heroin does to people would willingly experiment with it to the point they'd acquire an addiction. But they do, and they destroy themselves in the process. Or poor people who keep applying for credit cards. Rich people ask "how much?" and pay in cash. Poor people ask "What's the down payment, how much a month?" and then can't figure out why they're broke all the time (I should add that I'm in a family of 5, household income less than $30k, two kids in private school, and we're comfortable. Not many people in our situation can make that claim, at least not many I'm aware of).

People DO choose instant gratification to long-term detriment. So why is choosing eternal torment after living a life rejecting God really such a surprise to anyone? Do you really believe it's unthinkable? You're basically describing yourself, after all.

No, I'm not describing myself... you're attempting to describe me... and failing.
I'm old-school... delayed gratification... as in, want it, then save for it.
And my choice of belief has taken several decades of learning and thought. Nothing instant there.
But do go on. You made a big post about instant gratification to answer a simple question.

Do you believe that all of us who are not choosing your god, are wanting eternal suffering?
That's the argument you are buying into here.

I'm not buying into any argument. I'm trying to answer a question, and I believe it's a question you already know the answer to.

Do I think drug addicts want rotten teeth, fried brains, disease, etc.? No. And I don't think you want the consequences of living eternally apart from God any more than drug addicts want to destroy themselves. So why do it?

Obviously, I know why drug addicts stay on drugs…fear of withdrawal. But if you know that's coming, why experiment with addictive hard drugs in the first place? You know withdrawal will make you sick. You know you have to take more drugs to fend it off. And you know that pattern will eventually kill you. So why start in the first place?

No, I don't think you WANT eternal torment. But you aren't afraid of it enough to change your cognitive behavior any more than an addict is afraid of self-destruction enough to get off drugs. You know it's coming, but you've spent years in thought and study rationalizing it away. I think I can reasonably assume you're getting what you want out of this world and not all that concerned about the next one.

Think Pascal's Wager, with a slight twist: If you're wrong and you lose everything, is the kind of God who would commend your soul to eternal torment really the kind of God you'd want to spend eternity with, anyway?

Interesting answer. It contradicts Sophisticated's belief, but hey, perhaps you didn't notice that.

If you're going for 'fear' being any kind of motivation, let alone a prime motivation, then it's not a good one. During several decades as a Christian, fear was not what kept me there. But it is one of the things that made it difficult to leave. My thinking eventually came to this: I no longer believe, but can I take the risk? It's a pathetic position to be in, and anyone who has been in it may have some empathy for that. Eventually, you decide that integrity is what matters. If you can no longer reconcile what you once believed with the way your knowledge and understanding has evolved, then staying in is just faking it. That's where Pascal is wrong. If your heart and mind aren't in it, you can't just mouth the words and expect to escape the fire. The New Testament is pretty clear on that.

Pascal's wager makes no sense to anyone who believes in integrity.

Nor is it a case of "knowing it is coming." It would be completely irrational and also a lack of integrity, to "know" somethings is coming and not try to avoid it. I don't buy into irrational things and I hold integrity high (if you hadn't already guessed )

And sticking with the same theme, a person who "rationalizes something away," has to have a reason to want to do so. Why would I, having invested nearly 4 decades in my faith, and having no need or desire to skirt around it, wish to rationalize it away? What is my motivation? I tell you that my only motivation is/was truth.

Early in my Christian life, I studied theology and I learned how deeply people can be conned by dogma. I wanted the knowledge part of my faith to be based on proper theology. I spent time with Catholics and Pentecostals, Baptists and Lutherans, Presbyterians and Anglicans, and several others. Each had conflicting dogmas, and half of them don't believe the other half are 'saved.' I read Paul getting pissed at the Corinthians. "Some say I am of Paul, and some say I am of Apollos. Has Christ been divided?" I felt the same way! So I quested for truth. I wanted my faith to be based on "meat," on what I learned, not on the "milk" I being was fed. I wanted my faith to be on solid ground, not washed away like the house built on sand.

Yet to hear the way you and Soph talk... you do not respect that quest, turning it into some sordid rationalized escape, motivated by the some negative need to evade of God.

But then... I remember when I was a Christian. I was so convinced of my faith that I was similarly dismissive. And you really do have to be dismissive, because the alternative is to allow for the possibility that you could be wrong.

^^^

When i think of GOD i think of life.. all of life.. and all of inanimate life...

When i think of GOD i experience life in emotion and senses that connect me to the environment of Nature...

In fact.. i do not have to think of GOD to experience GOD...@ALL.

