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ironpony
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04 Jul 2022, 6:46 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
IsabellaLinton wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
Call me crazy but that seems like a strong indicator that it's never had anything to do with any matters related to morality and was always motivated by a desire to control. :rendeer:


Call me crazy but boys and men should be thankful that they won't get stuck with 18+ years of child support, and they won't risk being accused of rape -- because their partner won't get pregnant.

Sounds like a win to me.


What I worry about is that the same people who are least respectful over a woman's right to control access to her flesh in one context are likely to turn out to also be the same people who are least respectful over a woman's right to control access to her flesh in other contexts.


This makes sense. What other interests would the law have to control women's flesh in other ways?



funeralxempire
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04 Jul 2022, 6:48 pm

ironpony wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
IsabellaLinton wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
Call me crazy but that seems like a strong indicator that it's never had anything to do with any matters related to morality and was always motivated by a desire to control. :rendeer:


Call me crazy but boys and men should be thankful that they won't get stuck with 18+ years of child support, and they won't risk being accused of rape -- because their partner won't get pregnant.

Sounds like a win to me.


What I worry about is that the same people who are least respectful over a woman's right to control access to her flesh in one context are likely to turn out to also be the same people who are least respectful over a woman's right to control access to her flesh in other contexts.


This makes sense. What other interests would the law have to control women's flesh in other ways?


I'm not assuming they'd use the law. I'm saying I wouldn't trust those people to not also being willing to impose non-consensual acts upon people they feel entitled to do so to.


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IsabellaLinton
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04 Jul 2022, 6:49 pm

ironpony wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
What I worry about is that the same people who are least respectful over a woman's right to control access to her flesh in one context are likely to turn out to also be the same people who are least respectful over a woman's right to control access to her flesh in other contexts.


This makes sense. What other interests would the law have to control women's flesh in other ways?


Honestly ironpony, how about you tell us?
Think about women's bodily rights, and the examples people have given on this thread or others.

Please make a list of which rights you think might be applicable.


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ironpony
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04 Jul 2022, 6:54 pm

I'm not sure really. I haven't heard of any other women's rights involving body or surgery, so I am not sure. I was just curious.



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04 Jul 2022, 6:56 pm

ironpony wrote:
I'm not sure really. I haven't heard of any other women's rights involving body or surgery, so I am not sure. I was just curious.


They could lighten up on the laws involving sexual assault, maybe get back to the good ol’ days when it was a-okay to rape one’s spouse.

Kicking all those creeps out of prison would save a lot of money.



IsabellaLinton
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04 Jul 2022, 7:01 pm

- sexual assault
- sex trafficking
- child abuse
- incest
- exploitation
- trans rights
- sex education
- LGBTQ rights
- adoption and surrogacy
- access to birth control
- Honour Killings
- assisted reproduction
- mandatory vaccinations
- shaming and bullying
- stalking
- objectification
- equal pay for equal work
- equal rights legislation (The Persons Law)
- single parenting
- child support enforcement
- abusive partners
- domestic violence
- medical and OBGYN care
- menstrual issues / products
- privacy rights
- media portrayals
- eating disorders
- maternity leave
- childcare
- post-partum depression
- women's mental health
- women with autism
- women's suicide

I hope this rings a few bells.

All of those topics involve a woman's body autonomy.


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ironpony
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04 Jul 2022, 7:09 pm

IsabellaLinton wrote:
- sexual assault
- sex trafficking
- child abuse
- incest
- exploitation
- trans rights
- sex education
- LGBTQ rights
- adoption and surrogacy
- access to birth control
- Honour Killings
- assisted reproduction
- mandatory vaccinations
- shaming and bullying
- stalking
- objectification
- equal pay for equal work
- equal rights legislation (The Persons Law)
- single parenting
- child support enforcement
- abusive partners
- domestic violence
- medical and OBGYN care
- menstrual issues / products
- privacy rights
- media portrayals
- eating disorders
- maternity leave
- childcare
- post-partum depression
- women's mental health
- women with autism
- women's suicide

I hope this rings a few bells.

All of those topics involve a woman's body autonomy.


Oh I see. It's just that when you said people wanting to control women's flesh, I didn't think things like equal pay for example, or some of these other things, were in that category.

But why would the government be interested in honor killings for example or access to birth control, or eating disorders?