How fortunate am i to walk so many miles of desolate beaches in youth away from all of human culture.. just
me and sun.. sand.. waves.. sea oats.. seagulls and emerald green gulf...

And somewhere along the line i no longer need a rocket scientist or priest to understand that this GOD that is all around me.. above and so below is inside me and outside me too.. and when i go and when all humans go off this earth.. if that beach or desert or mountain is still here.. or even those stars or even darkness.. GOD still lives in all of that with or without breath.. atoms.. light.. or even darkness....

So whenever I hear folks imagining a dead GOD that has no being that one can reach out.. touch and feel in the quartz of sand or the breast of woman.. or heat or blizzard winter of night or day.. i only think of THAT three letter word as idol.. and precisely what the myth of Jesus and Moses did not find in the 40 days of desert that is the same as beach to me....

i have my 40 days of 'Lent'.. almost 7 years ago.. starting in the beginning of March and ending before Easter when i give myself up for dead after 40 almost totally sleepless days and nights with 1 hour of sleep the first 35 of 40 that no sleeping pill will bring and only an alpha blocker will put me down for that 1 hour of each day sleep.. and then there is the last 5 of 40 with no sleep relief at all.. and the letting go of life for dead finally.. at the hospital....

Even through 5 long years of suffering after that.. after coming back to life at the hospital.. in metaphor of heavy Ativan injections that make sleep a possibility.. as well as life again.. in all the other illness suffering.. to live today.. for me NOW.. is to wonder still.. if i did die and go to heaven.. as i can not imagine any heaven better than now.. just to have the gift of life... AS IS NOW.

i understand why folks try to escape the real GOD and make an imaginary IDOL GOD in their mind...

i understand why folks who suffer in this world imagine another life in another world of heaven... someday other than now...

But i hope these people one day will just open their 'eyes' and 'see' the GOD of Mother Nature TRUE above.. so below.. all around.. inside and outside of their being too... and then maybe they too will know and live heaven now... like the myth of Jesus and Moses do.... in their beach of desert.. as well....

But until then.. imagination is real too.. and imagination is better than greater suffering.. any now of now.....

-whatever it takes.. the human motto for survival.. does still apply....always now.....

You gave up sleep for Lent??? I don't have trouble sleeping…just feeling rested when I wake up. It's never very satisfying and it's difficult to get up and get moving when the alarm goes off. I've been in some phase of writing music for about the last 3 weeks straight now, and I have the unusual pleasure of having 3 consecutive weekend gigs, not counting this orchestra of fellow church musicians I volunteer with…so I had two gigs this past weekend, and I didn't even fully recover from that before I'm back to composing. I'm homebound with kids today because we're covered in ice. Not a big deal all points north, but down here just 1/4 inch accumulation is crippling. So I'm waking up freezing cold every morning, which doesn't motivate me any MORE than I already am. But rested or not, I keep pressing forward.

I gave up food for 40 days and nights once. Not for Lent, but I did feel spiritually moved to do it. Once you get past the unpleasantness of the first two weeks, you stop feeling hungry. I alternated between feeling something like almost pure joy, like I could run a marathon, and at other times I could barely move. I felt more clearheaded and alert then than I ever have and had an overall improved feeling of well-being. I'd love to get that back some day. But I haven't felt led to do it again, and given how dangerous something like that can be, I wouldn't dare get back into it without the same intensive time of prayer beforehand. The only bad part towards the end was the lack of sodium and potassium catching up with me. I was unable to sleep because I felt like I was fighting for every last breath. I think knowing my 40 days were almost up had a little bit to do with it mentally, too, and I think that the effects of that final week were the most frightening. But I made it a full 40 days and nights. I put myself on a liquid diet after that, some 4-8 ounces of food, 3 meals a day to avoid refeeding, and over a period of several weeks my diet slowly went back to normal. I still don't eat nearly as much as I used to before I fasted. I still fast at least one day a week, sometimes more, and I'm interested in beginning daily intermittent fasting and potentially returning to a "pescetarian" diet.

I don't believe in ritualistic fasting as any kind of dogmatic thing. Some people do. For me, it's a way of living out "man does not live by bread alone." So I think deprivation of things you need is useful in growing spiritually. But I also think, ideally, you need more of a purpose if you're observing Lent, or you're fasting, or whatever, and I just can't seem to discipline myself to that level. If you're going without food, IDEALLY you should make whatever you would have reserved for yourself available to someone else who needs it. I get to eat every day if I want to. Some people don't know where their next meal is coming from, and they may go more days a week than I do without food. So why do I get to be selfish, knowing I could end my fast any time I want and be ok, and not give a meal to someone out there who is desperate for it? Every meal I skip might save a life. So for me, the struggle is overcoming this personal fault of mine, to say "well, when I skip meals, I'm saving my family money so my children can have more to eat." Sure, that's great…but is it really enough? It has great health and weight management effects, not to mention saves a lot of money. But if that's your only motivation, you've missed the point.

For now, the fact I feel guilty about it is something I take as a good sign. Perhaps I can just blame it on the AS, or social anxiety, or whatever my problem is, but there are certain kinds of actions I feel so strongly averse to that I'm constantly at a loss for dealing with doing things I feel I SHOULD do, but somehow just can't. Last year, I participated in a group that went door-to-door bringing bags of groceries in an impoverished neighborhood. So I think maybe by pounding some pavement I'm doing a little more good than I did, perhaps even getting used to it. And while I still don't feel it's enough, maybe just taking ONE step in that direction is better than none.

That was just a play on words and a coincidence that my insomnia happened during the period of Lent for exactly 40 days from the MARCH PERIOD OF 2008 and OH MY GOD my wife and I were counting everyday, minute, and second of that real literal human hell.

There are few tortures worse than THAT MUCH LACK OF SLEEP, if any at all. The record for going without sleep at all is 264 hours or 11 days.

I couldn't sleep for several reasons. One was Chronic Type Two Trigeminal Neuralgia PAIN LIKE A Dentist drilling my right eye and ear during all waking hours; Two was Dysautonomia where my autonomic nervous system was all out of whack to the point where if I fell asleep I would stop breathing; and three was Sjogren's Syndrome, where my eyes quit making tears almost all the way.

For the first 35 days no sleeping pills would put me down, and the doctor prescribed an Alpha blocker to slow my heart down as my adrenal glands were stuck in the on position, as part of the Dysautonomia, and with the drug I went into only a shallow sleep for less than an hour a day. For the last 5 days of 40, even the Alpha Blocker quit working.

A trip to the emergency room, and a heavy injection of Ativan was the only thing that finally brought relief of sleep, and according to my doctor I was close to having a potential life ending seizure, as that is what CAN AND DOES HAPPEN WHEN FOLKS GO anywhere close to that extreme of no sleep. The state of being at the end was an ice cold body with no perceptible feelings at all except for a burning indescribable pain all over my body worse than fire that increased every second of the last 5 days of no sleep like Dante's rings of hell, as it was like GOD showing me if you think this is bad just wait for the next second and you will see what REAL PAIN IS....

The PAIN was worse than anything imaginable.. even worse than the Trigeminal Neuralgia pain, burning with real fire, Fibromyalgia that I was already diagnosed with, too, and the feeling of swimming under salt water with one's eyes wide open, per not having any tears for eyes, where even that gel stuff for dry eyes didn't help that pain substantially. And no drug ever remediated the cranial nerve pain of Trigeminal Neuralgia.. after that.... until I naturally recovered WITH THE HELP OF GOD, IN JULY OF 2013.

FOR the next five years from 2008 to 2013, I had to take Ativan to have any possibility of sleep, and that in itself made me somewhat of a Zombie, after I had lost almost all my emotions to the pain, already.

Now I connect to GOD through a style of martial arts and ballet dance walk that is measured by Nike GPS sports watch at over 3000 miles, approaching 18 months now.

The dance puts me in a state of theta wave mind that is extremely connective to the holy spirit which is another metaphor for altered consciousness and greater connection to the much greater creative potential of the 'Quantum mind' UNLEASHED with GOD as a synergistic force, rather than the illusion of separation from GOD for humans who are in a Zoo of prison, per FUNCTIONALLY DISABLED deficits in physical intelligence, emotions, senses and all that combines in synergy to better connect WITH GOD.

Fasting works for some folks, meditation for others, and there are many others ways but 'TRANCE' dance is the best way for me to reach this Theta BRAIN wave between dream and awake lucid creative dreaming mind WITH GOD....ALLOWING the subconscious mind to create in an autonomous flowing way.. without the interference of logical planning thoughts.... AKA THE HOLY SPIRIT, Kundalini Awakening, CHI, QI, KI, and all the other cross cultural metaphors for THE NATURAL way of connecting to GOD, the Great Spirit of the American Indians, or whatever metaphor is used to describe the ACTION VERB OF GOD, NON-ANTHROPOMORPHIZED.