TwilightPrincess
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04 Jul 2022, 7:14 pm

ironpony wrote:
IsabellaLinton wrote:
- sexual assault
- sex trafficking
- child abuse
- incest
- exploitation
- trans rights
- sex education
- LGBTQ rights
- adoption and surrogacy
- access to birth control
- Honour Killings
- assisted reproduction
- mandatory vaccinations
- shaming and bullying
- stalking
- objectification
- equal pay for equal work
- equal rights legislation (The Persons Law)
- single parenting
- child support enforcement
- abusive partners
- domestic violence
- medical and OBGYN care
- menstrual issues / products
- privacy rights
- media portrayals
- eating disorders
- maternity leave
- childcare
- post-partum depression
- women's mental health
- women with autism
- women's suicide

I hope this rings a few bells.

All of those topics involve a woman's body autonomy.


Oh I see. It's just that when you said people wanting to control women's flesh, I didn't think things like equal pay for example, or some of these other things, were in that category.

But why would the government be interested in honor killings for example or access to birth control, or eating disorders?


Think really hard about it.

Denying access to birth control is the next step up from denying abortion.

Some extreme fundamentalist groups think that taking brith control and having an abortion are the same thing. Some of these people try to get involved in politics.



IsabellaLinton
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04 Jul 2022, 7:17 pm

Equal pay relates to flesh because the woman's body goes to work every day.
They wake up, get out of bed, and drag themselves to jobs performing the same tasks as men.
Exhaustion, stress, and work-related injuries are just as injurious to women as men.
Probably more so, if the woman is smaller with less muscle mass and less power in the company.

Every instance of existence affects a person's "flesh", not just sexual things.
That includes their mental health and the expectations of how to be a woman.

I didn't say the government would be interested in Honour Killings.
I'm saying that if girls and women don't have access to sexual privacy, there will be more.

Some state governments are already suggesting girls / women shouldn't have sex education.
TwilightPrincess has given many examples of how girls / women are treated in some communities.
If they can't go to SCOTUS to have their human rights defended, they are at risk.

Eating disorders: It's like anything else. If the government decides not to educate or provide access to healthcare, it puts girls and women at risk. This is especially true when the government simultaneously promotes women as thin and healthy in all of their media campaigns.


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ironpony
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04 Jul 2022, 11:29 pm

Oh okay, I see.

But as far as the government wanting to go after birth control next, it just seems like a huge reach to me, because all the court did was interpret that the 14th amendment did not cover abortions. It just seems that like a reach how they would go from one to the other like that.

That's like saying that if gun control takes off, they will go after knives and baseball bats next, isn't it?



funeralxempire
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04 Jul 2022, 11:39 pm

ironpony wrote:
Oh okay, I see.

But as far as the government wanting to go after birth control next, it just seems like a huge reach to me, because all the court did was interpret that the 14th amendment did not cover abortions. It just seems that like a reach how they would go from one to the other like that.

That's like saying that if gun control takes off, they will go after knives and baseball bats next, isn't it?


Not really, because they're openly discussing it. I don't see Democrats working to go after baseball bats (and many states have laws regarding types of knives as well, Canada too fwiw).


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ironpony
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04 Jul 2022, 11:48 pm

Who is openly discussing it though, the supreme court?



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04 Jul 2022, 11:49 pm

They're already going after the morning-after pill which is the same as double-strength birth control pills.
Religious and right-wing groups are teaching abstinence as the only form of birth control.
Unfortunately if the girl gets pregnant, she's stuck with the consequence.
Boys aren't. They might not even be identified.


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ironpony
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04 Jul 2022, 11:53 pm

Oh I see. If the morning after pill falls under abortion and the supreme court is going after that, can they go after birth control pills or condoms though, if it does not count as abortion, if used before pregancy? For example abortion falls under the 14th amendment and that is how they went after that. But are their any amendments that condoms or birth control pills fall under, that they could use to go after them though?



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05 Jul 2022, 12:09 am

I suppose lawmakers can do whatever they choose.
I hope they wouldn't do that.
Anyone on the pill could take the whole package to stop implantation / cause a loss.
It's no different than handing girls / women a month worth of morning-after pills.

Condoms?
Religious groups already say it's a sin to masturbate even with a partner.
Oral sex and ejaculating outside the wife's body are a sin.

Who knows how crazy they'll get with this type of thinking.
Why would condoms be needed if all sexual activity was supposed to make babies?


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05 Jul 2022, 12:12 am

IsabellaLinton wrote:
I suppose lawmakers can do whatever they choose.
I hope they wouldn't do that.
Anyone on the pill could take the whole package to stop implantation / cause a loss.
It's no different than handing girls / women a month worth of morning-after pills.

Condoms?
Religious groups already say it's a sin to masturbate even with a partner.
Oral sex and ejaculating outside the wife's body are a sin.

Who knows how crazy they'll get with this type of thinking.
Why would condoms be needed if all sexual activity was supposed to make babies?


And if we don't smarten up, we'll be living back in the 18th century, even though it's the 21st!


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