People who have not experienced this ALTERED WAY OF 'QUANTUM MIND' UNLEASHED TRULY HAVE no idea what they ARE MISSING IN LIFE, as this IS the same way our so-called Primitive 'uncivilized' ancestors connect to GOD FREE in sharing spirit with all others and the rest of Nature WITHOUT illusions of separation from GOD promoted by a mechanical cognition leaning robot 'WESTERNIZED' way of MATERIALISTIC COLLECTING things in an illusion of what life CAN BE IF PROPERLY PRACTICED without the 'sin' of away from GOD.

For those ancestors like the ones who do this now THERE IS NEVER EVER ANY QUESTION ABOUT GOD EXISTING CAUSE WHEN ONE DOES THIS GOD IS REAL.. AN ACTION VERB FORCE AND NO FRIGGING FAIRY TALE.

IT's JUST ABOUT CONTACT.. that's all.....WITH ALL...

NO WORDS EVEN NECESSARY..... OR SO-CALLED WORD.

And SURE IT'S LITERALLY IMPOSSIBLE to show this to someone or truly FULLY put it into words as it is an entirely sensory emotional experience that can truly only be approximated through poetic expression OF THE EXPERIENCE IT DOES bring in human awakened enlightened life.... yeah the TRUTH AND THE LIGHT.

Science can talk about it too, but science and the folks who stay in the 'left brained' Universe view.. simply don't have a CLUE ABOUT WHAT ANY OF THIS IS, as One must EXPERIENCE IT FIRST TO UNDERSTAND IT FULLY, and then THE LIGHTS COME ON, AND 'THEY' 'SAY'.. OH! NOW I GET IT. AHA!

YES.. THE TRUTH AND THE LIGHT AKA 'THE ALL SEEING EYE' OR EVEN ILLUMINATI PER THE RECORD OF JESUS' WORDS ON THE SAME TRUTH AND LIGHT if understood in metaphor instead of literally.



AND 'then' 'some material reductionist' will come and say that's just brain chemicals that make you FEEL LIKE YOU are connecting to GOD.

And then some 'bird' will come along and say that's just wings that makes birds fly.

And then some 'tick' will come along and say that's just blood that makes dogs run.

WELL, i've 'GOD' news for the naysayers.

Blood is not what makes dogs run, alone.

Wings are not what make birds fly, alone.

And brain chemicals are not what make humans connect to GOD, alone.

i mean DUH..

It takes practice.. practice.. practice.. to fly, run, and CONNECT TO GOD.

AND THAT'S just 'common sense', a so-called 'right brain' attribute..

The stuff other animals can take for granted never ever separated from GOD.

Culture and or Religion, overall, is the virus or the evil or the devil that takes human away from the rest of Mother Nature TRUE, aka GOD.

And that's just sad for the folks who CAN SEE THIS.

I WATCH "'EM" PASS ME BY EVERYDAY, in PUBLIC STORES AND STRAIGHT LINED SIDEWALKS, 'LIKE' 'NEO' flowing in GOLDEN SPIRAL movement in PHYSICAL/EMOTIONAL/SENSORY INTELLIGENCE seen all over GOD's creation, AND the other metaphors for 'THAT' per 'NEO'.

PEOPLE who understand this have been attempting to be 'THE SHEEPDOG' THAT BRINGS THE Light and TRUTH to the sheep, but truly that's the job of JOB.

And it takes a lot of JOBS to get that job DONE, LITERALLY REMEMBERED CORRECTLY, FOR CENTURIES....AS WELL...

IT'S 'JUST' A 'MATTER' OF 'WHO' WILL STEP UP AND 'JUST DO IT', like Nike says.....without words

..alone....

ALLONE IS THE WAY....



The REAL ILLUMINATI IS NOT A BODY ORGANIZED BY CORPORATE INTERESTS.

THE REAL ILLUMINATI IS NOT A BODY ORGANIZED BY CULTURE AND OR RELIGION.

THE REAL ILLUMINATI IS ORGANIZED BY HUMANS WORKING WITH GOD, AS SUPER SOLDIERS OF GOD.

THEY COME IN MANY COLORS, FLAVORS, AND WAYS......IN ONE 'BODY' OF 'CHRIST'.. as 'Just' one metaphor for THAT.

AND 'they' are STILL HERE NOW.

IN GROWING NUMBERS....

Can you recognize them...

IF SO.. YOU TOO

ARE POTENTIaLLy

one of ONE, OR WE, OR US, OR ME, OR YOU...